Electric training collars

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I am going to pick one up next week to hopefully stop my lurhcer coursing the horses. (Friend is lending it to me).
Lurcher is steady to galloping sheep and cows but cannot resist the neds, and she caused my mare to jump out of her paddock last week and self exercise around the arable before she came home. Its now got far beyound a joke and I haven't been able to stop her any other way.
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Ummm...


I have two retired greyhounds. I've also got two hens. The only way the hens are still alive is because I have electric poultry fencing seperating the two. They both zapped themselves once the first time. One of them did it 24 hours later as had clearly forgotten 'hens bite' and since then the only time they've been zapped was a few weeks later when one had also 'forgotten' and got too close while sniffing the floor (wasn't even looking at the hens).

I haven't let them off the lead in the field yet but I'll be buying an electric collar and the minute they try chasing anything they'll get a zap.

It's that or they'll spend their lifetime only ever running in the menage. I can't see that this is cruel sorry. Sight hounds can see for over half a mile and accelerate to 40 miles an hour in a few seconds. I don't think theere's a chance of me catching them somehow!
 
No I don't believe they should be banned, however perhaps they should be modified.

I had one for 4 days; it had 3 options and worked by remote control. 1st option was a beeping sound, 2nd option was vibrate setting, 3rd option was zapping mode.

Last year my young dog (I guess she was just under a year old) was getting overly excited with all the horses around. At feeding times she would constantly jump up and try to bite them on the noses. She would also chase them in the field and almost was kicked and trampled many times. Regardless of the training she had had at this time, the moment the horses started to run or at feedtimes, the dog just had deaf ears to me.

I bought the collar, tried the beeping sound and fully believed that this would work. She is a clever shepherd dog so I had no doubts that the moment she heard the beeping she would stop......nope it didn't - she paid barely any attention to it.

So then hubby said he would be the guinea pig for the vibrate and zap settings to see what happened. I also tried it later on. The vibrate was like a cellphone. The zapping was a sort of tingle, certainly nothing like I imagined and certainly not painful in the slightest, just a little weird feeling. Husband tested it up to number 7, the collar went to number 10 if I remember correctly. Husband said that number 7 did not hurt either just a bit more intense.....certainly I did not see him fly across the room or even wince.

So I went about my business again with the dog fitted up with her collar. She paid not the slightlest bit of attention to the beeping, however the moment I used the vibrate setting, she stopped immediately! She did not cry or whine.....she just stopped and cocked her head like she had heard something. Every time for the next 4 days that I saw her go to do something to the horses, I immediately shouted NO to her, if she didn't respond by stopping then I shouted NO again, once again when she paid no heed I would push the vibrate setting and once again she would immediately stop! She did wear the collar through the day when she was out with me but I only recall ever actually having to buzz her on the first 2 days.

Incidently she does not nip the horses any more at feeding time - she never ever did it again after wearing her collar for those few days.

I have to say, I would have used it on zapp mode had she not responded though. She could seriously have injured the horses or become injured herself and I was just not prepared to take that risk.

As for keeping her away from the animals - not possible, she lives out and the horses are all in the pasture fields surrounding our house. It was something she needed to learn and she did, thankfully not at the hooves of some 1,000 lbs animal!
 
"she just stopped and cocked her head like she had heard something" ................LOL .........dogs do not stop doing something instinctive ( like chasing things if they are of a sight hound breed) simply because they have 'heard something strange !....they stop because the e-collar has either caused pain or fear...neither of which is acceptable !

Lets not decieve ourselves here, the reason that they are an effective detterent is because the dog associates the undesirable behaviour with pain or fear NOT because they get a mild tickle or buzzing sensation .............

why do you allow your young , untrained dog free access to the horses - can you not keep her safely enclosed when you are not there to supervise her ?
 
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If your dog doesn't leave stock alone, don't take it anywhere near to where sheep/cattle are kept...simple.

If your dog can do a simple re-call...that's your starting point.... it should also know the command "leave" . If not. Start now.

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I'm not saying my dogs can't.

I was talking hypothetically. A bit difficult to not take a working lurcher in fields with stock. When there is a problem, with a dog/child/horse e.t.c you don't avoid the problem, you cure it.
 
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Would it work on stock proofing? I personally doubt it...
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do you? have you tried it? every dog is different ofcourse.... some not quite so sharp as others....
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Yes, its worked on every dog he's used it on, with less than 5 zaps on all not even reaching number 4, a mere tickle, much nicer than a bullet up the a*se from the farmer.
 
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NO ! - the Kennel Club has actively campaigned to have them banned - and it will be illegal to use one after the animal welfare bill comes into force next April .....it is ( in my opinion) never right to train by inflicting fear or pain ....it may not feel like pain to you but if it was not painful for the dog why would it work ? ... there are effective kinder ways of teaching a reliable recall and to be frank if your dog is not safe around stock then he/she should be kept away from them either in an enclosed area or on the lead !

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Another avoiding the problem and not curing it. Thats where serious problems occur.
 
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LOL .........dogs do not stop doing something instinctive

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LOL!! Well sorry to disappoint you......but she did stop and cock her head and no it certainly wasn't in pain or fear as you would so like to believe.

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can you not keep her safely enclosed when you are not there to supervise her ?

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No. I live on a large farm - I choose for all of my dogs to have free access to outside at any time they so desire. I would never keep them locked away.
 
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can you not keep her safely enclosed when you are not there to supervise her ?

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No. I live on a large farm - I choose for all of my dogs to have free access to outside at any time they so desire. I would never keep them locked away.

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I'm glad to hear it Tia, dogs should be out, if there is a problem you don't ignore it or avoid it like some on here clearly would. You cure it.

I'm sure given the choice your dog would have preferred having a couple of zaps than spending her life chained up with 30mins/1hour off under supervision, and lets face it, even supervised a dog can still chase stock.
 
[quote/]do you? have you tried it? every dog is different ofcourse.... some not quite so sharp as others....
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Yes, its worked on every dog he's used it on, with less than 5 zaps on all not even reaching number 4, a mere tickle, much nicer than a bullet up the a*se from the farmer.

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hey-ho....wasn't talking about the fecking zappery doo-dah thing.... i was talking (earlier) about the good old juice bottle filled with stones larky... you remember now? THAT'S how i trained me wee sharp minded clever little heinz 57!!
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Cobnut, can you explain that method please. Well if it works on a heinz 57 it will probs work on most dogs, no offence meant, I know alot of very intelligent heinz 57's
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You get a Blue Peter badge for doing this....

Get an empty 500ml juice bottle (oasis, wider neck) put some small stones in the bottom about quarter full, replace lid....

when your dog is doing something bad, either on the lead, or off, or in your house or having a pee behind the sofa...etc give dog a loud resounding NO, couple with a shake of the bottle aimed at the dog, timing is of the essence, and so bottle must be at hand at all times.

My wee Heinz 57, used to bark consistently at noises behind my front door, two weeks later she was relaxed enough to let the noisy gits do what they want. Now my bottle has been made redundant... I keep it nearby as i board dogs, who bark at my cats...only took one dog two days to stop doing that. (i had him nearly a week) Have you heard of training keys? this is based on the same idea but is noiser, and cheaper.

when you out take your dog past a feild of sheep, on the lead at first but give it the option of "going for it" then pull them back and no & shake at the same time... it's basically a distraction tecnique.

good luck on this.
 
Thats sounds really good, I like the idea of using it on dogs who bark. A water gun works well for that too. I don't think the electric collar should be used for barking or jumping up e.t.c.

When I next have a naughty dog with sheep I'll try that before the collar. Fingers crossed!

Thanks again...by the way...I'm eagerly awaiting my Blue Peter badge
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I have to say I have an invisible fence round our garden and If I didn't my dog would have been put down by now.
She is a JRT - she does respect it and it has been our saviour
 
How do they actually work Severnmiles?
I have huge problems with my JRT's. They are renowned for running off and chasing things, especially at thise time of year. All summer we have had sheep in our fields and they havent batted an eyelid. Yesterday they were moved down the road, and the buggers know they are about to lamb (so cant run) and were straight down there.
The one will happily wear a muzzle/be tied up. The other wont move with a muzzle on, and wont go about his 'business' muzzled or tied up.
Really at my wits end. Im guessing these work by some sort of remote control, so wont really be effective? How big a job is putting one of the sensor fences up (big yard - lots of ways out)?
 
Ye, you'd need to be there to zap him/them, but if you take 20mins out to watch them and when they chase the sheep you should only have to zap them a few times and they'll be cured. OH uses one (obviously not as of April!) on his lurchers that are more difficult to stock proof, can't have a lurcher running through a field of young lambs thats not 110% with livestock.

I'm not sure about the sensor thing, I think it depends on the range on the sensor as how much it costs but one with a large range could do the job, you'd have to talk to the manufacturer.

JRT's are little s***s aren't they!
 
They are, no one is safe, the list so far reads.....
sheep
cats
chickens
carol singers
x 5346 delivery men
postman x6 a week
oil man
vet
farrier
fireplace bloke
decorators x2
x3 owners
....plus many more I cant remember.

Where do I get 2 of these collars?
 
In the right hands they are an extremely effective training aid. Why should a dog owner be on tender hooks each time he/she takes their dog to an area which is in close proximity to stock, I live in the countryside and quite simply if my dogs weren’t 100% stock proof they would get little exercise indeed, I simply refuse to avoid the issue and insist on stock proofing my dogs in the most humane method possible.
I have seen these collars in use and I am aware of two dogs that have had a stay of execution as a direct result of using them. Both dogs were relentless when near any stock, the owners of both dogs had tried their best to solve the matter, one had been told to attach the dogs check chain to one end of a 30yds length of webbing he then held on to the other end the dog was allowed to chase as usual but as he got to the end of the webbing he was brought to a sharp halt, not only was this cruel to the dog but nearly took the owners arm off from its socket. The second dog had actually been booked into the local vets for euthanasia, thankfully the vet being the wise man that he was suggested that the owner try an electric collar and suggested a person that could help, needless to say that the dog was sorted in a single afternoon. So I say again that in the right hands they are an effective tool and can sometimes be the difference between putting a dog down or sharing a long and pleasant life together, I know which I would choose.
 

You want an invisible fence
I live on a farm and my JRT has notched up at least 7 chickens includin a cockerel.
If you look in the back of H & H there are some advertised there.
As I said my JRT would have been put down by now if it wasn't for the invisible fence.
PM me if you want further info
 
The Association of Pet Dog Trainers Supports the Kennel Club Campaign to Ban Electric Shock Collars

Since the Kennel Club's calls for the sale and use of electric shock collars to be banned this will now come into force as part of the Animal Welfare Bill , Organisations including the RSPCA, Blue Cross and Dogs Trust too believe that the sale and use of the remote control electric shock collars should be outlawed as part of the forthcoming legislation because they compromise animal welfare.

What are electric shock collars and how do they work?
Electric shock collars can be controlled by anybody with no experience in training dogs to abuse and punish via a remote control. By pressing a button a painful shock is transmitted to the dog's neck via two large electric prongs - the settings on the control of one particular collar range from 0-100. Having tested the collar on the back of human volunteer's hands many concluded that setting 20 was painful and that 35 was practically unbearable. They also described the collars as "vicious", "barbaric" and even "sadist".

Why are the Kennel Club and the APDT leading the campaign against their sale and use?
The Kennel Club strongly believes that the use of remote control electric shock collars to train dogs is not only cruel, but also outdated and unnecessary.

While the marketing of shock collars can easily convince people that they are a fast cure-all to every problem, modern dog training has progressed a long way from the days when punishment was the most common method of teaching dogs - in the same way as education has progressed from caning children in schools. According to the APDT there is no behaviour or training problem in dogs that is best dealt with by delivering an electric shock into a dog's neck. The APDT addresses all problems by using up-to-date reward-based training methods and responsible dog ownership - following its motto of "kind, fair and effective". Such methods of training include basic recall and clicker training.

The APDT and the Kennel Club further recognise that not only are these collars inhumane, but that teaching a dog to respond out of fear and pain rather than a natural willingness to obey fails to address underlying behavioural problems and can give rise to far more serious problems. To illustrate, since a dog will not know where the painful shock has come from it is more likely to associate it with something in its immediate environment than with its behaviour at that time. This is why cases of dogs attacking other dogs, their owner or another animal close by at the time of the shock occur. The dog may also develop 'superstitious' fears to things in the environment (such as birds, wind and grass) that were heard or seen at the time of the shock.
 
ALL DEPENDS ON THE PROBLEM!!!
IF IT MEANS THE DIFFERENCE OF A DOG BEING CURED OF SERIOUS PROBLEM THAT MAY END UP IN IT BEING DESTROYED I.E KILLING STOCK ANIMALS, OR SERIOUS AGGRESION PROBS, WHERE A SPRAY COLLAR WONT MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE THEN YES!!! IN THE HANDS OF A PROFESSIONAL DOG HANDLER THEY R OK!!! MY FRIENDS COLLI KEPT RUNNING OF AND KILLING SHEEP, THE ELECTRIC COLLAR WORKED A TREAT!!! I ALSO GAVE THE TRAINER PERMITION TO TEST IT ON ME AND I AGREE THEY R NOT AS BAD AS AN ELECTRIC FENCE!!!!! AND JUST AS A HORSES LEARN TO STAY OF THE FENCE AFTER A FEW SHOCKS, THE DOG LEARNS TO RESPON TO COMMAND AFTER A FEW SHOCKS!!! THESE COLLARS SHOULD BE REGED AND LISCENCED TO PROFESSIONALS ONLY!!!!
 
I have an electric collar and personally I think its more of a life saver. My dog is very very self willed and although he is trained very well (without the collar) he sometimes chases deer on MY land. I dont even need to "zap him", all I need is a warning beep and he now comes straight back. Before I got this collar I lost him for 10 minutes (he is only 11 months old) whilst walking in the thick january fog we had. Another time he ran straight onto a main road after running after deer. Now someone please tell me that they would rather their dog get run over than being "beeped" round the neck??

Since having the collar he hasnt run off once and after the inital "zap", he responds to a warning "beep" straight away and I havent had to "zap" him since
 
i would NEVER use one ever, they are not the same as electric fencing for cattel, sheep, horses etc. When a human choose to press the button to give the dog an electric shock i think that human is very callous and either ignorant or very very cruel, far better ways of training.
 
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