EQUINE TRANSPORT INDUSTRY UNDER THREAT

My mercedes has 3 seats..driver and 2 passenger.

Driver and passenger by window have had seat belts removed...middle seat has a lap belt and anyone who travels in that seat must wear it.

I think its a case of "if its there it has to be used" kind of thing.

TBH i'd like to get all the seat belts refitted but time and cost are the issues at the moment. Also i only use the lorry once a week at the most in the winter months. Maybe when spring arrives i'll get them sorted.
 
If this does not get sorted out in the magistrates court then I can see it going to crown court for a definition which would then set a precidence

Magistrates ruling cannot set a legal precidence - that has to be crown court

If the OP loses the magistrates court case then it is going to start getting expensive to appeal it in the crown court - is the OP prepared for that cost ?

If the OP wins in the magistrates court then the police/CPS have the option to appeal it in the crown court

This could get very interesting and messy
 
I winder why they pulled you over. My guess is that rather than the teens sitting quietly in the back they drew attention to themselves somehow by either being out of their seats or waving/gesturing at other drivers

If you want to take the risk draw the curtains next time!

I doubt it would occur to a police officer to randomly pull you over for that otherwise

Sorry to sound cynical!
 
I watched a Police program last week where they pulled an old type van over because they'd seen that the passenger had no seatbelt, but when they'd ran a check, they let them go, because the van was above a certain age that didn't require a seatbelt.
 
OP do you have legal representation? It would be sensible to get some well before the hearing. I can recommend a road traffic law specialist in your area is you need someone.
 
WelshD said:
I winder why they pulled you over. My guess is that rather than the teens sitting quietly in the back they drew attention to themselves somehow by either being out of their seats or waving/gesturing at other drivers

If you want to take the risk draw the curtains next time!

I doubt it would occur to a police officer to randomly pull you over for that otherwise

Sorry to sound cynical!
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Those thoughts crossed my mind as well

I wonder if they are prosecuting for 'not having apropriate seating' or for 'allowing passengers to be put in danger when they were not behaving correctly'
 
The police are sometimes not clear about what the law is I was "done" for speeding in my 7.5 ton lorry doing 45 mph on an A road .
 
If the lorry doesn't need seatbelts then it doesn't.

I notice the OP doesn't use wording that indicates what the actual charge is

If it's purely seatbelts then a check of the vehicle age would clear that up at the roadside surely?
 
After reading all the posts it sounds to me that your lorry has three seats in the front with no seat belts, and full living in the rear, also with no seat belts. Is this the case abergavennymaria ?
 
The OP has posted exactly what she has been charged with:

" I used a motor vehicle carrying a number of passengers, in a manner likely to cause danger, contrary to section 40 a of the R.T.A 1988 and Schedule 2 of the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988".

As I stated in my original post on this subject, that piece of legislation is of a 'catch all' nature and covers many things; haynets on sides or rear of vehicles, sat nav in incorrect position, loose body panels, missing rear view mirrors, protruding bodywork etc etc. it could even cover a missing diesel tank cap where fuel is observed to be leaking from the filler spout, motorcyclists have a particular problem with diesel spilt on the road surface. In this instance the Prosecution alleged that carrying passengers in the rear area of the box is likely to be a danger to those passengers as belts are not fitted.

Don't think that the 'conduct' of the passengers is the problem. Enforcement Agencies do 'target' horseboxes as there are often legislation infringements; C&U, Drivers Hours, O-Licensing, Overloading and Driver Licensing. This one was possibly a 'last item on the list' as the box and driver cleared all the other hurdles.

The case is not about whether the front seats (driver and passenger) had or did not have belts fitted. Whether the vehicle would need belts fitted and of what type would be covered by Construction and Use legislation. The case is regarding carrying passengers in the living area of the box where no seatbelts are fitted and there is no legal requirement to have them fitted, irrespective of the vehicles' age.
 
GeeBee45 said:
The OP has posted exactly what she has been charged with:

" I used a motor vehicle carrying a number of passengers, in a manner likely to cause danger, contrary to section 40 a of the R.T.A 1988 and Schedule 2 of the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988".

The case is regarding carrying passengers in the living area of the box where no seatbelts are fitted and there is no legal requirement to have them fitted, irrespective of the vehicles' age.
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In that case I fail to see how it can be sorted in a magistrates court because it requires a clear and defined interpretation of that law

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/40A
 
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Sorry to be pedantic but either the OP is clever with wording or has been unclear

Their post says under what act they are being charged and that the police said they should have seatbelts

They didn't say that's why they are ending up in court

If seatbelts aren't needed and they'd pointed this out at the time it would have been clear cut that's all I'm saying
 
I have to say, I agree with WelshD (sorry on phone so can't quote) about the reasons for being pulled over. It crossed my mind that the passengers in the living compartment must have drawn attention to themselves in some way or for some other completely seperate reason, which he then came across the other passengers - how else would he have known?? I've certainly never thought about others in a horse box except this in the front

I have no idea about thd law re: seatbelts (only that you have to wear one) but honestly thought it was against the law to be carrying passengers anywhere but in correct designated places :/
 
After attending several meetings on seatbelts and type approval for ,seats rear of driver, with various seatbelt manufactures, testing people, VOSA, to mention a few , just fitting seatbelts might sound the obvious simple solution, BUT it may not, as there are possible implication as far as the mounting/anchourage fitting type of seat and so on! if u or some one fitted a seat belt/lap belt and something happened (god forbid)as the seatbelt / seat etc has not been type approved or tested who is going to get the blame????? the vehicle owner? or the person who fitted it? As mentioned in a previous post extensive and costly testing would need to be done , is the end customer prepared to pay ???? I could keep going, PM me if you wish
 
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