Escaped stallion

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Rowreach said:
I’m also interested to know who among us has £3k lying around in spare change that they can pop into the farm shop and buy cattle handling systems.
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I think the original suggestion was to borrow one seeing as OP’s friends dad is a farmer and most likely has connections or to buy and then sell on afterwards.
 
Is there a grown up involved anywhere in this fiasco?

You can send all the videos you like to whoever you like, but given that the mare's owner initially only called the vet out purely to get the mare injected tells me all I need to know about the priorities of both owners.

Certainly needs some shots been fired somewhere but not at any horses involved.🙄
 
marmalade76 said:
Really? I know someone who uses a rifle to shoot foxes, I don't think he has to close the road or get the authorities involved to do it.
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You can't shoot over public rights of way, you can't shoot in certain areas with other animals present.

The best bet would be to dart it and then shoot once it's on the floor.
 
Serve the abandonment notice, then once the horse is darte/sedated you can have it PTS. It will belong to the field owner so perfectly legally and I think morally ok as this horse is going to hurt himself or someone else and its not fair on him.

If you think the horse may get on the road you have to tell the police so the road can be shut and they can be involved. They don't mess about with this sort of thing. Your friends parents may not be happy, but if there's an accident then everyone will be very much less happy. If you are certain that the horse cannot and will not get onto the road then get an adult to make a judgement call on that. An adult needs to carry responsibility for that decision and anything that follows.

Then get on facebook and get help from a farmer. It will cost money, but at this stage everything will. As a few people have said, get a chute set up going into a crush. Its how they catch actual wild horses. As soon as he's in the crush sedate, hope it works, then bring him out and PTS. Do not remove the mare until that's done to try and keep him calm to give the sedative chance to work. I'm assuming that the stuff they use in darts works better than sedalin type stuff so will still work even if he wound up.

Even if the owner does catch him there's a good chance he will get away from her. If she thinks she is going to catch him and walk him off then you must get the police to close the road as that is a huge danger point.

Get the gelding out now and get him in the other field. Theres no reason for the stallion to jump in after him, and it might save his life. The stallion shouldn't care about the gelding being removed, but be very careful and aware of whats going on around.

There is no good ending for this poor stallion, he's been completely let down. And your friend/her parents need to take some definitive action.
 
Amymay Again said:
Sod that. Get the horses out of the field immediately (I can't believe this hasn't been done already). The fate of the stallion is not your concern.
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This. Exactly this. This is utterly ridiculous. Get the horses out IMMEDIATELY. I would have done this in the middle of the night if necessary and sod the stallion to be perfectly frank. If he gets out he gets out. If they need a marksman to shoot him, that’s what needs to be done.

If this is real, this is utterly ridiculous and I’m appalled that those poor horses are just being left like this. Unbelievable.
 
Abandonment notice needs to be posted for 96hrs. Good practice is to inform the police in case of any confrontation. I'd have infor.ed the police already tbh as I'd be confrontational by now.

Steve youngs isn't a bad shout. I've seen him rope feral horses. Whether he would put him self at risk in this situation I'm not sure, but he might have contacts that could help.

Vets can't advise anything that may put humans in danger. For example when B colicked they wouldn't confirm I should handle him in any way - unless it was save to do so. Hence why they aren't recommending separating.
 
Rowreach said:
I’m also interested to know who among us has £3k lying around in spare change that they can pop into the farm shop and buy cattle handling systems.
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I said borrow OR buy. I don't know their financial situation or how they handle their farm expenses so I don't suppose to know what they can and can't afford.

Borrowing might take a bit longer but wouldn't cost much (I would offer to pay something or cover transport). And you'll note I've put that first.

Buying would present an immediate solution and might suit be completely reasonable from an expense situation, depending on how they run the farm.

Sadly, £3k is not really that much on the scale of farming costs. Farming comes with so many unavoidable high overheads hence farmers don't tend to make a lot of money. I had a tractor accidentally take down a sunk, concreted gate post and with a farm gate on one side and a pedestrian gate on the other, and I wasn't far off spending that just to be able to close my field again. Things happen on farms, and things cost. I promise you I'm not being frivolous or flippant with the OP.
 
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Mrs. Jingle said:
Is there a grown up involved anywhere in this fiasco?

You can send all the videos you like to whoever you like, but given that the mare's owner initially only called the vet out purely to get the mare injected tells me all I need to know about the priorities of both owners.

Certainly needs some shots been fired somewhere but not at any horses involved.🙄
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excellent post Mrs J and to my mind I am still in school holiday territory. :D

we have a new poster, a farm in Wales. Most farming in Wales I would guess is animals not crops and yet there appear to be no buildings or animal handling systems.
A video could show anything and I would be seriously upset if something sent a video of my horses to a total stranger over the internet without asking permission.

a poster who doesn't really seem to know what is going on and why the delay. A farmer who is letting a strange animal belonging to a stranger on his fields seemingly indefinitely. Never met that sort of farmer before. It is usually a case of pick of the phone at the first instance and ask for removal.
A vet with a marksman so easily available.

a stallion who is wild/feral. You don't even dream of getting a headcollar on a feral stallion in an open field or even a stable. It takes a lot of work to get to that stage. This doesn't seem to be a feral stallion more one who is having a good time and won't be caught. (and yes that would be a dangerous one)

I would suggest this is either a "story" or alternatively it has actually happened and the grown ups are getting it sorted but simply haven't included OP in the full story.

LadyGascoyne said:
Buying would present an immediate solution and might suit be completely reasonable from an expense situation, depending on how they run the farm.
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You have driven them (some of them) into the pen. I doubt a 14h stallion is going to be confined in there, he will be straight over if he is as wild as has been suggested

however you have lets say got him in the pen, got the others out of the way and he still hasn't broken out either jumped or smashed it to pieces what is your next move. What are you going to do with him? No one seems to be answering that. Capturing is easy it is the next part that isn't.
 
paddy555 said:
excellent post Mrs J and to my mind I am still in school holiday territory. :D

we have a new poster, a farm in Wales. Most farming in Wales I would guess is animals not crops and yet there appear to be no buildings or animal handling systems.
A video could show anything and I would be seriously upset if something sent a video of my horses to a total stranger over the internet without asking permission.

a poster who doesn't really seem to know what is going on and why the delay. A farmer who is letting a strange animal belonging to a stranger on his fields seemingly indefinitely. Never met that sort of farmer before. It is usually a case of pick of the phone at the first instance and ask for removal.
A vet with a marksman so easily available.

a stallion who is wild/feral. You don't even dream of getting a headcollar on a feral stallion in an open field or even a stable. It takes a lot of work to get to that stage. This doesn't seem to be a feral stallion more one who is having a good time and won't be caught. (and yes that would be a dangerous one)

I would suggest this is either a "story" or alternatively it has actually happened and the grown ups are getting it sorted but simply haven't included OP in the full story.


You have driven them (some of them) into the pen. I doubt a 14h stallion is going to be confined in there, he will be straight over if he is as wild as has been suggested

however you have lets say got him in the pen, got the others out of the way and he still hasn't broken out either jumped or smashed it to pieces what is your next move. What are you going to do with him? No one seems to be answering that. Capturing is easy it is the next part that isn't.
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I did, and I'd have a crush not a pen. Sedate and PTS. It's horrible for all concerned but the safest option.

I am absolutely horrified that people are still saying take the horses out and risk a horse in a very distressed state being loose on a 60mph road. How would you live with yourself if a car filled with a young family came round the corner, hit the horse, crashed their car and died all because you wanted your horses out and it was the easiest way in your mind?!
 
paddy555 said:
You have driven them (some of them) into the pen. I doubt a 14h stallion is going to be confined in there, he will be straight over if he is as wild as has been suggested

however you have lets say got him in the pen, got the others out of the way and he still hasn't broken out either jumped or smashed it to pieces what is your next move. What are you going to do with him? No one seems to be answering that. Capturing is easy it is the next part that isn't.
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I haven't really commented because I haven't seen the horse myself.

In all likelihood, I would

- herd it to separate it using the chute and pen. I don't think it will jump out if only separated by bars but of course it's possible.
- swap mare and gelding for the owners other geldings, separated but next to each other. Move my own horses off site.
- instruct owner that she is to care for them now, and to remove them. Request permission to pts.
- If refused, issue formal notice to remove in 14 days, with my horses safely elsewhere, and inform police
- have it shot after day 14 if it is still there

ETA, ID is right with the crush idea - that would be good if they can manage it.
 
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paddy555 said:
You have driven them (some of them) into the pen. I doubt a 14h stallion is going to be confined in there, he will be straight over if he is as wild as has been suggested

however you have lets say got him in the pen, got the others out of the way and he still hasn't broken out either jumped or smashed it to pieces what is your next move. What are you going to do with him? No one seems to be answering that. Capturing is easy it is the next part that isn't.
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Id be setting the pen up as close to the opening stallion created and driving him back through by any means necessary. Then shifting my two double quick as far away as I needed even if that meant livery while neighbours evicted tenants and medical treatment sorted for my horses.
 
I'm Dun said:
I did, and I'd have a crush not a pen. Sedate and PTS. It's horrible for all concerned but the safest option.

I am absolutely horrified that people are still saying take the horses out and risk a horse in a very distressed state being loose on a 60mph road. How would you live with yourself if a car filled with a young family came round the corner, hit the horse, crashed their car and died all because you wanted your horses out and it was the easiest way in your mind?!
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I think it's because it sounds like a bit of an excuse, given the horse is already jumping fences and could quite easily jump out onto that road two fields away right now if it chose to.

I would secure it using pens and bring company to lessen the chance of it escaping towards the road but it doesn't sound like the horse's field is immediately on the road and it's clearly come from home which is also adjacent. I wouldn't halt all rescue operations immediately just because there is a road a few fields away.

It just seems like worrying about a road two fields away - that the horse could reasonably access right now if it chose to - isn't the crocodile closest to the canoe.
 
@poppetpony
You have already done more than you need to, if you're just a fellow tenant.
It would be safer for all concerned to leave it to the experts. There are 2 horse owners, a farmer and a vets' practise involved. You can be certain they have come across difficult situations before & they will have a much better idea what to do than strangers on-line who don't know the lay of the land.

I think the main thing for you to be doing is to move your sheep somewhere else. They are on a farm with no sheds or handling facilities.
What breed are they? Will you be gearing up for lambing soon?
 
paddy555 said:
excellent post Mrs J and to my mind I am still in school holiday territory. :D

we have a new poster, a farm in Wales. Most farming in Wales I would guess is animals not crops and yet there appear to be no buildings or animal handling systems.
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There are more barns than people in Wales. Even houses that are not farms have barns. It could be that the barns are in a state of disrepair (also very common in Wales).
 
poppetpony said:
As regards an update..not very good.
Spoke to my friend and the owner has been in contact with her parents and basically said she can't do anything until Monday as she can't catch the stallion and that's the soonest she could get help to transport him.
The vets are coming back Monday with someone who can legally dart but they don't think that will be an option as unsafe to get close enough. They will also bring someone who can shoot to kill but obviously my friends horses need to be out of the way.
She did manage to get in with them yesterday when the vets where there with the neighbours and some family members and they have been checked by the vet quickly while they kept the stallion away but it for too dangerous and he charged straight through everyone.
The field they are in at the moment is a long straight field with 2 gates. One opens on to one other field ..where my sheep are currently with a gate on to the main road. The other opens on to the farm track opening out on to a blind bend on a 60mph road.
I don't know what sort of farm everyone is imagining but there are no barns or outbuildings. It's basically a farm house in the middle of some fields with a camp site. Other than a few sheep and my friends 2 horses they haven't had anything on the farm for years so fencing isn't adequate to contain a stallion who can jump over 5ft.
As for the stallion he's probably 14.2/15 hh maybe. Owner has said she's had him for 10 years and he's never behaved like this before. However the neighbours said they took pity on her and the 5 other horses she's got as no where else would take her on. Either way she can't catch him and is sacred to handle him herself.
My friend did say if the stallion isn't removed then the option is to shoot him but then the owner went crazy and threatened all sorts..police .legal action ect.

I did suggest to my friend about boxing hers up and removing them but she said without a lot of brave people there's no safe way to extract him from the mare without risking him jumping out and onto the road and she won't risk that. The thought of him charging out on to the road and someone getting killed isn't worth it.
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If the horse gets into a public place / the highway / is potentially a risk or threat to the wider public, a police marksman will take it down. Very recently a deer from the moors got into the suburbs, onto a main road and altho did no damage at all, was shot as a precautionary measure because it would have been far more risky to try trapping it.
Apparently police marksmen are not un-averse to such situations, which allow live practice, altho animal rights people were up in arms.
 
Exasperated said:
If the horse gets into a public place / the highway / is potentially a risk or threat to the wider public, a police marksman will take it down. Very recently a deer from the moors got into the suburbs, onto a main road and altho did no damage at all, was shot as a precautionary measure because it would have been far more risky to try trapping it.
Apparently police marksmen are not un-averse to such situations, which allow live practice, altho animal rights people were up in arms.
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True I sat with a deer on the side of the road not so long ago after it had been hit by a car. Police arrived, made a 50m exclusion zone and despatched the deer. The zone didn't exclude livestock.
 
LadyGascoyne said:
I would secure it using pens and bring company to lessen the chance of it escaping towards the road but it doesn't sound like the horse's field is immediately on the road and it's clearly come from home which is also adjacent. I wouldn't halt all rescue operations immediately just because there is a road a few fields away.

It just seems like worrying about a road two fields away - that the horse could reasonably access right now if it chose to - isn't the crocodile closest to the canoe.
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Its not accessing it as its with the mare, once they take her away and presumably down that road as its the only way out I think, then he's going to go onto the road.
 
I'm Dun said:
Its not accessing it as its with the mare, once they take her away and presumably down that road as its the only way out I think, then he's going to go onto the road.
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If they load up in the field, with the stallion in a pen, and the other geldings next to him, and they drive off, he is more likely to stay with his mates than follow a trailer.
 
Archangel said:
There are more barns than people in Wales. Even houses that are not farms have barns. It could be that the barns are in a state of disrepair (also very common in Wales).
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Well that’s true, it’s certainly not the Home Counties, all block-paved drives and electric gates, but like Eire, there are plenty of livestock farmers in the Welsh countryside.
And father is showing remarkable restraint for a Welsh farmer, generally at the first sign of unruly animals they’re straight in - where angels might have thought twice about it - and laying down the law. Doesn’t he have neighbours with handling gear, even if elderly or frail himself?
The alternative is going to be throw in plenty of hay and allow the three of them to sort out their own pecking order, which they will do if allowed long enough, but won’t be pretty and does risk permanent damage to at least one of them.
 
LadyGascoyne said:
I haven't really commented because I haven't seen the horse myself.

In all likelihood, I would

- herd it to separate it using the chute and pen. I don't think it will jump out if only separated by bars but of course it's possible.
- swap mare and gelding for the owners other geldings, separated but next to each other.
- instruct owner that she is to care for them now, and to remove them. Request permission to pts.
- issue formal notice to remove in 14 days, with my horses safely elsewhere, and inform police
- have it shot on day 14 if it is still there

ETA, ID is right with the crush idea - that would be good if they can manage it.
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I agree bringing the others in to keep him calm would be a good idea.

day 14 you PTS 6 horses or you have the hassle of trying to sell some to recoup costs. Other scenario is owner says thanks for the free grazing and moves them back to the grazing she was previously renting. :D:D:D

sadly still back to the situation that it is the owner that needs shooting not the horse.:rolleyes:

Exasperated said:
If the horse gets into a public place / the highway / is potentially a risk or threat to the wider public, a police marksman will take it down. Very recently a deer from the moors got into the suburbs, onto a main road and altho did no damage at all, was shot as a precautionary measure because it would have been far more risky to try trapping it.
Apparently police marksmen are not un-averse to such situations, which allow live practice, altho animal rights people were up in arms.
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but it's not. It is simply (if it exists) a neighbouring animal that has got into the next farm's field and the problem is what to do with it once it is caught.
We have endless deer, apparently wild boar now, sheep, ponies and cattle on our roads. Some get hit by cars and killed. No doubt some drivers get hurt when they hit them. Some of them have a lot of fast traffic despite the speed limit, many deer get killed on our main roads by traffic.

my interaction with the police and animals has been poor. We have a very busy roundabout in a neighbouring market town. Always lorries going round it plus other traffic. A traveller (in the nicest sense) parked her gypsy caravan on the grass by the side of it and turned her 2 (beautifully kept and in immaculate condition) horses loose on the grass around the edge of this roundabout separating them from the traffic by a single strand of live electric fence.
I was concerned about the risk to the horses. It would not have taken them long to get onto the Devon expressway but the immediate roads were busy enough.. They behaved OK but it was only going to take some idiot to move a piece of fence.

I was next to the police in the queue at the local garage and mentioned and explained (in very great detal) this could be dangerous and a vehicle driver could get seriously injured with a loose horse on the roads. I was told they would do nothing. They would only react when some incident had taken place, they would not take any action to prevent what could have been the death of a driver (or horse)
 
poppetpony said:
As I said..I'd be happy to send video evidence that this is a real situation to a trusted member who can then vouch for me
My friends primary concern is no human gets hurt trying to sort this. As much as she is concerned for her horses she will not risk him getting on to the road.
Stallion owner wants her horse and went nuts when shooting was suggested but can apparently only arrange this on Monday.
Not good enough IMO but it's not my horses or my land so it's not my call.
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You can send to me. I wouldn’t share x
 
paddy555 said:
I agree bringing the others in to keep him calm would be a good idea.

day 14 you PTS 6 horses or you have the hassle of trying to sell some to recoup costs. Other scenario is owner says thanks for the free grazing and moves them back to the grazing she was previously renting. :D:D:D

sadly still back to the situation that it is the owner that needs shooting not the horse.:rolleyes:


but it's not. It is simply (if it exists) a neighbouring animal that has got into the next farm's field and the problem is what to do with it once it is caught.
We have endless deer, apparently wild boar now, sheep, ponies and cattle on our roads. Some get hit by cars and killed. No doubt some drivers get hurt when they hit them. Some of them have a lot of fast traffic despite the speed limit, many deer get killed on our main roads by traffic.

my interaction with the police and animals has been poor. We have a very busy roundabout in a neighbouring market town. Always lorries going round it plus other traffic. A traveller (in the nicest sense) parked her gypsy caravan on the grass by the side of it and turned her 2 (beautifully kept and in immaculate condition) horses loose on the grass around the edge of this roundabout separating them from the traffic by a single strand of live electric fence.
I was concerned about the risk to the horses. It would not have taken them long to get onto the Devon expressway but the immediate roads were busy enough.. They behaved OK but it was only going to take some idiot to move a piece of fence.

I was next to the police in the queue at the local garage and mentioned and explained (in very great detal) this could be dangerous and a vehicle driver could get seriously injured with a loose horse on the roads. I was told they would do nothing. They would only react when some incident had taken place, they would not take any action to prevent what could have been the death of a driver (or horse)
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That’s rather different, because the traveller’s horses WEREN’T loose and therefore a public threat, when the issue was raised. Police are not concerned with the threat to whatever animals, unless specifically addressed by existing legislation, eg. W&C Act, etc.
If this blighter gets into a public space, police will have to react, as above, where the ‘preventative’ aspect reflects the dangers of a loose deer in a built up area. This deer had jumped in and out of a school playground, and was moseying along a 40mph road when shot. Deer are feral, usually unowned. Damage done by this stallion (which has an owner) when it escapes is the liability of that owner, altho sounds like getting paid out will be tricky! If someone deliberately releases the wretched stallion into a public space and endangers the public, that’s another matter altogether.
 
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