Ethics of using a stallion unseen?

[Bounty]

Would/have any of you used a stallion for your mare without viewing it first? I'm talking average horses here, not those that have been competing on the world stage for all to see!
I think that for me the answer would definitely be no.

There's a stallion I really like the look of, the downside being that he's standing in Fife - which is a pretty long way from here in Gloucester! I won't travel that sort of distance to view him, so will more than likely give him a miss (though will probably find myself on an internal flight in a moment of complete madness!).
Also, he's not graded as yet.... i think I'd be more confident about using unseen if the stallion was 'quality assured' to a certain extent.

Just wondering really!

 

[AmyMay]

Lots of people do - which is another reason why AI is so popular and useful.

Can you ask them to send you a video - who is the stallion?

 

[MillionDollar]

TBTH I wouldn't even use a none graded or unproven stallion. If I did I would definitely view it. But thats just my opinion.

 

[Bounty]

Aware that lots of people do, but can imagine that it's not everyone's cup of tea.
It's a first foal for both of us, both me and my mare and I desperately want to make the right choice of daddy, realistically I'll probably only have the one foal from her and I want it for keeps!
I just feel I owe to her to see it in the flesh?

The stallion is...
http://www.stallionsonline.co.uk/viewitem.php?id=9742&t=Igguldon%20Skye%20Laird

 

[henryhorn]

I've always chosen our stallions by viewing them, as I think you can't really tell from the pics what their temperament is like.
Several I've seen were disappointing in the flesh, and others much better..
One had the nastiest temperament imaginable and at one yard the stallion man went in each box with a big stick.. We didn't use them after seeing that.
Your best judge really is looking at the stock they produce even more so than the stallion himself. We tend to show people what they are likely to get from a selection of mares from dainty Tb types to heavy cob mares.
If they can show you a mare similar in type to yours by email that may help you decide.
I'm afraid although graded stallions are quality assured it costs a bomb to get graded and some people like us decide not to bother.
We aren't in breeding to make money more to have fun, and find it more useful to direct someone to an existing owner of one of our horses as a reference, there's nothing like a phone call where you can ask those awkward questions to someone other than the stallion owner!
If you think he will compliment your mare, his fertility rate is high, and he has at least been reg and inspected by someone like Weatherby's, go ahead.
I would say though the area you are has some lovely stallions, what about any of BMat's ?

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
TBTH I wouldn't even use a none graded or unproven stallion

[/ QUOTE ]
I do think though that too much emphasis can be put on gradings to be honest. I know of at least two absolutely tip top stallions that have been refused gradings twice by a certain affiliation. Their grounds were - no good reason - just didn't think they were stallion material. Horses outperformed some who were graded, move nicely and have wonderful temperaments. And that's where the problem can lie. If a stallion is too quite, some grading organisations simply won't grade them regardless of ability, movement etc.

Some grading organisations also grade horses on much less strict criteria.

So there are pro's and cons.

Don't think the stallion I've used is graded. Didn't make any difference to me at all. He has a competition record at eventing and dressage. Is a masters horse on the hunting field. Looks wise is very handsome and correct, and has a wonderful temperament. All that was good enough for me.

 

[Gingernags]

There are pros and cons - he has started competing, he has proven eventers in his pedigree, he was with a good "name" til his accident...

I think if you can get a video and maybe some more photos of him both moving and his conformation its not so bad. I would have gone with a stallion unseen if I'd been sending Asti further - for instance I'd have used Decanter as so many people on here know him, I'd have only got to see him when I took her down there!

As it is I've found a local one that ticks the boxes I wanted, as I am hopefully doing the same as you - one foal for me to keep off a much loved mare!

It may be that someone on here knows him and can put your mind at rest.

I would much prefer to meet a stallion first, but I might take a risk in some circumstances.

 

[Tempi]

oooooo hes stunning - looks like my Archie!

 

[Bounty]

Temperament is high on the priority list for me, as I want the end product to be primarily a 'fun' horse, not a work machine. The mare is a bit of a work-a-holic as it is!
BBMats stally's are all lovely, but I seem to be steering away from the warmbloods? I have no issues with what breed I use (with the exception of arab!), as long it really takes my eye, and so far the dressagey type just haven't done that.....

Another one i like is....
http://www.stallionsonline.co.uk/viewitem.php?id=11044&t=COR%20DE%20BREVEL
And a little more local than the previous one!

 

[AmyMay]

Looks like a super stallion. However, you are really well placed to look at stallions in the flesh.

Mine was down in Devon - so and hour and halfs drive to go and see him. And in fact I went to a stud and had everyone of the stallions I liked dragged out.

I personally would go and see them in the flesh - make a day of it and arrange to visit a few studs in the same location. Get your hands on the horses and compare them and go from there.

 

[henryhorn]

Post must have crossed as now can see his pic.. His bloodline is good, Jumbo's temperament is reputed to be excellent , and he looks as if he will produce nice types.
I prefer him to the Selle Francais , and the bloodline has consistently produced useful all round horses. Jumbo's owners have one of his offspring standing as well now I think, or if not I have definaely seen a Jumbo son somewhere in the SW. Bit nearer than Fife!

 

[Bounty]

LOL, I could take 'making a day of it' to the extreme.... there are a lot of stallions I like that could be incorporated into the journey from here to Fife

I did like a couple of the stallys up near Weezy that she put me onto last night, and also Weston Maestro.. he's so workman like.
What do you think of the Selle Francais that I just linked to above?

 

[AmyMay]

Na, don't like him - not my cup of tea.

 

[AmyMay]

If I was going to cover Amy again I would be using Treliver Decanter. I did consider him when considering stallions in the first place, but was swayed for reasons that aren't important by another.

However, I think he is just lovely and is owned by a poster on here Delphipuppy.

Their webiste is: http://www.treliverstud.co.uk/home_page.htm

 

[Bounty]

Two thumbs down for the Selle Francais so far then...

But lots of good response to the Jumbo stally

HenryHorn, off to search for other Jumbo stallions!

Thankyou all, this breeding novice appreciates your advice very much!

 

[Bounty]

Airedale suggested him last night, definitely the most appealing of the warmblood types I think.
Him and Amy would produce a BEAUTIFUL little one.

 

[seabiscuit]

What about this TB stallion High Tension? He is in Devon.
High Tension
I've seen him in the flesh and have just bought one of his offspring ( his first foal, who is just 4)
He is the most perfect looking stallion Ive ever seen- and temperment is just outstanding- just like his daughter and the rest of his offspring too I believe. He is a very athletic mover too, think he will be a future good event/show sire.. or produce a good horse for all disciplines really.
He is a lot more short coupled and compact in real life than in the picture and has a massive back end and fab hocks.

 

[AmyMay]

I'm a big High Tension Fan.

 

[Bounty]

Thanks Forrest!
Have you got a pic of your filly now she's all grown up?

 

[Thistle]

Mednight Mahood (or whatever it is called) is a Jumbo eventing stallion i believe.

 

[JoJack]

I've seen him!! He is a lovely looking horse, and seems to have a nice temperment. I was just watching him in his turnout pen when I was up one day, and he moves nicely. The yard owners were thinking about using him on some of their mares.

 

[delphipuppy]

Thanks Amy May for the vote for my boy Derek!

When choosing a stallion temperament is all important to me so I like to see them in person. Having said that I hadn't even seen a picture of Dimaggio when I choose him to make Derek, a very good friend who I trust implicitly suggested him and she is now Derek's God Mother!!

And she buys him presents!
Derek is in Bucks at the moment so not too far from you, if you do go and see him, give him a hug from me please.

 

[Bounty]

Jumbo and four of his are standing here...
http://www.grafhamstud.co.uk/index.php
Think they may well be worth a visit!
Will have a look for the one you mentioned, thankies!

 

[sallyf]

I dont wat to be seen plugging my own horse but here is a link to High Tension.
High Tension

 

[seabiscuit]

Ellie-note her compactness and big backside!

 

[Bounty]

Plug all you like!

 

[Bounty]

Wow - she's a daddy's girl! I like!

 

[seabiscuit]

He seems to stamp his stock really well, Ellie is the spitting image of him, and so are a lot of the others!

 

[Bounty]

Thanks Craiglaw, tracked him down and will ring about him later

 

[Bounty]

Liking Derek more and more everytime I look at him!