Euthanasia

[touchstone]

The last horse I had PTS had to be done in her stable as she could not be moved. There is a talk bar through to the next horse. The body of the horse ad to remain there over night as it was late. If the horse had been shot, I think this would have severely distressed her neighbour (and good pal) because of the smell of blood. Our horses go crazy whenever the game keeper's around, it must be the smell of the blood. As it was, the horse next to the one being PTS by injection, was completely undisturbed and carried on munching her haylage throughout.

It hasn't bothered any of the other horses I've known when a companion has been shot, in fact, as gory as it sounds, they often licked where the shot horse had been, I suspect for the iron?

Just a thought, but if you gamekeeper keeps ferrets the smell of them can cause a pretty extreme reaction in some horses!

 

[Django Pony]

Someone at the yard said her friend had her horse PTS with something that was added to their feed??? It sounds too good to be true, is that an option nowadays? I really like the idea of it, as J loves his food it would be the ideal way for him. I'm just not sure that I believe that it's really an option though!?
Re. the gun/injection debate, I have no idea which method I would choose, I would take the advice of the vet at the time I guess. I don't have a preference.

 

[Wagtail]

Someone at the yard said her friend had her horse PTS with something that was added to their feed??? It sounds too good to be true, is that an option nowadays? I really like the idea of it, as J loves his food it would be the ideal way for him. I'm just not sure that I believe that it's really an option though!?
Re. the gun/injection debate, I have no idea which method I would choose, I would take the advice of the vet at the time I guess. I don't have a preference.

I am sure that there are some things that could be added to feed that would kill a horse, but I am also sure that this would not be a pleasant death as it would be through poisoning. The quickest acting poison (as far as I know) is cyanide. It acts by stopping the blood carrying oxygen. Effectively, the victim suffocates to death, the body crying out for oxygen but no amount of breathing can help. Awful.

 

[Django Pony]

I am sure that there are some things that could be added to feed that would kill a horse, but I am also sure that this would not be a pleasant death as it would be through poisoning. The quickest acting poison (as far as I know) is cyanide. It acts by stopping the blood carrying oxygen. Effectively, the victim suffocates to death, the body crying out for oxygen but no amount of breathing can help. Awful.

OMG.

I REALLY hope that would not happen to ANY horse (or any other animal for that matter!)

 

[amage]

The last horse I had PTS had to be done in her stable as she could not be moved. There is a talk bar through to the next horse. The body of the horse ad to remain there over night as it was late. If the horse had been shot, I think this would have severely distressed her neighbour (and good pal) because of the smell of blood. Our horses go crazy whenever the game keeper's around, it must be the smell of the blood. As it was, the horse next to the one being PTS by injection, was completely undisturbed and carried on munching her haylage throughout.

No vet or huntsman I know would ever consider shooting a horse in a stable. Bullets are unpredictable and if it passed through could ricochet and cause injury. I would always go for the gun and my vet feels that it is the more humane option. They are brain dead instantly and essentially gone. It has taken us years to figure out the right cocktail of sedative that my mare likes for clipping...she fights against alot of things and I could not bear the thought that she would try fight anything else. I will also for as long as I live remeber the whimpers of my little dog Boots when the drug to put him to sleep entered his catheter in doggy hospital. He did go peacefully but for about 30secs was crying and whimpering as drug went into his system.

 

[baran]

Not so, Amage. My vet used captive bolt on my pony in the stable. She couldn't have been moved. None of the other horses reacted at the time nor did they show any distress at the body being left overnight until the knacker came

 

[mulledwhine]

I always said my old boy would go by injection. However, when the time came the vet could not come and the hunt could be with us in 15 mins. It was urgent so at the time the hunt became the only option

 

[Cedars]

As a general rule for us (and what as a couple we agree on if we ever were alone and needed to make a decision) is emergency (broken leg, severe wounds etc) = bullet, long term, quiet, relaxed horse, hopefully already laid down and v calm = injection.

This is because personally, I would MUCH prefer the injection, but we wouldn't ever want a horse in severe pain to suffer for a second more than needed, so would be a bullet for any emergencies.

To my shame though, I have no idea what would happen if I found a horse in this situation. Would you ring the vet and they can offer both options?

 

[StormyMoments]

i was just wondering though, if you have your horse injected can they go for dog meat? or would they have to be cremated? i know if they are shot they can but i dono about injection, tbh i would rather my horse had a use after he died, once he has gone he is no longer my horse just a shell, so i wouldnt want to keep him in a box on my mantle piece like i know some people do that kinda freaks me out but each to their own.

but yeah can they go for meat ith the injection?

 

[Vizslak]

i was just wondering though, if you have your horse injected can they go for dog meat? or would they have to be cremated? i know if they are shot they can but i dono about injection, tbh i would rather my horse had a use after he died, once he has gone he is no longer my horse just a shell, so i wouldnt want to keep him in a box on my mantle piece like i know some people do that kinda freaks me out but each to their own.

but yeah can they go for meat ith the injection?

No they have to be incinerated

 

[Wagtail]

I guess at the end of the day, I would want to do for my horse what I would like to happen to myself. I am a great believer in euthanasia for people and if I was suffering terribly, or totally racked with dementia, then I would like to be PTS. If I had that option then I would prefer the injection. I would never opt to be shot. Mind you, the difference would be, that I would know that it was coming, and a horse does not. Still, I think that for me personally, I owe it to them to do what I would prefer if it were me.

 

[Vizslak]

I guess at the end of the day, I would want to do for my horse what I would like to happen to myself. I am a great believer in euthanasia for people and if I was suffering terribly, or totally racked with dementia, then I would like to be PTS. If I had that option then I would prefer the injection. I would never opt to be shot. Mind you, the difference would be, that I would know that it was coming, and a horse does not. Still, I think that for me personally, I owe it to them to do what I would prefer if it were me.

If I didnt know death was coming (as the horse doesnt) then I would opt for whatever was the quickest.

 

[Wagtail]

If I didnt know death was coming (as the horse doesnt) then I would opt for whatever was the quickest.

Agree. The three injections I have been witness to were certainly instant. The only thing that isn't is the sedation, but having regularly had horses sedated (as well as being sedated myself), it is not an unpleasant experience. I have heard of people having the horse sedated for the bullet too. It is essential if the horse is thrashing about in pain.

 

[fburton]

Thats not quite true actually. The old injection used to be an anaesthetic overdose, hence why it so often used to go wrong, all animals react differently to anaesthetic and all will take different doses to 'overdose' and die. It isnt an exact science. The injections now are a cocktail of drugs including a large dose of anaesthetic, one of the drugs does indeed stop the heart.

That's still not the same as a "heart attack" where the conscious human (and presumably animal too) feels the pain caused when parts of the heart become ischaemic (starved of oxygen & metabolites start to build up) due to blockage or narrowing of coronary vessels. In an anaesthetic overdose, the brain is effectively rendered unconscious so, no matter what the body may be doing, the animal feels nothing. The dose is calculated to be high enough to go well beyond that and inhibit brainstem and spinal reflexes too. The heart may or may not go on beating with some anaesthetics, which is why the "improved" injection, as you say, contains another drug or drugs which specifically target the heart.

I would now consider this improved injection as an option for PTS. Vets now tend to prefer it over the gun (whereas most opted for gun as best option before)
For me personally I still prefer the gun, the horse is brain dead before you have even heard the shot. The instant way they go down is final and more acceptable to me. I dont like to see them go down slowly with the injection. If I had a horse already very ill and on the floor I would now use the newer injection, I wouldnt have considered the overdose of anaesthetic in any circumstance before.

There are pros and cons of both methods. It's not true to say one is overwhelmingly superior to the other in terms of minimizing unpleasantness for the animal. If it were, vets would be obliged to that method exclusively. The gun can go also go wrong; there are horror stories from both sides. However, failures of either method are, thank goodness, rare.

 

[PingPongPony]

I'd prefer the injection. I'd only choose the gun if it was the quickets way if the horse was in pain however, i could not stay with them if they were to be shot as the last image i'd have was of my horse with a hole in its head, i wouldn't be able to cope with that. Also IMO you don't point a gun at your friend or shoot your friend, unless like i've said, its the most loving thing at the time. But for me if i had a choice and horse was not in great pain then it'd be the injection as i'd want to stay with them till the end, i just couldn't do that with the gun.

 

[Wagtail]

I'd prefer the injection. I'd only choose the gun if it was the quickets way if the horse was in pain however, i could not stay with them if they were to be shot as the last image i'd have was of my horse with a hole in its head, i wouldn't be able to cope with that. Also IMO you don't point a gun at your friend or shoot your friend, unless like i've said, its the most loving thing at the time. But for me if i had a choice and horse was not in great pain then it'd be the injection as i'd want to stay with them till the end, i just couldn't do that with the gun.

I totally agree. I could never be there for a horse to be shot. It seems so violent. I agree that sometimes it may be the only alternative and I would have it done rather than have my horse suffer. However, it would never happen for me as I don't know anyone with a gun, and don't hunt, so it would be the vet that would be called. He's only ten minutes away.