Eventing on Hard Ground

[Squeak]

The event I went to today had done no work on their ground and consequently it was rock solid, like my fields at home. Looking at the results, there were only a couple from each section (including me) who had withdrawn before the xc - sj was on a surface so might as well do the dr and sj.

I know I err on the side of caution with hard ground and have a couple of times withdrawn when most other people compete but I'm intrigued as to why so many people run. Is it that you can get away with running a couple of times on hard ground with minimal impact on the horse and I'm just a massive hypochondriac?

A couple of people I've known are producing horses to sell so they just need the results to be able to sell it and don't care past that, some people I guess just wont realise that the ground is hard but what is the main reason that basically everyone else competes? What am I missing? What do I not know? Do I just need to be less precious about it?

 

[ihatework]

For me there are lots of factors.
People have different perceptions of ‘hard’.
Different types of horse travel better/worse on different types of ground.
Is the course hard but very level? It’s slightly rutted hard ground that is worse.
Then you need to think strategically about whether the horse needs or would benefit from the run in terms of either education or qualification.

So it really is a balance of factors that are individual to a combination.

But if it’s a BE event that has done no prep then it goes on the ‘no’ list for the future.

 

[MissTyc]

It really does depend on the horse as well - I have one who will merrily go up to 100 on hard ground and never look back. Solid and sound. Softer ground isn't for him, however and he quickly gets sticky and likely to roll a pole on the SJ or give me a fright by chipping in on the XC

 

[Michen]

It's a funny one as I'd consider myself very fussy on ground but heard someone withdrawing before XC today at BCA due to ground, and I thought the ground was spot on. I guess a lot of the time one persons idea or hard isn't anothers.

As IHW said, hardish and flat is very different to rutted.

 

[Nicnac]

It's a funny one as I'd consider myself very fussy on ground but heard someone withdrawing before XC today at BCA due to ground, and I thought the ground was spot on. I guess a lot of the time one persons idea or hard isn't anothers.

My vet is absolutely obsessed with ground and he ran at BCA today so it must have been good.

 

[McGrools]

The UK has had plenty rain recently, i have no ground concerns atm. If we get a couple of dry weeks things will change.
I’ve just come back from a xc school at a course that does get hard after a dry spell but it was pretty perfect today xx

 

[Flowerofthefen]

O won't run mine on hard ground so unfortunately we stick to arena eventing as I can't afford to withdraw. I also think a few horses have owners that like the riders to compete as its a day out for them. Then you have the riders that intend on selling the horse for profit so its not them that will suffer the consequences a few years down the line.

 

[Michen]

The UK has had plenty rain recently, i have no ground concerns atm. If we get a couple of dry weeks things will change.
I’ve just come back from a xc school at a course that does get hard after a dry spell but it was pretty perfect today xx

I’m entered for waverton next sat and dithering about whether to withdraw now, looks like a week of scorching sun!

Can we just have some overnight weekday rain please UK ?

 

[mavandkaz]

The UK has had plenty rain recently, i have no ground concerns atm. If we get a couple of dry weeks things will change.
I’ve just come back from a xc school at a course that does get hard after a dry spell but it was pretty perfect today xx

Think it depends where you are. We've had some rain recently but the ground around the local hacking routes is back to being like concrete and cracking on top.
We are due a week of warmth, with some high temps. I'm back to just walking out on hacks after being able to canter mid week. It's not looking great for the rest of the summer

(Desperately praying for rain ?)

 

[RachelFerd]

I was at Berriewood on Saturday - ground was good and safe to run on, but was slightly firm - very grateful that they had used an equivator and improved it from where it would have been were it not given some attention.

One of my BE vs unaff fears at the moment is that when events get low entries they're sadly going to be less inclined to spent the £££ on putting the effort into improving the going - whereas when you've got a full set of entries for 2/3 days, the costs of improving and watering are more likely to be met.

I've only gone to one event with poor ground this year - and sadly it was a local international event and I suspect they'll be hit with poor entries for their early Autumn running now.

We're all better off to have 700 horses running at an affiliated event with thorough ground prep, rather than spread across 4 venues at a mixture of unaff and aff with no funding to put effort into the ground.

 

[McGrools]

Think it depends where you are. We've had some rain recently but the ground around the local hacking routes is back to being like concrete and cracking on top.
We are due a week of warmth, with some high temps. I'm back to just walking out on hacks after being able to canter mid week. It's not looking great for the rest of the summer

(Desperately praying for rain ?)

I’m in Staffs. My land is clay and its still good to ride on atm which is unusual for June. We have had plenty sharp showers all through last week. I love a good rainstorm at this time of year xx

 

[lannerch]

I was at Berriewood on Saturday - ground was good and safe to run on, but was slightly firm - very grateful that they had used an equivator and improved it from where it would have been were it not given some attention.

One of my BE vs unaff fears at the moment is that when events get low entries they're sadly going to be less inclined to spent the £££ on putting the effort into improving the going - whereas when you've got a full set of entries for 2/3 days, the costs of improving and watering are more likely to be met.

I've only gone to one event with poor ground this year - and sadly it was a local international event and I suspect they'll be hit with poor entries for their early Autumn running now.

We're all better off to have 700 horses running at an affiliated event with thorough ground prep, rather than spread across 4 venues at a mixture of unaff and aff with no funding to put effort into the ground.

Suspect it’s the same event that’s holding an unaffiliated event the same weekend as their closest neighbouring BE event , I know which one I would be going to.

I was happy I travelled the 2 hours to Solihull , in the Spring which is the same werkend as the one I think your referring to, as the ground there was lovely they had watered and treated , even though like you the other is local. I will always travel for good ground.

Glad to hear Berriewood has improved their ground as that one is another that used to have a poor reputation, full credit to them.

 

[Squeak]

I was at Berriewood on Saturday - ground was good and safe to run on, but was slightly firm - very grateful that they had used an equivator and improved it from where it would have been were it not given some attention.

One of my BE vs unaff fears at the moment is that when events get low entries they're sadly going to be less inclined to spent the £££ on putting the effort into improving the going - whereas when you've got a full set of entries for 2/3 days, the costs of improving and watering are more likely to be met.

I've only gone to one event with poor ground this year - and sadly it was a local international event and I suspect they'll be hit with poor entries for their early Autumn running now.

We're all better off to have 700 horses running at an affiliated event with thorough ground prep, rather than spread across 4 venues at a mixture of unaff and aff with no funding to put effort into the ground.

Suspect it’s the same event that’s holding an unaffiliated event the same weekend as their closest neighbouring BE event , I know which one I would be going to.

I was happy I travelled the 2 hours to Solihull , in the Spring which is the same werkend as the one I think your referring to, as the ground there was lovely they had watered and treated , even though like you the other is local. I will always travel for good ground.

Glad to hear Berriewood has improved their ground as that one is another that used to have a poor reputation, full credit to them.

I think it's going to be what pushes me back to BE, I could have paid for a full seasons membership in how much it cost me in entries and petrol yesterday.

 

[Squeak]

For me there are lots of factors.
People have different perceptions of ‘hard’.
Different types of horse travel better/worse on different types of ground.
Is the course hard but very level? It’s slightly rutted hard ground that is worse.
Then you need to think strategically about whether the horse needs or would benefit from the run in terms of either education or qualification.

So it really is a balance of factors that are individual to a combination.

But if it’s a BE event that has done no prep then it goes on the ‘no’ list for the future.

I was thinking about it overnight and I think you're completely right re strategy, I was running a horse with a lot of miles on his legs and had no qualifications etc to gain. For me it was a no brainer to save him for another day but if I'd have been on a horse with less miles on it's legs that would have benefitted from cantering around for experience I probably would have. The ground wasn't rutted at all so was no danger in that way either.

 

[Squeak]

For me there are lots of factors.
People have different perceptions of ‘hard’.

It's a funny one as I'd consider myself very fussy on ground but heard someone withdrawing before XC today at BCA due to ground, and I thought the ground was spot on. I guess a lot of the time one persons idea or hard isn't anothers.

Now I'm paranoid the ground was perfect and I withdrew over nothing! I've always gone for the 'heel test' as well as checking for give. Where I'd expect my heel to make at least a mark and ideally a bit of a cut without going too deep and give wise I'd want it to not feel solid like concrete.

Is this what everyone else does? Maybe I should just invest in one of the ground measuring sticks they use on racecourses ?

 

[Michen]

Now I'm paranoid the ground was perfect and I withdrew over nothing! I've always gone for the 'heel test' as well as checking for give. Where I'd expect my heel to make at least a mark and ideally a bit of a cut without going too deep and give wise I'd want it to not feel solid like concrete.

Is this what everyone else does? Maybe I should just invest in one of the ground measuring sticks they use on racecourses ?

Well it completely depends on where you were. Chances are if you felt it wasn't right then it wasn't.

I don't apply any science to it tbh Although some of the events do proper ground reports which are brilliant, where it's been tested.Attached. This is interesting as it says the second layer is what the horses feel more. So my attitude rightly or wrongly now is a little more on the edge of just because it feels a bit firm on top, if it's had sufficient rain and it's that old turf type ground, the chances are the bottom layer is fine.

I may Waverton due to the above because we have actually had a lot of rainfall recently- within weeks- and therefore my feeling is that whilst the top layer may be a bit baked, that might not be what's important.

 

[Bernster]

What a handy tool/measure!

 

[ITPersonnage]

Where did you dig that report from Michen ? I love some good data to drool over

 

[Michen]

It just came up on the Ascott facebook page months ago, cotswold cup sometimes post them too.

Wish every event did- save any wasted fuel money!

 

[Patterdale]

I will run on pretty much any ground but I’m only doing 80, and I’m not afraid to trot. Also I don’t have an arena and my horse is used to whatever is thrown at him.

Thinking though, even when I was doing pre novice I still ran on anything. If I’d paid and it was running then I was running ?
Never had lameness post-event.

 

[Squeak]

It just came up on the Ascott facebook page months ago, cotswold cup sometimes post them too.

Wish every event did- save any wasted fuel money!

That would be amazing if every event would do it. It would be so much less frustrating to know before you’ve wasted all the fuel and it would also stop people withdrawing unnecessarily if the ground is ok.

 

[LEC]

Waverton had great grass cover when I went and old turf.

I am not that fussy about ground as long as not rutted and a bit of grass cover. But my horses tend to have good feet. Had one with long pasterns and couldn’t run on hard ground as would jar itself up.