Exercise Groom when do would you expect them to tell there boss there pregnant?

[Mary3050]

Asking for a friend!

So my friend thinks her groom is pregnant but groom hasn’t said anything. Groom does all normal stable chores as well as riding, jumping, hacking and sometimes the odd comp for her boss . Dailey she rides/ handles stallions and youngsters, breakers etc. My friend has her suspicions as her groom has been off it for last 6/7 weeks tired and headaches . Then in the last month she has started being sick when she eats, when riding, doing chores and it’s becoming more frequent. She has also wore wellingtons whilst riding which is a big hate of my friends. When my friend asked why she said she has sprained her ankle in the field. She also been a little moody and grumpy which is not like her. Groom originally said it was food poisoning. However, she went to the doctors about two weeks ago regarding the “food poisoning” and then she had a hospital appointment on Friday last week.

My friend joked the last week it must be the longest case of food poisoning and maybe she should check the boyfriends cooking. Groom went all sheepish and didn’t reply. It’s the first time my friends ever had a groom that maybe pregnant. Then when she said I hope the hospital appointment went okay. The groom just said yes thanks. I think they have a good working relationship and would say they are good friends too. I think my friend expect that If she is pregnant she would have said something 5 days after the hospital appointment.

So my friend doesn’t know when she would expect to be told. Friends also a little concerned as she waiting on an operation meaning she’s going to be unable to do much for 3 months. I think she just wants to prepare incase she need to get another groom trained up etc. But on the other hand she doesn’t want to ask the groom as she said she would feel awkward. What should she do also? when do you expect her to be told ? I know it varies and is down to personal choice but when did people stop working, riding , jumping and competing etc when pregnant?

My friend just wants to do her best for all involved as she has said she would hate for anything to happen to her/baby if she is pregnant so would need to sort out to make sure she doesn’t work the more risky horses.

Thanks in advance

 

[Ample Prosecco]

She does not have to tell your friend till 15 weeks before the due date. Once your friend knows she may have to make adjustments to make sure the work place os safe but obviously she does not need to worry about that until she is told.

Lots of people don't say anything till after the 12 week scan as so many pregnancies are lost in that first trimester. So your friend needs to just wait and see, I think.

I rode till I was 7 months pregnant. It's up to the pregnat person to decide whether they need to say anything sooner to have their work adjusted to take the pregnancy into account. Your friend can leave that judgement up to her.

 

[AmyMay]

I’d just ask her, personally.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I wouldn't. It's none of her business, frankly. She is her boss and should be professional about it. She has no legal right to know, however convenient it might be to be able to plan. And if for whatever reason the posssibly pregnant person has good reasons to want to keep things quiet then she is put in a very awkward position by being asked by her boss and either unwillingly disclosing or having to lie.

 

[Mary3050]

I wouldn't. It's none of her business, frankly. She is her boss and should be professional about it. She has no legal right to know, however convenient it might be to be able to plan. And if for whatever reason the posssibly pregnant person has good reasons to want to keep things quiet then she is put in a very awkward position by being asked by her boss and either unwillingly disclosing or having to lie.

I don’t think my friend would be the type of person to ask as it’s just not her. She felt bad when she made the joke about the food poisoning and her boyfriend cooking. When she spoke to her husband it was he who suggested she maybe pregnant. My friend just doesn’t want to put her groom in harms way if this is the case x

 

[Laurac13]

Groom may not be sure she wants to keep the baby or not hence being sheepish I’d tell your friend to hold off asking her outright At the moment ...

 

[TPO]

I dont know anything about the rules as an employer or employee re pregnancy and if she is pregnant and its unplanned there could be a lot going on behind the scenes too.

Regardless of what is the correct procedure as the employer of someone in a manual job I would want to know. As far from an expert as can be but it's there a time at the start of a pregnancy when you shouldn't be lifting etc?

As an employer I'd want to know to put things in place so that employees health isnt at risk.

I know that the horse industry doesnt appear to be very well regulated but there should be Risk Assessments and Method Statements for manual tasks because of all the HSE legislation. These need reviewed and revised if it's a pregnant woman.

If I was thr employer in this situation I'd want to know for employees well being.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I do get that, but early pregnancy is fraught with issues potentially. What if she is considering terminating? What if this is her 5th pregnancy and she's lost all the others at 10 weeks and can;t bear for it to be public knowlege till she's past the danger zone? The law is clear that employees don't need to tell employers until 15 weeks before they are due. They may well choose to tell them earlier - especially in a risky job - so that their employer can make adjustements. But they don't have to. I'd leave well alone. She's a grown up. She knows she is in a physical job. It's up to her to figure out when the right time is, balancing the wish to have workplace adjustments with the desire for privacy.

 

[scruffyponies]

She may not have told ANYBODY yet... including the father. It's absolutely not OK to demand women tell you their pregnancy status, ever.

 

[Not_so_brave_anymore]

Legally she absolutely must not ask. If/when an employee decides to tell their employer, then that is the moment the appropriate risk assessment would be conducted. If the groom is worried about carrying out her daily tasks then it is up to her to approach her employer.

Of course it could be a totally unrelated condition, such as crohns etc. Unless it is seriously impacting the quality of her work, the employer is not entitled to ask. I mean a friendly "is everything OK" would be fine, but she can't push it.

 

[Mary3050]

She may not have told ANYBODY yet... including the father. It's absolutely not OK to demand women tell you their pregnancy status, ever.

My friend is most certainly not going to DEMAND to be told. She was just wondering when it’s normal to be told.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

I'm sure your friend is just concerned and wants to be supportive and make sure she is safe. But there is no 'normal'. It depends entirely on both the indivual and on the circumstances. For all we know she was never pregnant at all. Or has already had a termination and absolutely does not want to discuss it (and is not at risk). So your friend just needs to wait and see, really. x

 

[Tiddlypom]

It's absolutely not OK to demand women tell you their pregnancy status, ever.

Chill. It is clear that the OP’s friend was not going to demand that her employee tell her.

 

[Mary3050]

Legally she absolutely must not ask. If/when an employee decides to tell their employer, then that is the moment the appropriate risk assessment would be conducted. If the groom is worried about carrying out her daily tasks then it is up to her to approach her employer.

Of course it could be a totally unrelated condition, such as crohns etc. Unless it is seriously impacting the quality of her work, the employer is not entitled to ask. I mean a friendly "is everything OK" would be fine, but she can't push it.

It is kinda affecting her work as the groom is constantly being sick. I mean she being sick a dozen or more times a day. Mid way through schooling horses. My friend had an issue Monday where she got off to be sick in the loo. Tided the horse up in full tack in the barn. My friend walked around the corner to find the horse pulling back and bolted off. Broke its bridle in the process. All my friend said is oh well you can’t help being ill. She doubtful it’s anything else she’s always been really healthy up until now xx

 

[conniegirl]

I told my employer the day after i found out but only because i handled chemicals that are cat 2 repro-toxins on a daily basis.

In my last job i dont think i would have told anyone until after the 12 week point at the absolute earliest.

 

[Mary3050]

I told my employer the day after i found out but only because i handled chemicals that are cat 2 repro-toxins on a daily basis.

In my last job i dont think i would have told anyone until after the 12 week point at the absolute earliest.

My friend kinda of thinks that may have been the 12 week scan possibly last week. I think we will just have to wait and see x

 

[Goldenstar]

Well she must not ask her .
she can however begin to make a plan just in case .
It’s even more difficult when someone wants to keep doing things you don’t think they ought when you know they are pregnant .

 

[sport horse]

Every employers nightmare - yes it is the employees right not to tell you but meanwhile they are backing young horses, handling stallions etc etc. The employer cannot protect either themself or the employee if they do not know. Who is responsible if there is an accident caused by the pregnant employee not 'feeling well' perhaps being sick and feeling a bit dizzy, and sustaining a major injury? Employment law is employment law but we are in a risky business not sat behind a desk. What law protects the employer?

 

[conniegirl]

Every employers nightmare - yes it is the employees right not to tell you but meanwhile they are backing young horses, handling stallions etc etc. The employer cannot protect either themself or the employee if they do not know. Who is responsible if there is an accident caused by the pregnant employee not 'feeling well' perhaps being sick and feeling a bit dizzy, and sustaining a major injury? Employment law is employment law but we are in a risky business not sat behind a desk. What law protects the employer?

The employer has no responsibility for pregnancy complications until they are told of the pregnancy.

 

[ihatework]

The employer has no responsibility for pregnancy complications until they are told of the pregnancy.

No but they do have a responsibility towards the horses. And young expensive sport horses need someone on their A game

 

[Tiddlypom]

Friend could just suggest that her employee stays off work while suffering with her ‘sickness bug’. It’s not safe handling horses in her current debilitated state, and risks the horses getting injured.

 

[conniegirl]

No but they do have a responsibility towards the horses. And young expensive sport horses need someone on their A game

The employer should have both performance management and sickness policies to cover this.
Until you are told of a pregnancy the illness should be treated like any other sickness, people can faint for reasons other than pregnancy.
Chemotherapy for example can lead to most of the symptoms that the OP is seeing.

 

[Rowreach]

Well she must not ask her .
she can however begin to make a plan just in case .
It’s even more difficult when someone wants to keep doing things you don’t think they ought when you know they are pregnant .

I would be very concerned about my groom riding my horses while pregnant tbh, in case anything happened to her or the baby. I'd have no problem with her riding her own, or choosing to ride other people's, that's clearly her choice.

However, it looks like the friend in this case is going to have to wait till she's told, or it becomes obvious.

I'm pretty sure though that if the job isn't being done properly then the employer can raise that aspect with the employee?

 

[SusieT]

Easier way round this -if shes riding in wellies which isn't safe say to her, I notice you can't wear your riding boots atm due to your sprained ankle. Would it suit for the next two weeks to take you off riding duties to let it settle, anything else I can do?
Then its a sensitive way of checking in as she'd probably be liable if groom got injured in wellies, without asking if shes pregnant.
If groom says no I'm fine, I'll pop my boots back on, all settled, then no further action needed until /if told any more details.

 

[SusieT]

ps- doesn't this just show how being a woman and being (potentially) pregnant can open up a whole can of worms, where suddenly your body and choices are not your own...If shes' pregnant and chooses to not share that that is up to her, performance issues such as not wearing safety gear should be handled as any other performance issues.

 

[Goldenstar]

An employer has a responsibility for the safety of a worker and that includes taking the choice to stop them riding .
Just like pregnant vets and ewes .

 

[Winters100]

No but they do have a responsibility towards the horses. And young expensive sport horses need someone on their A game

Totally agree. I would not want someone riding unless they were in good shape for it. If she is not in good condition to do the job then I would expect her to discuss with her employer, whatever the reason. The law is one thing, but common sense is another.

 

[Rowreach]

An employer has a responsibility for the safety of a worker and that includes taking the choice to stop them riding .
Just like pregnant vets and ewes .

No employee of mine was ever allowed on a horse in wellies, that's for sure.

If one of them had been throwing up and was clearly too unwell to do the job properly, they'd either be sent home to get better or given lighter duties.

 

[Flicker]

I would suggest your friend addresses the work issues as they are: riding in wellies = not safe, so don’t. Constant sickness = affecting work so she should have a proper conversation with her about that, not just a side remark in passing. She has no evidence her employee is pregnant.

As for the potential risks involved - I’ve seen grooms with hangovers presenting more serious risks to horses’ welfare than grooms who are pregnant. Our YM worked until about a month before she had her babies and, like the majority of women, was 100% on top of her game throughout.

 

[SusieT]

'Totally agree. I would not want someone riding unless they were in good shape for it. If she is not in good condition to do the job then I would expect her to discuss with her employer, whatever the reason. The law is one thing, but common sense is another.'

If shes not in good condition to do the job - is this language appropriate? Do you think that makes pregnant people feel they are valued and part of the team? Anyone can be under the weather and not doing the good job. As above, unless todl its pregnancy treat it as any other perfomance issue