Failed vetting but should I go ahead an loan?

[MGKIRA]

Just looking for a bit of advise - I was planning on purchasing a Welsh D which I absolutely fell in love with.

I'm wanting to mainly hack, pop an odd jump and school a little. I put a deposit down and had a vet come out for a 5 stage vetting. The horse passed all the flexion tests and wasn't showing lame when trotting up, however the vet expressed that she was concerned as she wasn't stepping through with her left hind very well and also when cantering in the school she wouldn't canter off the left hind into the canter on the right rein, if she did strike off this leg, she would change to lead with her left leg on the right rein. She also kept tripping in the school which was a little concerning (school was quite deep and needed a rake).

I've backed out of the sale - but we are currently discussing potential to loan with view to buy. The problem is she hasn't done much schooling so could it be these issues are due to being unbalanced? She has an amazing temperament and was perfect to hack out in walk and trot but I would like to do a bit more than just this, even if it means putting the work in. We're currently in discussion as the girl selling is due to go away so whilst is okay, wouldn't want a broken horse returning which I completely understand also but I don't want to risk purchasing and then something go wrong.

Would just like to hear any thoughts on what other's would do in this situation.

 

[Goldenstar]

I would leave it.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Have you only ridden her in the school?
I’d want to know if she tripped on other surfaces.
Would the loan period be long enough to really try he’d out and see if your happy with her?

In all honesty I’d probably walk away. A horse owned or loaned costs the same in vet fees and heart ache when they go wrong.

 

[MGKIRA]

away. A horse owned or l

Have you only ridden her in the school?
I’d want to know if she tripped on other surfaces.
Would the loan period be long enough to really try he’d out and see if your happy with her?

In all honesty I’d probably walk away. A horse owned or loaned costs the same in vet fees and heart ache when they go wrong.

I've hacked her out on hard ground and she wasn't tripping - so I didn't pick up on this issue when we were out. I've suggested 6/12months as this would give me time to school her and see if it's just a green issue.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I would maybe consider a short loan and as you say you could start schooling and see if the issues are mainly down to being green, if you really like her it might be worth doing some x rays before you bought her.

 

[skint1]

I walked away from a horse that failed a 2 stage where i could have had him on loan for a while, it was partially the price and partially that I couldn't get insurance. Bought a horse that did "pass" a 2 stage and is broken now anyway, so meh, if you like her, I'd give it a go.

 

[fidleyspromise]

If I liked her enough I'd take on loan with view to buy so I could see how she is with Consistent schooling/work to see if it improves.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I've hacked her out on hard ground and she wasn't tripping - so I didn't pick up on this issue when we were out. I've suggested 6/12months as this would give me time to school her and see if it's just a green issue.

That’s hopeful, it may well have been too deep for her.

My favourite horse ever failed the vetting but we bought him anyway ?

 

[AmyMay]

Do a three month loan and work her. Then get your vet to re-vet if you decide you want her.

 

[Jenko109]

If you can get a 6 month loan, this will be enough time to really put this horse into some hard work. Either the horse will get fitter, stronger and more balanced, or if it's an actual problem then in theory it should exacerbate it and you will know to walk away.

 

[Arzada]

She also kept tripping in the school which was a little concerning (school was quite deep and needed a rake).

I've backed out of the sale - but we are currently discussing potential to loan with view to buy. The problem is she hasn't done much schooling so could it be these issues are due to being unbalanced?

How old is the horse? What height? How much schooling has she had? What size is the school? Was the rider trying to canter on a circle that was too small for the level of the horse's schooling rather than go large? Deep school.

I would take the horse on loan WVTB for a set term with a tight loan agreement if I thought that the answers to these questions favoured the horse ie she was being asked to do more than she was capable of eg not sufficiently schooled, school too small/too deep etc

 

[MGKIRA]

How old is the horse? What height? How much schooling has she had? What size is the school? Was the rider trying to canter on a circle that was too small for the level of the horse's schooling rather than go large? Deep school.

I would take the horse on loan WVTB for a set term with a tight loan agreement if I thought that the answers to these questions favoured the horse ie she was being asked to do more than she was capable of eg not sufficiently schooled, school too small/too deep etc

Horse is 5 year old 14.2 - her owner admittedly hasn't really done much schooling with her and just hacks her out. So I am inclined to think it's maybe unreasonable to expect her to be able to do this. She was riding her for the vets in a 20 x 40 school going large around the school. The school was quite deep.

Other than this the vet really put her through her paces and found no issues she kind of said as it is she would pass 5 stage for a hacking home as she isn't lame but obviously with the schooling issue she was reluctant to say she was suitable anything more.. but I wonder is this to cover her butt.. Also understandable.

 

[Squeak]

Horse is 5 year old 14.2 - her owner admittedly hasn't really done much schooling with her and just hacks her out. So I am inclined to think it's maybe unreasonable to expect her to be able to do this. She was riding her for the vets in a 20 x 40 school going large around the school. The school was quite deep.

Other than this the vet really put her through her paces and found no issues she kind of said as it is she would pass 5 stage for a hacking home as she isn't lame but obviously with the schooling issue she was reluctant to say she was suitable anything more.. but I wonder is this to cover her butt.. Also understandable.

Could you maybe hire a bigger arena with a better surface? If she's ok you have your answer and if not then you can still take her on loan for a bit if you wanted.

 

[planete]

There is a lot of PSSM2 in Welsh cobs. The tripping and cantering problem would worry me a lot now that I have some experience of muscle myopathies.

 

[J&S]

Just a word of warning from a different point of view, if you take this pony/cob on loan and find she is sound, sane and capable with no problems, AND you improve her with fittening and schooling don't let the owners take her back and sell on to some one else in her improved state. Make sure , as has been said above, that you have a water tight LWVTB contract at a pre arranged price.
A friend of mine had a young horse on loan for quite a considerable time as the owners did not have the knowledge to bring him on. She schooled him on, SJ, Xc, showing etc etc. one day owners declared they wanted to sell him, of course my friend wanted to buy him. Owners wanted an enormous amount of money for him on account of his ability and looks. My friend was devastated! All her work and not even offered a chance to buy him at a decent price. After much heart ache and anguish a price was agreed but so sad she had to go through it. So take care!

 

[MGKIRA]

Just a word of warning from a different point of view, if you take this pony/cob on loan and find she is sound, sane and capable with no problems, AND you improve her with fittening and schooling don't let the owners take her back and sell on to some one else in her improved state. Make sure , as has been said above, that you have a water tight LWVTB contract at a pre arranged price.
A friend of mine had a young horse on loan for quite a considerable time as the owners did not have the knowledge to bring him on. She schooled him on, SJ, Xc, showing etc etc. one day owners declared they wanted to sell him, of course my friend wanted to buy him. Owners wanted an enormous amount of money for him on account of his ability and looks. My friend was devastated! All her work and not even offered a chance to buy him at a decent price. After much heart ache and anguish a price was agreed but so sad she had to go through it. So take care!

Yes - completely agree with this. It will be an agreed price at the the end of the contract with an agreed date of return if not suitable! If i'm going to put the work in for her then it's going to be for the original agree'd price.

How horrible for your friend though - it's really difficult, if I could I really would avoid loaning and I really want to purchase her but I also have a massive what if niggling at me but I'd also really kick myself if I didn't try because she is so lovely! None of the other horses I've viewed have come close!

 

[chaps89]

I would in this instance loan, agree purchase price now and have a 6 month deadline if it isn’t obvious before that which way it’s going.
That said, if the owner is going away, hence originally wanting to sell, agree a plan now for what happens if she isn’t suitable and you want to hand her back.

 

[Ali27]

Section Ds do get PSSM 2! I would test or speak to Facebook group for flags in breeding!

 

[nagblagger]

If you didn't LWVTB you will always regret it if you think 'this is the one'.
You have the opportunity, with minimal risk (except your heart!) to try before you buy - i would go for it.

 

[Kat]

My horse didn't pass the vet, we agreed a one month loan trial with the purchase price agreed if we were happy at the end.

11 years later she has been wonderful and has proven the vet wrong on a daily basis.

 

[Lucky Snowball]

If I liked the horse, I would offer a reduced price. Seller is now in a much weaker position. It could just need basic schooling and hill work. Depends on your situation really and how much you enjoyed hacking her. No right or wrong, good luck.

 

[Sossigpoker]

The horse failed the vetting and trips in school...just walk away. Why would you knowingly buy or even loan a problem?
The seller must know that there's a problem as otherwise they wouldn't even think of a loan - they sound like they're desperate to get rid.
There's no point in paying for a vetting and then going ahead anyway. You might as well not bother with a vetting then.

 

[Ample Prosecco]

The horse failed the vetting and trips in school...just walk away. Why would you knowingly buy or even loan a problem?
The seller must know that there's a problem as otherwise they wouldn't even think of a loan - they sound like they're desperate to get rid.
There's no point in paying for a vetting and then going ahead anyway. You might as well not bother with a vetting then.

i see the offer of a loan differently - that the owner does not suspect any real issue so is willing to let the horse be properly assessed over a period of time. I’d never do this as the owner but I’d jump at the opportunity as the loaner. There’s really nothing to lose - either the tripping is physical and you don’t buy or it completely resolves with correct work and you have your perfect pony.

 

[Kaylum]

Just a word of warning from a different point of view, if you take this pony/cob on loan and find she is sound, sane and capable with no problems, AND you improve her with fittening and schooling don't let the owners take her back and sell on to some one else in her improved state. Make sure , as has been said above, that you have a water tight LWVTB contract at a pre arranged price.
A friend of mine had a young horse on loan for quite a considerable time as the owners did not have the knowledge to bring him on. She schooled him on, SJ, Xc, showing etc etc. one day owners declared they wanted to sell him, of course my friend wanted to buy him. Owners wanted an enormous amount of money for him on account of his ability and looks. My friend was devastated! All her work and not even offered a chance to buy him at a decent price. After much heart ache and anguish a price was agreed but so sad she had to go through it. So take care!

Same thing happened to me many years ago I had him for 2 years he wasn't worth anything at all.

He was on loan with an agreement he was skin and bones. After 2 years they decided to sell him. They offered him to me for stupid price I couldn't afford and then sold him after 2 years of care, schooling and training. Basically used me.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Further to replies above, I too would sound a cautionary note!!

Had a horse here on what we thought would be forever loan/Deed-of-Gift at some point within the first year.

Mare duly arrived looking like something the RSPCA would happily use as a publicity poster.

We immediately got our vet out to do an assessment of the situation, but frankly thought we'd all be looking at a PTS decision by the end of the day.

However...... vet saw hope where we didn't, and the loaner put in one helluva lot of work (and paid for physio treatment) and by the Spring the mare was looking a damn sight better.

Owner then rocked up and wanted her horse back........ so that is what had to happen as they categorically would not sell. The horse was kept at my yard and we were all distraught especially the loanee who had worked hard to gain this mare's confidence and had also put in a lot of time trouble and effort (plus ££££) to get her right, only for the owner to unexpectedly "want her horse back". This is what happens unfortunately.

Soohh if OP you take this horse, I would advise you to preserve your own sanity by getting everything drawn up as tight-as-a-ducks-arse or tighter. I would personally suggest you go to a Legal and get something drawn up - because the thing that could well happen is that the horse's condition gets WORSE instead of better and if that does happen you don't want to be committed to having to buy. Ditto if it proves to be something fixable - you could then have the owner screaming that they want more for the horse and holding you over a barrel.

But (hating to say it) I would strongly suggest you walk away from this one: I sooh feel your pain, I fell in love with a lovely little Welsh D some 5 years ago now when I was looking and she was lovely - same bloodlines as the old gal I had then - and I just WANTED her.......... but she failed vetting for very nearly copy-cat reasons that the one you describe has. Would she have come good? Possibly. Possibly not, and possibly I would have been left with a field-ornament. You never know.

My counsel would be to let this one go: why buy trouble. There will be plenty of horses coming up on loan and to buy come the autumn, you'll see. Just wait a month or two.

 

[fidleyspromise]

The horse failed the vetting and trips in school...just walk away. Why would you knowingly buy or even loan a problem?
The seller must know that there's a problem as otherwise they wouldn't even think of a loan - they sound like they're desperate to get rid.
There's no point in paying for a vetting and then going ahead anyway. You might as well not bother with a vetting then.

I disagree. I had a horse on loan and owner couldn't take her back so she went up for sale. Saw an ad before advertising and a lady came out to try her. They weren't sure and we wanted the right home. I conferred with owner suggesting a trial to see if they gel. If not mare could come back to mine so she went back somewhere familiar. It worked out and they've now purchased mare who is settled in happily.
Slightly different scenario as mare doesn't have potential health issues but I'd happily take a puny in losing nothing but time and potentially gaining a horse I love.
The vetting has pointed out some things loaner can now consider while getting horse fitter/stronger.
Loaner can get a new vetting if she decides horse is going better and then go from there.
Some horses pass a vetting and then owners seem to have all sorts of issues after anyway.

i see the offer of a loan differently - that the owner does not suspect any real issue so is willing to let the horse be properly assessed over a period of time. I’d never do this as the owner but I’d jump at the opportunity as the loaner. There’s really nothing to lose - either the tripping is physical and you don’t buy or it completely resolves with correct work and you have your perfect pony.

I agree with this. It gives loaned a chance to see if there is a problem my friends horse tripped a lot when she bought him. Worked on balance, let him work out where his feet are and he's much better now. Took a few months of correct and slow work.

 

[SantaVera]

I'd have negotiated a lower price after the vetting and bought the horse

 

[Equi]

I would not loan but i would ask for a say 2-4 weeks trial. See how the horse goes on a different surface, and how the balance comes along with a little better schooling on said surface. You don't want to loan for a year and end up with a massive vet bill trying to figure it out then have to send the horse back anyway. (also you don't want to get the horse and not spend anything on vets because its not "your" horse)