Farmer's - a question

cptrayes Apologies for the rants I have nothing else to do. The Council have failed to clear the drifts out of my road. I cannot ride out said:
( Quote Dry Rot)

It seems this thread has collected everyone on HHO who wants to have a fight or disagree. I'm off. (Quote)

Think more than a curry (maybe lamb!)will be necessary. When others are battling to keep animals alive and the posters main gripe is that they can't ride out..aaawww. Never heard of a shovel?

Completely agree with Dry Rot, I'm off too, have far more productive things to do, like actually helping a farmer, than vent my spleen because my hobby has been put on hold. If any of the bleating lot are equestrian professionals and their livlihood/stock threatened by this terrible weather I'd be very interested in all your details and PROOF you are!
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Oh well, when all the farmers and landowners have sold up to developers, because they can't make an honest living, we won't have to worry about sheep and snow drifts, neglect of farm animals, getting out on country roads etc. All the green space will have been built on, there will be no homelessness, no horses/sheep/cattle/hay grown, the tiniest field will be rented to the odd horse owner at an absolute premium but the roads will be far too busy for them to ride out. Food might be a bit expensive, and probably low quality, because it will all be imported, rather than home grown. What a lovely future to look forward to!!!
 
silu said:
( Quote Dry Rot)
Think more than a curry (maybe lamb!)will be necessary. When others are battling to keep animals alive and the posters main gripe is that they can't ride out..aaawww. Never heard of a shovel?
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We have spent a total of well over 30 hours clearing snow from our own and farmers gateways with shovels to enable us to get out over the fields. This is what is still in our road. Now why don't you grab a shovel and come and help me clear this drift? It's only 400 metres long.

www.diaryoface.blogspot.com/2013/03/digging-our-way-out-today.html


ps it was a lamb rogon josh. Lovely it was too.
 
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Dolcé;11666229 said:
Oh well, when all the farmers and landowners have sold up to developers, because they can't make an honest living, we won't have to worry about sheep and snow drifts, neglect of farm animals, getting out on country roads etc. All the green space will have been built on, there will be no homelessness, no horses/sheep/cattle/hay grown, the tiniest field will be rented to the odd horse owner at an absolute premium but the roads will be far too busy for them to ride out. Food might be a bit expensive, and probably low quality, because it will all be imported, rather than home grown. What a lovely future to look forward to!!!
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Very true.

There is such a lot of bad feeling towards farmers on this forum generally, not just they neglect their animals but also they charge too much for hay/straw/grazing/whatever. Why is that? Is it because as horse owners we are reliant on them to an extent and reliance causes negativity?

Farmers tend not to be overly sentimental about their animals but that shouldn't be confused with lack of care or feeling towards them. Not all, I know, like not all gypsies neglect their horses. The overweight labrador living in a flat and ambling round the park once a day might be 'more loved' by its owner than a working collie, but who do you think has the better lifestyle? The collie may sleep in a barn or a kennel and probably doesn't get luxury food but which is more fulfilled?
 
Clodagh said:
Very true.

There is such a lot of bad feeling towards farmers on this forum generally, not just they neglect their animals but also they charge too much for hay/straw/grazing/whatever. Why is that? Is it because as horse owners we are reliant on them to an extent and reliance causes negativity?

Farmers tend not to be overly sentimental about their animals but that shouldn't be confused with lack of care or feeling towards them. Not all, I know, like not all gypsies neglect their horses. The overweight labrador living in a flat and ambling round the park once a day might be 'more loved' by its owner than a working collie, but who do you think has the better lifestyle? The collie may sleep in a barn or a kennel and probably doesn't get luxury food but which is more fulfilled?
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And I wonder just how many of those who complain about the price of forage/bedding etc actually have a clue about the amount of work that goes into making it. If they think they can do it better then they should get out there, buy (or even try tendering, now THAT is an eye opener) a farm and 'live the dream', the reality would have them selling up in no time I think and scarpering back to a 9 til 5 with guaranteed wage and no worries about getting a harvest in, getting animals up to weight to sell for meat, getting a fair price for crop or stock, and that is not to mention the day to day sheer hard work (and expense) of just maintaining buildings and land. Our farmers should be applauded and supported!
 
gadetra said:
True. I always have hope that the general population understand farming, and the crazy, uninformed uneducated views of 'how it should be' reside in the further reaches of irrationality. This has not been the case, in this thread anyway. Sad is what it is unfortunately.
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Don't despair gadetra. We have an answer for the crazies and the uninformed. Look no further than the Countryside Alliance, the people who do know what they're talking about :)
 
Trinity Fox said:
I am glad you have brought this up,I am fed up of looking at sheep near us lame, left out in all weathers with no feed shelter.
Huge sheds standing empty and food on site sheep screaming at me when they see me feeding horses.

When we had the bad snow a couple of years ago we were left feeding sheep as the person who owned them used to come and check on them every couple of months if that.
There is even a person who has been banned who is keeping them in somebody else's name, I know not all farmers are like this but we see so much sheer neglect and my dad always comments he does not want to comeback as a sheep in another life.

Half of them near us do not even do basic checking we are always having to get them up on there feet after being down for so long and gassing up,we have also found them with eyes pecked out etc so the fact many were not brought in does not surprise me in the least.
It is very frustrating and depressing.:(
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This is a welfare issue, all animals need attention, feed and water, report them to RSPCA.
Bringing sheep / cattle inside in less than ideal conditions can easily lead to pneumonia, they are usually best outside with hay.
Ewes due to lamb need extra grub, most farmers will feed them as an economic necessity.
If eyes are being pecked out on live ewes, report to the farmer immediately, and say you will retun to animal, if no response, report immediately. I did this, the farm was part of an RSPB reserve!!!! the RSPCA turned up, but not before the farmer tried to run me down with his lorry, lol. I survived!!!
 
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Clodagh said:
Very true.

There is such a lot of bad feeling towards farmers on this forum generally, not just they neglect their animals but also they charge too much for hay/straw/grazing/whatever. Why is that? Is it because as horse owners we are reliant on them to an extent and reliance causes negativity?

Farmers tend not to be overly sentimental about their animals but that shouldn't be confused with lack of care or feeling towards them. Not all, I know, like not all gypsies neglect their horses. The overweight labrador living in a flat and ambling round the park once a day might be 'more loved' by its owner than a working collie, but who do you think has the better lifestyle? The collie may sleep in a barn or a kennel and probably doesn't get luxury food but which is more fulfilled?
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Great post.

I do however love my working dogs more than any pet I have even had. They are my work mates, my company, they give their all for me and to me a good sheep dog is an utterly amazing thing.

Ffi and Mist now sadly retired (deaf and blind respectively at nearly 13 and 10, they were 12 and 9 in this video).

http://youtu.be/aUIugOdy7l8
 
YorksG said:
cptrays, surely by your own standards, if you don't like the conditions where you live, you should just move?
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When I can't cope in heavy snow, which we get several times most winters, any more, as will happen when we are too old, we will move.

The only thing unusual about this weather for us and the sheep farmers around us, is the timing, which is once in about 12 years, and this year, the fact that our Council chose not to replace their snowblowers once they got old. In consequence Cheshire ratepayers are now paying a fortune to have gangs of men working all Easter Weekend to clear compacted snow. They can do a around 10m an hour, when a blower will do 100m an hour.

I hope this answered your question? Meanwhile am I not allowed to point out to a previous poster that being told to get a shovel out is not quite to the point?
 
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FfionWinnie said:
I wonder where the lamb came from to make the curry:confused:

No matter. Once there are no farmers we can have dog curry, rat curry and cat curry. Yum yum. Won't be able to have horse curry as no affordable forage or bedding to keep them on.
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My alternative choice is vegetable biryani which I enjoy just as much. Meat is a nice luxury, not an essential. There are at least two major world religions which are vegetarian. Meat is not a requirement for human health.

If we were to stop breeding beef cattle, lamb and pork and all adopt a vegetarian diet the price of horse bedding would drop through the floor because there would be so much less competitive use for shavings or straw.
 
cptrayes said:
....... There are at least two major world religions which are vegetarian. Meat is not a requirement for human health.

.......
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You're right, and neither is religion! :p

So now we're on to food. I know quite a few veggies, and they all have that sallow and shrunken look. They look so pasty and ashen. Don't get me wrong now, their lovely people, all of them, but they just don't look to be rude with health.

Alec.
 
Alec Swan said:
You're right, and neither is religion! :p

So now we're on to food. I know quite a few veggies, and they all have that sallow and shrunken look. They look so pasty and ashen. Don't get me wrong now, their lovely people, all of them, but they just don't look to be rude with health.

Alec.
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I wasn't going to take the discussion in this direction Alec, but since you have, there is plenty of evidence that a meat free diet would result in a much healthier population with lower rates of heart disease and bowel cancer the principle, but not only, benefits.
 
FfionWinnie said:
Great post.

I do however love my working dogs more than any pet I have even had. They are my work mates, my company, .......
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My collies, over the years are the only people of whom I've never tired. The film at 3 mins 30, with the dog facing the ewe with her lamb. POWER!! A dog which wont face down, or stand up to a sheep, is of no use to me. I need strength in a dog. That dog of yours has it, in abundance!!

Alec.
 
cptrayes said:
My alternative choice is vegetable biryani which I enjoy just as much. Meat is a nice luxury, not an essential. There are at least two major world religions which are vegetarian. Meat is not a requirement for human health.

If we were to stop breeding beef cattle, lamb and pork and all adopt a vegetarian diet the price of horse bedding would drop through the floor because there would be so much less competitive use for shavings or straw.
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And the countryside would revert to scrubland without anything to graze it...
 
cptrayes said:
My alternative choice is vegetable biryani which I enjoy just as much. Meat is a nice luxury, not an essential. There are at least two major world religions which are vegetarian. Meat is not a requirement for human health.

If we were to stop breeding beef cattle, lamb and pork and all adopt a vegetarian diet the price of horse bedding would drop through the floor because there would be so much less competitive use for shavings or straw.
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Dream on. Most grain is used for animal feed. Without that market for the grain, or replacement of fertility from the manure, there will BE no straw. Shavings you might still get, true, but with no straw the competition for the already at times restricted supply of wood mass given increasing competition from power stations and biomass boilers will result in still higher prices than the high ones there are today.

Enjoy your turnips
 
Bloody hell what is going on on here? We hate farmers and then some think we all should turn veggie!? Not in my world! Just getting the very locally produced steak out to cook on the griddle, had a very hard day looking after my animals and other things (venturing to Wales to help others). I may be tired but satisfied.:)
 
Dry Rot said:
Red meat is an essential ingredient for the formation of brain tissue.

Anyone who doubts that need only read this thread.:eek:
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Like!

As for the rain forest...read in the paper today that a shortage of chocolate is comnig up, thats more important than steak, with this ''global warming'' can't we start growing it here?
 
CaveCanem said:
Here's a newspaper piece about a farmer and his wife, a vet.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/headlines/vet-wife-and-farmer-husband-on-weather-misery-1-4954508

Interesting points about the problems associated with lambing indoors.
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An interesting and thought provoking article. All so often "Lambing in", is offered as the answer, but it's only a partial response. The problems associated with "In" as opposed to "Out", are different and varied, and though I've lambed countless thousands of ewes, "In", for others, my own are always "Out".

Watery Mouth is preventable, though immediate action must be taken, at birth. Twin Lamb, can strike any ewe at any time, and again if it's caught early enough, it's eminently treatable, with Ketosis and breakfast in bed!!

The trick with all the lambing "In" problems, is preempting the strike.
—————

Though voices have been raised here, most points, however they've been received should be considered. The natural environment which has been formed by sheep, and those who keep them, should be maintained and encouraged. With the possible exception of those who own Chatsworth, I don't know anyone who's what I'd call rich, and keeps sheep.

The Shepherd's life, is a way of life, and it's a pastoral existence, and we have highs and we have lows, and those who can't continue following the recent dreadful times, will be replaced by those who have youth, and ambition, and energy, and I pray that they will receive all the support that they need.

Despite the ire, I've rather enjoyed this thread. I've a greater insight into others, for which I thank them. ;)

Alec.
 
cptrayes said:
My alternative choice is vegetable biryani which I enjoy just as much. Meat is a nice luxury, not an essential. There are at least two major world religions which are vegetarian. Meat is not a requirement for human health.

If we were to stop breeding beef cattle, lamb and pork and all adopt a vegetarian diet the price of horse bedding would drop through the floor because there would be so much less competitive use for shavings or straw.
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Straw is a by product of the production of grain. Only the very best grain is used to feed humans. The vast majority is used to feed animals.

So there would be very little straw around.

Farmers don't use shavings. Some use sawdust but that's untreated from the mill stuff not fancy horsey stuff.

Any affordable forage is made by farmers because they have the machinery to make it and are making it for their livestock anyway. Cattle particularly will eat poor quality forage that horses won't touch.

So you could choose between marksway and horsehage probably. Which is rather expensive even now.
 
Alec Swan said:
My collies, over the years are the only people of whom I've never tired. The film at 3 mins 30, with the dog facing the ewe with her lamb. POWER!! A dog which wont face down, or stand up to a sheep, is of no use to me. I need strength in a dog. That dog of yours has it, in abundance!!

Alec.
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Yes he has plenty of power but unfortunately he is also as thick as mince :D. He is not in the same league as the other two.

He couldn't have got this gimmer in because he would have been at it like a bull in a china shop and she would have broken back to the flock. Power is importent but they need more than just power. These girls have power and everything I want in a dog. I have one daughter of the merle and two of her grand daughters out of the red one, to take over from them. If they are half as good I will be lucky (and happy!).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poPniomG5wY

And this was a dog that could move an elephant. Unfortunately he got his leg broken moving cattle (which he finished moving before he would give up). He never recovered from the break which was in a bad place. Not sure I will ever get over the loss of him and I won't work a dog on cattle now hence I bought a cattle horse.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2XKbkLo3fo
 
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