Fat horse, wwyd

[fankino04]

My 17 year old Welsh x mare has been retired for many many years ( my loss of confidence and a stifle / si injury). She lives out 24/7 and for the past 7 years or so I've been very vigilant about her weight ( she lives on fresh air), which was fairly easy to do whilst she was on individual grazing but I always felt bad for her and that she should be part of a herd ( previous livery didn't allow this). Last year I moved her to a new place that was herd turnout and I'm so pleased at her " being a horse". The problem is there's much more grass available here and much harder to manage her when the others also have to be accommodated ( it's full grass livery so I don't get a say in things). The problem is that although I hoped that bigger fields and friends would see her move more and maybe manage her weight herself better it hasn't, she came out of winter far too good and has ballooned since. Everyone keeps telling me she's fine and I don't know what to do. 24/7 turnout is so hard to find round here and I really don't want to go back to having her stabled especially as so many yards don't allow winter turnout, but likewise I don't want to feel like I'm doing nothing and just waiting for something bad to happen before I'm taken seriously about her weight. She'd make professional show ponies look fit at the moment.

 

[Nudibranch]

I think the full grass livery with no say is the issue so I'd really consider a move. I suppose the ideal solution would be one of the track retirement liveries but unless you happen to be near to one of them, she would be away from you. Staying where she is, the only other option to reduce grazing would be a muzzle but I'm personally not a fan at all. Tracks work. They're just not possible for many which is a shame.

 

[fankino04]

I think the full grass livery with no say is the issue so I'd really consider a move. I suppose the ideal solution would be one of the track retirement liveries but unless you happen to be near to one of them, she would be away from you. Staying where she is, the only other option to reduce grazing would be a muzzle but I'm personally not a fan at all. Tracks work. They're just not possible for many which is a shame.

There is a track livery fairly close by but it's 3x the price! Tried a muzzle and she ripped it off. Really don't want to put her back into individual paddock but there are so few grazing options round here. I will try messaging YO again to see if there's other options but they seem to think I'm worrying over nothing. The other worry about track systems is that she can get nasty with others if she feels there's not enough food and I worry if it's narrow on the track that could end up in actual fights.

 

[maya2008]

Muzzle her. I have muzzled 24/7 in the past with no issues (bucket muzzles) and it did the job!

Some muzzles are harder to get off, and you can put a leather head collar over the top.

 

[webble]

Muzzle her. I have muzzled 24/7 in the past with no issues (bucket muzzles) and it did the job!

Doing that would mean she cant groom and remove one of the benefits of being in a herd

 

[Nudibranch]

The track herd systems I've seen use much wider tracks than I would at home so there appears to be plenty of space to move out of the way of one another. They also have ad lib hay in several stations so again they can access what they need without massive issues. But 3 times the price is a bit off putting! Can you involve your vet (diplomatically)?

 

[meleeka]

Doing that would mean she cant groom and remove one of the benefits of being in a herd

I don’t like muzzles either but if it’s a choice of that or laminitis, I’d do it.

OP there are lots of different types of muzzle, so you might have to do research to find one that’s harder to remove/damage.

Can you get her exercising? Obviously she’s retired, but long reining can still be beneficial, even in walk if you are creative.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Doing that would mean she cant groom and remove one of the benefits of being in a herd

Some ponies seem to manage to groom in a muzzle! There are other benefits to herd turnout, too. OP, I would try a few different muzzles to find the best one for your mare and if you really can't find one that works give the track system a try.

 

[Brownmare]

Can you lead her out in hand for a bit of exercise? It doesn't take much to speed up the metabolism and get everything working better, a brisk 30 min walk every day will help. I would put a muzzle on too, not ideal I agree, but still much better than laminitis and solitary confinement! Try different makes of muzzle to find the one that works best and plaiting her mane into her forelock over the top of the headpiece will stop her pulling it off.

 

[ester]

On livery I muzzled mine so he could have company, once the skinny TB has eaten most of the grass he had it off so he could tidy up the edges the TB didn't eat.

when his friend left he had a mini track instead and that's also how they are managed at home.

 

[Lipglosspukka]

Hmmm, I'm undecided about this. I have an older one (older than yours) who is retired and he gets fat. He's never had any history of laminitis. I just allow him to get fat in the summer. I figure, quality over quantity. I want him to enjoy his life. Scoff the grass, run with his herd etc. He drops back over winter because he's unrugged and he's not supplemented with hard feed, just some hay. If he were to start getting bouts of lami then would I keep him going and change his routine? I'm not so sure.

I just find seeing retired ponies, kept miserable with postage stamp sized bare paddocks, grazing muzzles, no friends, permanantly hungry a real sorry existence.

If you can find a happy medium where she is out grazing on poorer quality grazing with other horses with similar dietary needs then that would be good, but I wouldn't personally lose sleep over her getting a bit porky.

 

[ester]

Our happy medium is that at 28 his teeth are pants enough that he quids out half the grass he picks.

with regards to muzzles he's always had time in with ad lib hay so as not to be hungry but that would be tricky on grass livery.

TBH I really would investigate the track livery option.

 

[JackFrost]

Agree with Lipgloss, as quality of life is important. I had an old fat welsh, lived to a good age and never had laminitis or weight related problems. The thinking now is that lami is connected to other metabolic issues, so weight won't affect all horses in the same way. A key thing may be to get your horse to drop a lot of weight in winter, as this seems to have protective effect against summer fatness. If this horse has never shown lami before, you may be lucky and have one that isn't prone to it even when fat.

ETA - I've also heard it said by 'old farmer' types that it is not just the fatness but also what the horse is eating - on old rough pasture of mixed native grasses fat horses don't tend to get lami, but they will suffer on modern pastures of richer grass.

 

[AmyMay]

Doing that would mean she cant groom and remove one of the benefits of being in a herd

Or she could simply get laminitis....

 

[brighteyes]

Quality of life. I am hoping to brave enough to give my fatty pony a summer of stuffing his face when he is no longer in work and if the dreaded laminitis strikes (PPID and EMS positive) let him go.

 

[ester]

It's tricky, when he was in his younger twenties I did say I'd turn Frank out in a field with a herd of geldings for retirement and he could take his chances.
But in the end I couldn't do it, it felt like I would be signing his death warrant via certain pain. But I do have the advantage of not being on livery so care can be pretty tailored so long as mum's on board.

 

[fankino04]

Agree with Lipgloss, as quality of life is important. I had an old fat welsh, lived to a good age and never had laminitis or weight related problems. The thinking now is that lami is connected to other metabolic issues, so weight won't affect all horses in the same way. A key thing may be to get your horse to drop a lot of weight in winter, as this seems to have protective effect against summer fatness. If this horse has never shown lami before, you may be lucky and have one that isn't prone to it even when fat.

ETA - I've also heard it said by 'old farmer' types that it is not just the fatness but also what the horse is eating - on old rough pasture of mixed native grasses fat horses don't tend to get lami, but they will suffer on modern pastures of richer grass.

In places before the last one I never got so hung up on her weight and she's never shown any signs of lami so when I moved here I hoped that she was one of those that just wouldn't get it, she's never carried so much on her neck and shoulders as she is now though so I'm worrying that if I don't intervene then something bad might happen but I might just be doom mongering and she'd be fine left as a fatty. Oh to be rich and have my own place so I can set things up just right for her.

 

[Coblover63]

I've got a good-doer traditional cob mare and she's been on individual restricted grazing for the past couple of years. I thought she was happy(ish) but she was diagnosed with ulcers earlier this year. So back in March I moved her to a yard with herd turnout and she is now muzzled. I have to say that she seems far happier being back out with other horses wearing the muzzle than being in her own without it. There is always a compromise and you have to do the best you can for them. We don't all have our own property and a huge pot of money, but that doesn't mean we love and care for them less.

 

[JackFrost]

Quality of life. I am hoping to brave enough to give my fatty pony a summer of stuffing his face when he is no longer in work and if the dreaded laminitis strikes (PPID and EMS positive) let him go.

PPID and EMS are two of the main things that predispose to lami- both can be vet tested. If your mare does not show these, I think the risk of lami is considerably reduced, and in your shoes I would leave her as she is but just keep a careful watch. PPID is usually best tested in sept/oct, but I think you can get a meaningful result at this time of year - speak to your vet.
If her neck at the top is hard and cresty, kind of swollen and very firm when you press it, this is a sign you need to act quickly, that lami may be on its way. Fat and soft/flabby neck is ok.

 

[chaps89]

Hmmm, I'm undecided about this. I have an older one (older than yours) who is retired and he gets fat. He's never had any history of laminitis. I just allow him to get fat in the summer. I figure, quality over quantity. I want him to enjoy his life. Scoff the grass, run with his herd etc. He drops back over winter because he's unrugged and he's not supplemented with hard feed, just some hay. If he were to start getting bouts of lami then would I keep him going and change his routine? I'm not so sure.

I just find seeing retired ponies, kept miserable with postage stamp sized bare paddocks, grazing muzzles, no friends, permanantly hungry a real sorry existence.

If you can find a happy medium where she is out grazing on poorer quality grazing with other horses with similar dietary needs then that would be good, but I wouldn't personally lose sleep over her getting a bit porky.

This with bells on.
Ultimately you have to be able to keep your horse somewhere.
If you can't find somewhere that suits (quality of life if stabled 24/7 in winter, too fat/lami if out 24/7 and/or given ad-lib hay, or too expensive - the track livery) then a compromise has to be made.
In this instance I'd personally go for quality of life, try and manage as best I can, trying different muzzles etc but be prepared to pts if a laminitis bout develops.
That said, I didn't retire my mare for entirely this reason, she needed a heck of alot of management to control her weight/EMS, that was a lifestyle that wasn't justifiable for a retired pet, 24/7 turnout wasn't appropriate and I couldn't justify the cost of sending her on track livery, so she was pts on a sunny day full of treats having had a few days with her muzzle off.
If you can't find somewhere to keep her that works for both of you (and trust me, with mine I tried everything/everywhere!) and horse is retired, it's not the worst thing to consider either imho.

 

[laura_nash]

I wouldn't be too panicked about a retired horse with no history of laminitis being a bit overweight at this time of year. As others said you have to balance quality of life. She needs to lose it again at some point though as she can't just keep getting bigger and coming out of this winter a bit too well isn't encouraging on that front.

It depends a bit why she did so well over winter. If they have adlib hay and shes just standing at the bale eating thats not good and if nothing can be done she may have to move.

IMO you either try and maintain the same weight all year around or, particularly if out of work or light work, you let them put on in spring/autumn and lose in winter/summer. What you can't do is let them put on in spring/autumn and then supplementary feed in winter/summer so they don't lose it again.

 

[irishdraft]

It's a very difficult one I have an extremely good doer who is virtually retired with ringbone . I am lucky I have him at home so can manage his grazing but even so he is overweight but keeping him stabled or in a bare paddock really upsets him as he has to be on his own as my other horse is not a good doer. I think mentally he needs to be grazing and out with the others otherwise what life is it for them imo, so I'm afraid I go with it although it know some may disagree I know my horse is very happy with his lot so that is what is important to me .

 

[SantaVera]

My 17 year old Welsh x mare has been retired for many many years ( my loss of confidence and a stifle / si injury). She lives out 24/7 and for the past 7 years or so I've been very vigilant about her weight ( she lives on fresh air), which was fairly easy to do whilst she was on individual grazing but I always felt bad for her and that she should be part of a herd ( previous livery didn't allow this). Last year I moved her to a new place that was herd turnout and I'm so pleased at her " being a horse". The problem is there's much more grass available here and much harder to manage her when the others also have to be accommodated ( it's full grass livery so I don't get a say in things). The problem is that although I hoped that bigger fields and friends would see her move more and maybe manage her weight herself better it hasn't, she came out of winter far too good and has ballooned since. Everyone keeps telling me she's fine and I don't know what to do. 24/7 turnout is so hard to find round here and I really don't want to go back to having her stabled especially as so many yards don't allow winter turnout, but likewise I don't want to feel like I'm doing nothing and just waiting for something bad to happen before I'm taken seriously about her weight. She'd make professional show ponies look fit at the moment.

have you spoken to the YO? can you restrict her grazing for the summer? maybe they'll let you put up a taped off area to diet her in.

 

[Melody Grey]

Muzzle her. I have muzzled 24/7 in the past with no issues (bucket muzzles) and it did the job!

Some muzzles are harder to get off, and you can put a leather head collar over the top.

....and sometimes a fly mask over the top makes them more difficult to dislodge!

 

[Melody Grey]

Is your horse sound enough/ tolerant enough for walks out OP? Might help move a little weight if she’s up to it?

ETA: in hand I mean!

 

[Melandmary]

I have turned my mare out in a muzzle, she is recovering from lami and prefers being turned out with her companions to being on a small bare paddock. She is managing to mutual groom by rubbing here muzzle on their backs.... It appears to be quite a good scratcher ?. I have a similar issue with one of her companions who lives out 24/7 now as she won't stay in a stable. She is getting quite fat and I am worried about how I would be able to manage it if she did get lami. I have started inhand walking her. I may have to resort to muzzling her full time too ?