Fear and sort of aggression - what can we do?

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bex1984

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Recently Stan has started snapping at other dogs when on his lead - by snapping I mean snarling and growling. It seems to be fear related as it is only dogs that are bigger than him, he greets them fine, then his tail will go between his legs and he'll suddenly snap.

It doesn't matter if he knows the dog - this morning he met a collie he has been playing with in the local park off lead since Stan was 12 weeks old. Today they were on lead because the council have decided that our local park needs bulldozing for football pitches + they leave all the gates to the main road open....anyway...enough ranting about that...Dogs said hello fine, then Stan snapped at Collie :(

We're keeping relaxed about it, in a not wanting to add stress to a situation sort of way, so stayed and talked to collie's owner for a bit, then walked off round the park: cue (obese) big black Lab bounding over, tail wagging, so I quickly let Stan off his lead and they played together for the next 15 mins, no problems. Put him back on his lead to go home, Lab came to sniff him again, Stan snapped.

So it's very much an on-lead thing, I'm guessing it's coming from feeling a bit nervous and 'trapped'. He was attacked 6 months ago by a large dog - it was a seriously traumatic experience and he has always done this with dogs that look like his attacker, but now it seems to be most big dogs, even his friends.

I'm not sure what I should do when he snaps? should I be telling him off? Is there anything I can do to work on this? I'm wondering if he's going through a bit of a teenager faze of finding his place in the world and feeling insecure? He really hasn't met many new dogs over the winter but we're now back to walkies meeting lots of dogs now it's light in evenings and mornings.

sorry - very long post!! Didn't mean for it to be this long!
 
Can you get him to a good training class, where he can socialise with other dogs, but the owners will be a bit more understanding, and it will be a more controlled environment?

I thought I was doing all the right things when my dog was aggressive, but it took someone else's eyes to tell me I was right off cue when trying to correct/resolve the issue.

Also, dogs do air-snap sometimes - he's never actually bitten another dog, right?
 
No, never bitten, and by snapping I mean vocally snapping, I don't think he wants to touch the other dog TBH, he just wants it to keep a distance and I guess he's trying to control the situation.

He's due to start agility soon, do you think that will help? Am hoping it will help his confidence and focus. We have a good dog school round the corner, I might book him in for some more sessions, he did his puppy course there but we didn't go back for more as he has always been so good :( He approaches other dogs really nicely, all good signals, but there must be something that's making him nervous. As soon as he steps away from them he is back to wanting to play again!
 
How old is Stan and is he entire?

No, you shouldn't tell him off when he growls/snarls/snaps......this is his WARNING to the other dog.....take that away and he may learn to go straight for the bite.

Assuming there is no physical/pain problem (vet check?), then I would be looking to do two things. Firstly, let him off lead if a dog comes running up.....that way he can flee if he feels uncomfortable - being on the leash removes that possibility. Also, I would start taking control of the situation....if an unknown dog runs up to mine, I try and read its body language and if in any doubt I let it know in no uncertain terms that it is not welcome. This will a) hopefully, stop the intruder in its tracks b) give the owner (assuming they are anywhere within a 10 mile radius) a kick up the rear to do something about their dog and c) give my dogs the confidence that I will protect them.

When I get the 'oh, but he only wants to be friends' refrain I counter with the 'yes, but mine aren't dog-friendly....I don't want yours to end up at the vets like the last one that rudely ran up to them.' A total lie, but makes most reclaim their pooch PDQ and disappear. :D
 
That's the thing with puppy classes, puppies are easy, it's when they hit a year and they turn into chavvy teens, when you need the help :p

He will need to be under control and not arsey at agility lessons too, which is fine if he is defending himself and not just going for other dogs.

As GGD says, do step in if you think things are going too far, I will actually step in front of my dog if I see another dog bombing over to him as I know he will start acting the way Stan is acting. Obviously when your dog is the size my dog is, people just think he is a thug.
I used to tense up and reel in the lead, so he thought I needed protecting so that put even more pressure on him. Being physically protective is a stronger signal that everything will be OK.

I really like this article :)
http://flyingdogpress.com/content/view/42/70/
 
gunnergundog said:
How old is Stan and is he entire?

When I get the 'oh, but he only wants to be friends' refrain I counter with the 'yes, but mine aren't dog-friendly....I don't want yours to end up at the vets like the last one that rudely ran up to them.' A total lie, but makes most reclaim their pooch PDQ and disappear. :D
Click to expand...

Not a line I can use with mine sadly - people assume that as I have 2 staffies they are devil dogs waiting to attack and savage their dogs...
 
He is 13 months and was chopped at 7 months.

I let him off lead when the Lab approached this morning and he was absolutely fine - if he's uncomfortable his tail goes between his legs and he moves away - if I see his tail go between his legs I sometimes do a cheery recall, and distract him with some sitting, high 5-ing etc.

It makes sense about not telling him off, I haven't wanted to tell him off because I haven't wanted to 'heighten' the situation. I have just moved him away and asked the other dog's owner to remove their dog.

He has really grown up in the last few months and doesn't seem to be existing as 'mad puppy' anymore - it's like (and this is across his whole life) he now thinks before he acts, doesn't exist just on adrenalin, and is more cautious, whereas he used to just be fearless, running up to any dog or person and launching himself at them!

Because of what's happened to our park, he is having to be on lead more than he ever has been - really being on lead on a walk is a new experience for him. Fortunately we found a new park, with around 15 regular dog walkers, all dogs off lead together at the same time, which is great for him, he plays with everything from yorkies to dobermans!

This is only happening when a big dog is almost on top of him when he's on lead, so like you say I might just need to take control and avoid those situations...
 
CaveCanem said:
That's the thing with puppy classes, puppies are easy, it's when they hit a year and they turn into chavvy teens, when you need the help :p

He will need to be under control and not arsey at agility lessons too, which is fine if he is defending himself and not just going for other dogs.

As GGD says, do step in if you think things are going too far, I will actually step in front of my dog if I see another dog bombing over to him as I know he will start acting the way Stan is acting. Obviously when your dog is the size my dog is, people just think he is a thug.
I used to tense up and reel in the lead, so he thought I needed protecting so that put even more pressure on him. Being physically protective is a stronger signal that everything will be OK.

I really like this article :)
http://flyingdogpress.com/content/view/42/70/
Click to expand...

He is absolutely in defense mode, I can't imagine that Stan would EVER go for/approach and be anything other than playmates with another dog. When he was attacked, he was off lead but was cornered, out of the blue, picked up, shaken, bitten, pinned down - it was really horrible and I'm sure this is what he is scared of.

Funnily enough I have been putting myself between him and the other dog, I sort of want him to learn that even on lead he can put himself behind my legs as an escape, rather than having to shout at the other dog.
 
Luci07 said:
Not a line I can use with mine sadly - people assume that as I have 2 staffies they are devil dogs waiting to attack and savage their dogs...
Click to expand...

Try 'they've got sarcoptic mange .......Would hate yours to get it!' :D

We used to get pestered by a GLP and the owner would do naff all about this dog running up, even though he has competed her in working tests. I used the sarcoptic mange line and amazingly a month or so later he can now heel walk his dog past mine without it mugging them!!!!
 
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CaveCanem said:
I really like this article :)
http://flyingdogpress.com/content/view/42/70/
Click to expand...

Those articles are fantastic CC - I keep going back to them and they make so much sense :)

If he has to be on a lead why not try a long line, that way he has much more freedom to get away and may not feel so trapped. You can then gradually shorten the length you allow him as he gets more confident. I would also go back to classes if only for the "controlled" socialisation side of things
 
CaveCanem said:
I used to tense up and reel in the lead, so he thought I needed protecting so that put even more pressure on him. Being physically protective is a stronger signal that everything will be OK.

I really like this article :)
http://flyingdogpress.com/content/view/42/70/
Click to expand...

I used to do this with Brig (he was forever being attacked). It's rare he needs to be on the lead but if he is and another dog bombs over to say hi, he will snap sometimes, especially if I tense up.

I'm going to read the article. Pups are both on the lead (til we decide what to do with Bear and if we should x-ray him too) so I need to learn some relaxation techniques! So far, the best technique has been to walk past problems quickly-no barking, no looking, no problems!

Dogs running up can't be controlled by me, tho so I'm afraid plenty of people will get told to recall their dog: I really don't care if they think I'm nasty, Id rather have my dogs safe.
 
Hilarious scenarios she presents! All so true. This really reinforces what Brig has been doing with the puppies. I stupidly told him off the first few times cos I thought he was too aggressive, but there were never any injuries and now he's allowed to tell them to get lost. To be fair, he's extremely tolerant (well-socialised!) and rarely tells them.

The trouble is, in public places, it's hard to get other people to do what you know to be best ie get your rude dog out of my dog's face!
 
It took three burly guys to point and say 'Do you even realise the messages you are sending to that dog?!' when I was crying my eyes out worried he was going to eat every dog on the training field.
He still has issues. And they are pretty much all my fault. I didn't cause the initial insecurity but I really, really haven't helped it get better.

It's a great article and I wish I had read it three years ago.
 
I'm so glad I read that, and also made OH read it.

In addition to that, a few of the experienced dog owners we know have seen Stan's recent behaviour over the past few days and have pointed out that he's just setting out some boundaries to other dogs while he's on his lead. I think we're going to avoid putting him in that situation for a while, by watching his body launguage closely and stepping in - and we've definitely decided that he's not coming to badminton XC day this year!! I took him for a short on-lead walk alongside another dog the other day, he was absolutely fine, it really only seems to be a response when the other dog oversteps some sort of dog personal boundary.

I'm sure Stan is having a bit of a teenager phase at the moment, but rather than being naughty he is being a bit under-confident - I'm hoping that starting agility will help that a bit? On the plus side, his recall is spot on at the moment, his walking to heel is excellent, so it's much easier to have him off-lead more of the time :)
 
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