Fear of canter/every horse seems to tank off

[I don’t like mondays]

Hi, my daughter has had intermittent confidence issues the whole time she’s riding (about 6 years) which stem from being tanked off with years ago at a riding school. She can (mostly) cope with rears, bucks and napping but being tanked off with has always worried her and as soon as it happens her confidence is on the floor. Our recent pony has now tanked off with her in canter and she’s really upset and fell off (I wasn’t there so didn’t see it). Looking back, every horse she’s ridden has actually tanked off in canter with her (like skidding round the corners, going round the arena several times out of control). What is she doing that’s causing this? When it happens she tends to freeze and lean forward but what causes this in the first place? She’s not overly nervous until there’s a tanking off then she is. It’s a vicious circle because the more it happens the more she’s worried the next time and so on. She’s shared/loan/owned various horses and they all end up tanking (and so we end up moving on as she can’t cope with it and it only gets worse). Even when we went to try a pony to buy at tanked and then she had a nasty fall. She’s a teen and a nice balanced rider, independent aids when she’s confident etc. Thanks

 

[J&S]

I would suggest it is a build up of nervous tension in her, as a rider. Instead of relaxing confidently into the canter pace she is anticipating trouble, tightening her muscles, holding on and actually frightening the pony. At worst case scenario the pony will feel he has a "tiger" on his back! She would perhaps benefit from some lessons on the lunge with a good instructor and
a nice school master pony.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

I would hazard a guess that as the pony goes into canter, rider perhaps grips with lower leg, then tips forwards, both of which are encouraging pony to speed up. Rider panics and wont sit up, but tenses up more.

Can you get her some lessons on the lunge to get a more secure independent seat?

Edit, J&S, you beat me to it!

 

[I don’t like mondays]

I think you are both right. It’s crazy that looking back every single horse has done this (even the ploddiest sorts). She must give off certain vibes. Riding schools seem to have 6 month wait lists but I’ll contact a few

I wonder if this is something that can ever be overcome. We had a horse once that was lovely to canter and daughter was super confident and happy no worries about canter, then all of a sudden he started tanking off with her so we sold him to an adult

 

[Red-1]

Yes, I think it can be overcome. I would third lunge lessons on a schoolmaster. Have her taking lessons until she is confident in canter on the lunge without stirrups.

I used to teach mature adults from novices and they didn't come off the lunge until they were OK without stirrups. I would have them practice cantering, kicking a stirrup out then re-gaining it. I would also have them practice an emergency stop, so they knew they could. They would do enough on the lunge that I was confident they were in control of themselves, then would take the lunge rein off and have them do the same circle but independently.

That is what I would do with your daughter.

If the pony is not a baby, I would also have the pony taught to lunge so they can then practice together in a safe and supported way.

 

[JackFrost]

Try videoing her in canter, so you can slow it down and look at exactly what she is doing, and get more eyes on it to spot the issue. I'd guess something very specific is causing it. Possibilities could be gripping on with the heels or giving mixed stop-go messages at the same time. They may not be 'tanking off' so much as responding to her (inadvertant) cues to keep going faster.
Do they tank off in an otherwise controlled quiet lesson? What is her style of riding? -Some teens have 'fun' riding ponies very forward, which could set up this kind of behaviour.

 

[maya2008]

I had a sharer, years ago, who came to me to ride my TB after going to see multiple ponies to buy and being run off with, at every single viewing. She wasn’t balanced, she was gripping to stay on rather than sitting naturally (and even then she wasn’t quite right). At first glance she looked fine, so every instructor had said she had a lovely seat… but take her stirrups away and it was more obvious…bareback it was glaringly so. My mare parked up and said she was going nowhere fast until someone fixed the kid!

Many lessons, quite a few months and many hours of exercises later, and she was a different rider. She went on to have her own pony and to be absolutely fine. She just needed my sweet, patient mare to bear with her while she learned.

 

[Skib]

I cant tell you about your daughter. But I can tell you that this same thing happened to me when I was learnng to canter (I was over 60) and what the cause and cure were in my case.
My first canter the RI rightly said that i was bouncing up and down like a sack of coals. Advice on line was to relax. I breathed deep, relaxed and suddenly I could canter.
But the horses continued to canter. I repeatedly got run away with out hacking. And an experienced RI on a forum suggested this was because my legs, being ultra relaxed, were brushing the side of the horse at every stride and the horse understood this to be a cue to continue in canter.
She suggested that I close my legs against the horse in canter. Beginner riders like me thought that putting ones leg on the horse would ask it to go faster. But wrapping your legs round and down the sides of the horse acts like a brake. Dont let your legs flap against the horse.

Another RI who gave me lessons, showed me another trick, how to canter more slowly from the first stride. One cues and allows the horse forward in canter, but then immediately gently closes one's shoulder blades. This brings back ones shoulders and is enough to put a bit of pressure on the reins, and signal to the horse that a gentle canter is what is needed.

It might cheer your daughter to know, that I always have found it an advantage that horses canter for me so easilly. I used to think it was because horses knew I liked to canter. Some students cant get horses to canter and that makes them miserable about their lessons. At my last RS I met an adult woman like me who had lessons on the same mare and she couldnt ever get that mare to canter.

 

[cold_feet]

One way I managed to teach my very forward boy not to rush off was to do lots of trot/canter transitions. 5 paces trot, 5 canter etc. Then slowly (over days/weeks) up to 10/10, 20/20. So he is always waiting for the downward transition. Worked out hacking, but also in the school.

 

[SEL]

I used to have an electric seat as a child. I'd been in Germany for a few years and started to hang onto the mouth. Return to the UK and riding school ponies weren't used to a tight contact so they'd get wound up and bog off.

Took a while for an instructor to really help me understand I needed to lighten the contact. Sometimes a different instructor can really help.

 

[I don’t like mondays]

Yes, I think it can be overcome. I would third lunge lessons on a schoolmaster. Have her taking lessons until she is confident in canter on the lunge without stirrups.

I used to teach mature adults from novices and they didn't come off the lunge until they were OK without stirrups. I would have them practice cantering, kicking a stirrup out then re-gaining it. I would also have them practice an emergency stop, so they knew they could. They would do enough on the lunge that I was confident they were in control of themselves, then would take the lunge rein off and have them do the same circle but independently.

That is what I would do with your daughter.

If the pony is not a baby, I would also have the pony taught to lunge so they can then practice together in a safe and supported way.

Thanks Red. I wonder if I could lunge my daughter on the pony. Pony is a veteran and knows her stuff

 

[I don’t like mondays]

Try videoing her in canter, so you can slow it down and look at exactly what she is doing, and get more eyes on it to spot the issue. I'd guess something very specific is causing it. Possibilities could be gripping on with the heels or giving mixed stop-go messages at the same time. They may not be 'tanking off' so much as responding to her (inadvertant) cues to keep going faster.
Do they tank off in an otherwise controlled quiet lesson? What is her style of riding? -Some teens have 'fun' riding ponies very forward, which could set up this kind of behaviour.

That’s a great idea. I’m not sure she’ll canter this pony for a while but I might see if I can video her if I can get her into a riding school

She’s a quiet rider I’d say (and instructors say the same). She’s never loved going fast. Her canter seat isn’t the best but I think that’s becusse she’s not cantered in a number of months plus tension

 

[I don’t like mondays]

I had a sharer, years ago, who came to me to ride my TB after going to see multiple ponies to buy and being run off with, at every single viewing. She wasn’t balanced, she was gripping to stay on rather than sitting naturally (and even then she wasn’t quite right). At first glance she looked fine, so every instructor had said she had a lovely seat… but take her stirrups away and it was more obvious…bareback it was glaringly so. My mare parked up and said she was going nowhere fast until someone fixed the kid!

Many lessons, quite a few months and many hours of exercises later, and she was a different rider. She went on to have her own pony and to be absolutely fine. She just needed my sweet, patient mare to bear with her while she learned.

Interesting, I wonder if it’s subtle gripping. This is why I love TBs, your mare sounds an angel. Sounds from all that lunge lessons are the way to go. My teen isn’t keen and won’t accept she could be the issue

 

[JackFrost]

Interesting, I wonder if it’s subtle gripping. This is why I love TBs, your mare sounds an angel. Sounds from all that lunge lessons are the way to go. My teen isn’t keen and won’t accept she could be the issue

It may help your teen to understand that we are all of us the issue, all of the time. The moment we sit on a horse, we affect its way of going. Your teen has a gift for making horses canter fast.
If she will please work out how she does it and share this with us, it will help those of us who struggle to get a decent canter

 

[maya2008]

Interesting, I wonder if it’s subtle gripping. This is why I love TBs, your mare sounds an angel. Sounds from all that lunge lessons are the way to go. My teen isn’t keen and won’t accept she could be the issue

I say to my kids - if that only happens on one pony, maybe it’s the pony/pony-rider specific issues. If it happens on all of them, it is most definitely you!

 

[littleshetland]

I would suggest that she just try to see and feel the canter as nothing more than a change pace. It's no big deal, just a change of pace. I'm guessing here, but I expect as soon as she asks for canter, she shortens her reins right up, starts to grip, and gets into a 'pulling' situation, in which the pony is going to pull back, and away they go! She needs to let go, and use her seat to control the pace...easier said than done! Try getting a really good flatwork/dressage trainer to help her learn to use her seat aids and keep things calm. Good luck!

 

[Sleipnir]

I used to have a "fiery seat" as my instructors would call it.

Turns out it was a misaligned pelvis. A bit of therapy later, no more tanking off at the canter with me.

 

[little_critter]

Maybe put it to her this way, if the issue is her rather than the pony it’s easier to fix. Your daughter can listen and talk, she understands the issue and the desired outcome. The pony doesn’t have this advantage. So her being the ‘problem’ is the better outcome and easier to fix if she has the desire to.

 

[Skib]

One way I managed to teach my very forward boy not to rush off was to do lots of trot/canter transitions. 5 paces trot, 5 canter etc. Then slowly (over days/weeks) up to 10/10, 20/20. So he is always waiting for the downward transition. Worked out hacking, but also in the school.

I too alternate 20 trot 20 canter out hacking. My old Connie favourite learned this counting and I used to vary it to 19 or 21. It never occurred to me that if one counted, the horses moderated the whole canter accordingly. Thank you @cold_feet for that insight.

But I should add to this thread that my learning to love canter out hacking was completely dependent on my Sprenger safety stirrups. I found it really hard when learning sitting canter to prevent my boots slipping forward in the stirrups. But with safety stirrups I gave up caring.

 

[wren123]

Agree with the lunging with a good teacher who can pick up what she's doing wrong.

 

[Chianti]

Have you got a mechanical horse near you? If your daughter is big enough to sit on one then that might help. She can then really relax into the canter and not worry about being tanked off with.

 

[FinnishLapphund]

Interesting, I wonder if it’s subtle gripping. This is why I love TBs, your mare sounds an angel. Sounds from all that lunge lessons are the way to go. My teen isn’t keen and won’t accept she could be the issue

It sounds like the ponies she rides listens to what she actually does, and not to what she think she says to them. I like @little_critter 's take on it, that "if the issue is her rather than the pony it’s easier to fix." But regardless whether she accepts that the problem is with her or not, it is her that has to learn how to handle the situation when her pony doesn't do what she wants.
Besides training on a lunge line, would she be willing to look into the subject of sports psychology either by herself, or by talking to you, or someone else about it? Sounds like she perhaps could benefit from learning about stress management, how to visualize what to do instead of freezing up, and maybe a bit of talk about her motivation to ride etc also couldn't hurt.

 

[I don’t like mondays]

Have you got a mechanical horse near you? If your daughter is big enough to sit on one then that might help. She can then really relax into the canter and not worry about being tanked off with.

That’s a good idea, yes I’ll try that