Feed advise for sugar intolerant mad cob!

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jsr

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As the work load has increased alot for my cob I need to ensure his weight doesn't drop. He's not a typical good doer cob he cannot have anything with molassas or sugar in it, he's on a small amount of haylage mixed with a large amount of hay. He's fed twice a day with 1/2kg alfalfa pellets and 1kg Fast Fibre soaked. He's dropped a tiny bit of weight since getting fitter, most of it has turned to muscle but obviously I'm aware I need to up his feed abit to help maintain the level he's at. I do not want to feed any more in weight of feed as it's soaked it makes a large meal as it is, can anyone recommend a feed that will help with weight but has no sugar or molassas or anything that will make him loopy cos he's already a spooky nutty cob???? :confused:
 
The only thing I can think of is unmollased sugarbeet. My welsh cob is quite lean at the moment but I figure it wont be long till the grass starts coming through then she will turn into a bit of a fatty :0)
 
Add some oil into the diet? That's what is recommended for endurance horses to get them the extra calories and energy they require for their hard work, without bulking up their feed.

I *think* that the horse can digest up to 30% oil, but above 10% and you start getting palatability problems.

I'd ring a feed company who does both oil and oiled chops (e.g. Alfa A oil) to get their opinion.
 
vicky_sut said:
The only thing I can think of is unmollased sugarbeet. My welsh cob is quite lean at the moment but I figure it wont be long till the grass starts coming through then she will turn into a bit of a fatty :0)
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Someone else said try that but I'm confused to surely if it's sugarbeet it has sugar in it or am I really thick???:confused: Our yard has the most appauling grazing which is why he's on fed and hay, we don't really have a spring grass flush it's all just crap to be honest. Which is great for the fat fatty's and we have alot of laminatic horses on the yard who anywhere else would be suffering but for my lad it's the opposite!! I'm the only heavy cob owner who's stuffing her horse full of food!!!:rolleyes:

I liked the look of Simple Systems but I'm very remote and it's just not convient to use them. Might give them another ring though and see if they are delivering nearier to me now.
 
Oil! Great idea thanks! I don't want to give him any more alfa based feed but think I'll email Allen & Page and see what they advise. Thanks
 
Oil is a good one. I use Alfa A oil and speedibeet for my cob mare as she cannot have sugar/molasses. The real difference in her has been from adding Top Spec to her existing ration. It helps them to utilise their feed better and I have noticed a huge improvement in overall body tone and coat condition since I started using it a year ago. So if you don't want to actually up the feed ration a balancer might well be worth thinking about. :)
 
1Anastasia said:
Oil is a good one. I use Alfa A oil and speedibeet for my cob mare as she cannot have sugar/molasses. The real difference in her has been from adding Top Spec to her existing ration. It helps them to utilise their feed better and I have noticed a huge improvement in overall body tone and coat condition since I started using it a year ago. So if you don't want to actually up the feed ration a balancer might well be worth thinking about. :)
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Oh interesting to have another sugar intolerant opinion. Did you find the Alfa A perked her up at all? I was told by a couple of people it can make them a bit fizzy and he really doesn't need any more bounce!! Do you feed Top Spec to the recommended amount they advise?
 
My mare is evil on even tiny 'safe' amounts of sugar, even well soaked unmollassed beet is bad! She has soaked hay and a tea of no sugar chaff (topspec topchop lite) with a balancer added (home made) with microionized linseed for cals. It is fab stuff - she loves the taste, full of nutrients that processed liquid oils have lost and needs no prep.
 
ThePony said:
My mare is evil on even tiny 'safe' amounts of sugar, even well soaked unmollassed beet is bad! She has soaked hay and a tea of no sugar chaff (topspec topchop lite) with a balancer added (home made) with microionized linseed for cals. It is fab stuff - she loves the taste, full of nutrients that processed liquid oils have lost and needs no prep.
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Ohh now 3 weeks ago I started him on Linseed for his coat didn't realise it could help with weight gain so that might kick in soon!!!
 
I would suggest Allen & Page Calm and Condition and Carob kibble or Locust Bean, which contains No starch sugar or molasses - it's used in diabetic chocolate and has a natural sweetness and is high in calciun so great for poor grazing areas. My horses love the carob, but it is fattening - so great in your case.
 
jsr said:
Oil! Great idea thanks! I don't want to give him any more alfa based feed but think I'll email Allen & Page and see what they advise. Thanks
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I was more thinking you could swap the alfalfa pellets for this oiled chopped alfalfa (however often the chops have mollases added, do check). It was mainly to see if there is a cost benefit of going for one or the other that I suggested you look into both :)

jsr said:
Someone else said try that but I'm confused to surely if it's sugarbeet it has sugar in it or am I really thick???:confused:
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Think about sugarbeet and what its used for. The sugar is extracted to make, well, sugar! Which means that the sugarbeet we use for horses is the leftover fibre part of the processing after most of the sugar has been removed. Some brands/types have mollases added back in, so do check - I think speedybeet is the one everyone says is low in sugar.

jsr said:
Ohh now 3 weeks ago I started him on Linseed for his coat didn't realise it could help with weight gain so that might kick in soon!!!
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I think linseed is one of the best of the oils for horses, so I'd definately wait and see if that makes any improvement to him.
 
Thanks so much Naturally. I actually have never fed sugarbeet so hadn't really thought about what it is!! Lol!

Just ordered 2 new bags of alfalfa pellets so will have to stick to them!:rolleyes: Have emailed Allen and Page so will see what they say but hopefully the Linseed will add a bit of weight back, he's not skin and bone but he's lighter than I'd like so just want to catch it before it gets too far. I must be the only cob owner who stresses about feeding up and who has to watch his weight for dropping rather than gaining!!!:rolleyes:

Next time I'll be moaning he's too fat!!! Lol!!
 
I would def up the linseed then if you are after a bit more weight on him - how much are you feeding currently? If he is tricky with sugar then as much as possible I'd stick with what you are currently feeding as you know it works, more a case of tinkering with the levels of the different feeds!
 
You can check out germinated oats. My warmblood mare who is a nutcase on rolled oats does not hot up on the germinated oats.
They have some great nutrition articles on this website:
http://www.thunderbrook.co.uk/information-articles/

Unmolassed sugar beet (about 5% sugar) is considered a roughage and although it has higher proteins and calcium than grass hay, you'll need to feed a large volume (but can replace some hay/haylage by it) and it's fed soaked.
Alfalfa can make your horse hyper so I would not feed any significant amount of it to a hot or spooky horse.
Oil is a good addition but my mare is a picky eater and she will plain refuse to it if there is some in her bucket. You might be more lucky with your boy.
 
ThePony said:
I would def up the linseed then if you are after a bit more weight on him - how much are you feeding currently? If he is tricky with sugar then as much as possible I'd stick with what you are currently feeding as you know it works, more a case of tinkering with the levels of the different feeds!
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He's on 50g right now but they said it can be upped to 100g gradually, so might try that and stick to the feeds he's on. It's taken ages to get it right so don't really want to mess with it, don't mind adding something extra but like the routine we have and he enjoys his food (well he's cob he'd enough a dead duck if it was served up!!);)

I was warned about alfalfa but I introduced it slowly and he's not really changed, he's always been spooky and sharp and is very spooky right now but that's because he's getting fit and it goes hand in hand with him. Spooks I can deal with because he's blind in one eye so I'm used to them!!

Thanks everyone really appreciate the advise.
 
OP... I have one of these... he's 17 and IDx, but convinced he's a 4yo TB racehorse!

He's hunted all winter on speedibeet, alfa a oil and baileys stud balancer and is actually a bit on the round side compared to how i'd like him for the time of year!
 
Linseed is very good, flaked soya too -I believe more digestible than in oil form.
There is a product called Lingold I think which is a combination of both.
 
We had a sugar & cereal intolerant mare years ago. There was very little understood about the problem and certainly no special feeds. We fed her on alfalfa, non-molassed sugar-beet and grassnuts, as well as hay.
Mind you, she was a good doer. I believe rice-bran is good for poor-doers.
 
Allen and page do a special sugar and cereal intolerance diet. Might be worth looking into this. I'm not sure how good it would be though for keeping weight on?
 
jsr said:
Oh interesting to have another sugar intolerant opinion. Did you find the Alfa A perked her up at all? I was told by a couple of people it can make them a bit fizzy and he really doesn't need any more bounce!! Do you feed Top Spec to the recommended amount they advise?
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No she is so laid back she's almost horizontal on this regime. She's never been particularly naughty but could be a bit sharp and spooky at silly things like scary weeds for example! Since being on this diet she's so chilled but still got her forwardness and sparkle for the showring. She is 14.1hh and has 500g of the Alfa A oil, 200g dry weight of the speedibeet and 400g (the full quota for her weight) of Top Spec Comprehensive a day. It's by no means cheap but she looks fabulous on it and I've halved her rations of the other feed since she's been on it as she seems to do so much better on less feed (does say this on the Top Spec info). Their feedline is really good if you wanted to just email or ring them. I know people who've had good results with Allen and Page Calm and Condition too but if you feed it at anywhere near the recommended weights then by the time you've soaked it you've got a whole bucket of the stuff! I've also known someone using the sugar and ceral intolerance mix but the horses really didn't like it and it didn't look or smell very apetising either to be fair.
 
Thanks, it's amazing how many horses are so intolerant to sugar...makes me think the feed industry really need to look into the reasoning behind the amount of molasses they add to feeds! I get so frustrated when I read the ingredients, even the stuff that's supposed to be low-cal for laminatics and there is molassas in the first few ingredients listed!!:mad:

Had email from A&P, they've recommended I swap the Fast Fibre to C&C, keep the Alfalfa pellets and increase the linseed slowly. She said the sugar intolerant feed doesn't have enough calories to help maintain his weight if his work level is going to continue at the rate it is (which hopefully it will) and with me hoping to do some showing with him this year I want him looking top notch.

Thanks found this all really interesting.
 
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