Feeding - at my wits end

[TheChestnutThing]

Before I start…he is on ad-lib hay, turned out during daylight every single day (unless it’s a complete wash out) in fields that are well draining and not muddy. He does not have any deficiencies besides being a stressy idiot and does not have PSSM.

Horse loves to work and is currently in work 5/6 days a week.

So as most of you know I’ve moved onto full livery (legit feel like I have a life outside of horses now).

Horse is very happy and the yard is lovely and quiet and not busy which suits us. YO really is knowledgeable and kind and caring and genuinely loves what she does.

They provide feed but it’s not enough/not the right feed for horse so I need to buy in. It does not give him the correct energy and calorie requirements.

I’m used to feeding straights but don’t want to complicate things for her (and I was clever and sold all my feed bins as didn’t think I would need them), so I want to buy one single feed.

As he is ulcer prone I’ve narrowed it down to ease and excel and soothe and gain (open to other options though) and fibre beet.
Supplement wise he is already on: Linseed, Baileys Performance Balancer, brewers yeast and esomeprozole yet again (he dropped a hell of a lot of condition on the grass livery no matter how much I fed and he became super stressed, I don’t even scope anymore…).

My issue with these feeds are…to get the recommended amount you need to feed pretty much a bag and a half a week! Which makes it super expensive (on top of my livery etc).

Does anyone feed less than the recommended amount (without compromising the horse of course), or does one have other ideas?

 

[Abacus]

If you wanted to feed straights do you have somewhere you can store them at home, and make up your own single bin of mix?

 

[TheChestnutThing]

If you wanted to feed straights do you have somewhere you can store them at home, and make up your own single bin of mix?

You know I didn’t think about this….but also sadly not. Already short on storage in our garage until April (storing stuff for my parents who have just moved here from SA whilst they renovate their new house).

But also what I like about straights is you can get the EXACT ratio in every feed if you feed it singularly and don’t mix it up (but I’m also weird like this).

 

[ihatework]

I like ease and excel, it’s one of my go to’s for working horses needing calories.
And yes, if you have a horse of that ilk I’ve fed at least a sack a week of that/equivalent feed to one of mine, a 17hh out eventing.

Whereas the younger ones might just get a half scoop twice a day and do well on that.

You can’t compare apples and pears - a horse needs what it needs at the end of the day.

 

[maya2008]

Straights - depending on how many different things, you could buy the bags, mix the correct amounts and tie in bags. Take to yard, YO tips a bag into each feed. Repeat when you’re close to running out.

 

[SantaVera]

I've managed to get condition onto a stressy mare but it did require feeding the recommended amount . People advised adding more oil eg micro used linseed but THB I think this would have just unbalanced the ration. If you feed the recommended amount you need to drop the balancer so savings can be made there .

 

[criso]

What are you trying to achieve that you can't with the yard feed, is it weight/condition?

You are already feeding a balancer so in terms of minerals and vitamins horse is getting what they need. The recommended amount with many feeds is about getting the right level of vitamins/minerals that are added but you're already doing that or were you thinking of dropping the balancer and feeding full ration of ease and excel instead.

What does the yard offer? Is using one of their feeds combined with something you add an option. If it's just about extra calories my go to's would be adding Copra, Linseed or Oats though the latter don't suit everyone. Fibrebeet is a good option too. You may have to balance though, Fibrebeet is high in calcium, Copra and Oats high in phosphorus.

 

[TGM]

Whether you feed the recommended amount of the compound feed depends on whether the horse needs the amount of calories provided by the recommended amount and whether you are feeding a balancer/vit min supplement alongside. The recommended amount of feed will have the daily amount of vit/mins in it, so if you find the horse doesn't need all the calories provided by the recommended daily amount you can reduce the amount of feed/balancer pro rata. So if you only need to feed half the daily amount of the compound feed, then you only need to feed half the balancer.

 

[rextherobber]

I like Pure Feeds, they're a complete inc balancer feed, but if you don't feed the recommended quantity, you'd need to top up the balancer . I add Brewers Yeast to it. I had to take my older one off the Veteran mix, she got a bit too chubby on it, so that's a thought if you want to increase weight? No reason not to feed a younger horse Veteran mix, its not going to read the bag and be offended!

 

[TheChestnutThing]

What are you trying to achieve that you can't with the yard feed, is it weight/condition?

You are already feeding a balancer so in terms of minerals and vitamins horse is getting what they need. The recommended amount with many feeds is about getting the right level of vitamins/minerals that are added but you're already doing that or were you thinking of dropping the balancer and feeding full ration of ease and excel instead.

What does the yard offer? Is using one of their feeds combined with something you add an option. If it's just about extra calories my go to's would be adding Copra, Linseed or Oats though the latter don't suit everyone. Fibrebeet is a good option too. You may have to balance though, Fibrebeet is high in calcium, Copra and Oats high in phosphorus.

The yard feeds a limited amount (chaff and pony nuts - aprox one scoop of chaff twice a day and half a scoop of nuts twice a day).
He needs weight and energy. He was a lovely forward ride but hasn’t got that energy anymore on the current rations.

He is already getting linseed (and has been for the last 6 months) at aprox 500g a day. He won’t eat Copra.

I added the balancer as I knew that the feed wasn’t offering what he needed in terms of vits/minerals. Happy to drop said balancer or continue it. I honestly just want him to be back to where he was in terms of weight and energy requirements.

Maybe I do need to just go back to feeding straights.

Will definitely be adding the fibrebeet. That’s a non-negotiable for me.

 

[criso]

Fibrebeet is a good add, you could start with that with the linseed.

What were you feeding before that worked well

 

[I'm Dun]

you want a high calorie, low density additive. Rice bran as in build and glow and similar are the easiest way to feed. It adds condition quickly without over filling them

 

[Alibear]

My go-to for Amber, who has had ulcers in the past, is Saracen Re-leve mix and Equijewel to top up the calories.
It's expensive, but it does the job, so usually just an extravagant couple of months, and then she drops back to their competition fit balancer and chaff.
Also, as you've moved yards, a worm count or worm blood test might be worth doing if he doesn't pick up on the extra feed.

 

[Birker2020]

Before I start…he is on ad-lib hay, turned out during daylight every single day (unless it’s a complete wash out) in fields that are well draining and not muddy. He does not have any deficiencies besides being a stressy idiot and does not have PSSM.

Horse loves to work and is currently in work 5/6 days a week.


My issue with these feeds are…to get the recommended amount you need to feed pretty much a bag and a half a week! Which makes it super expensive (on top of my livery etc).

Does anyone feed less than the recommended amount (without compromising the horse of course), or does one have other ideas?

Heck yes! Always have done. Bailey would have burst if I'd fed the recommended feeding rate of the feed I've fed over the years.

At one time I fed Baileys feed balancer.
I only fed eight bags of it in total because I won a competition sponsored by Baileys Horse Feeds in around 2006 to have a lesson with a 'famous' SJ and also won rug, polo shirt and feed vouchers. I was featured in a 3 page spread with me and the other prize winner in Horse & Rider magazine.

After the vouchers had been used up I think I was horrified to work out that it would cost me £33 every nine days to feed Bailey at the volume they'd told me to feed her.

So she went onto something cheap and cheerful, a mug or two a day of mix and a handful of chaff. Always maintained her weight, never had an issue as the photo will testify lol.l!!

 

[TheChestnutThing]

Fibrebeet is a good add, you could start with that with the linseed.

What were you feeding before that worked well

Linseed, beet, Alfa A, barley, full fat soya

As supplements: brewers, lysine, fenugreek

 

[TheChestnutThing]

My go-to for Amber, who has had ulcers in the past, is Saracen Re-leve mix and Equijewel to top up the calories.
It's expensive, but it does the job, so usually just an extravagant couple of months, and then she drops back to their competition fit balancer and chaff.
Also, as you've moved yards, a worm count or worm blood test might be worth doing if he doesn't pick up on the extra feed.

Thanks! He’s picking up. Just not as quickly as I would like and still lacks the energy.

I have however ordered a worm count test this week before we do the test me of year worm.

 

[SpeedyPony]

Could you do soothe and gain +linseed/oil? That would up the calories while not being too faffy to put together.
I feed soothe and gain and have found it good, but I am having to feed a lot of it- I would need to feed a lot of straights as well though, so realistically I don't think it would be a huge saving to swap over.

 

[Roxylola]

Outshine? Heavily soya based. I prefer releve but it's broadly the same as ease and excel nutrition wise.
Fibrebeet, alfabeet, speedibeet or grassnuts all work well for me too

 

[criso]

Linseed, beet, Alfa A, barley, full fat soya

As supplements: brewers, lysine, fenugreek

In that case adding fibrebeet and soya might be a good place to start.

I'm assuming the chaff the yard offers is a straw based version and no option to have a grass or alfalfa based chaff.

 

[Annagain]

My old boy who has only needed more than a token feed in the last two years has done very well on Ease and Excel and Veteran Vitality (which is very similar to Soothe and Gain) with a mug of linseed added for the first time this year (he's actually putting on weight now having lost a bit while he was still out 24/7). The Ikea stackable storage is very good if space is an issue. The small one is perfect for a bag of linseed and the larger ones are great for most other feeds.

 

[TheChestnutThing]

In that case adding fibrebeet and soya might be a good place to start.

I'm assuming the chaff the yard offers is a straw based version and no option to have a grass or alfalfa based chaff.

Chaff is hi fi lite so mostly straw based, yes.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

In your situation with no feed space and for simplicity I would just add the recommended amount of Saracen Equijewel to what he currently gets, every horse I have fed it to gained weight and they kept the weight on.

You don't have to feed loads of it and never known a horse to not eat it.

 

[TheChestnutThing]

In your situation with no feed space and for simplicity I would just add the recommended amount of Saracen Equijewel to what he currently gets, every horse I have fed it to gained weight and they kept the weight on.

You don't have to feed loads of it and never known a horse to not eat it.

I have tried the omega rice bran in the past (same thing but cheaper), and IMHO I didn’t see a difference. He was on it for 4 months combined with the saracens show improver).
I just found it expensive and you had to feed quite a lot of both. I spoke to a nutritionist at saracens as a friend recommended it.
That is why I switched to feeding the pure linseed.

 

[SussexbytheXmasTree]

I’d add Equijewel to whatever they’re already having. It’s superb at adding condition. Omega rice is a mix of linseed and rice bran 14 Mj/Kg EJ is just rice bran 18 MJ/kg. I also feed Releve cubes (soaked) rather than the mix. My oldie I used to feed both EJ and micronised linseed in the winter just linseed in the summer.

 

[criso]

You have a system that worked before. In terms of space fibrebeet would cover the Alfa a, Sugarbeet part. Then maybe outshine to combine the soya and linseed. Then you're only missing the barley. Not sure if it's more expensive than buying separately but it would save on space.

 

[TheHairyOne]

I have a horse who goes a bit 'flat' when the grass has gone so i switch his hard feed in winter and it has been a LOT of trial and error to get it right.

However, I now feed my boy the same chaff as you, ease and excel and balancer and i add linseed in the depths of winter and I think its saracen turbo (not much!) to get a bit extra if weve got a busy week of doing things.

I learnt the hard wat to not use the Turbo unless he actually is using that energy.

 

[meleeka]

If you feed Soothe and Gain at recommended levels you could stop the linseed as I believe it has that in it already. I don’t see any benefit to feeding full rations of that and Fibre Beet as it has beet in it too.

When I fed it I just added Readigrass and I found it fabulous for weight gain in my big stressy Freisian who was a nightmare to keep weight on with anything other than grass.

 

[honetpot]

I feel your pain, I have been although this with an older TB. In the end I had him blood tested and he just needed more food, which to get enough in to him meant higher DE.
My solution was the cheapest highest DE base feed that he liked, and then added rice bran/ or copra, but the rice bran was the easiest. I know all the brands have caught on and its more expensive, when I used to buy it even though it was imported it was fairly cheap, but if the base feed is the same you are just adjusting the rest of the calories, up or down and then you will not need all the extras. Two bags with a couple of pegged instructions should make it easier.
It may be worth looking a Gain racehorse/competition feeds.

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[santas_spotty_pony]

Haven’t read all of the replies but you don’t need to feed the recommended amount if you are feeding a balancer so it won’t matter how much you feed - just feed as you feel necessary. I’d go for a good conditioning cube or I really rate Spillers Conditioning fibre.

 

[magicmoments]

Ease and excell worked well for mine and was recommended by an independent nutritionist.
If you feed the recommended amount of a compound feed, you won't need the balancer. You may need to check about adding limestone flour with the amount of linseed you are currently feeding.