Feeding Colic Prone Poor Doer.. Help!

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TooManyCobs

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Hi There... Wondered if anyone has any suggestions on what on earth i can give my 3yo shire x to put some weight on...

I'm at a loss.. he has a 'delicate gut'. he often needs steroids to reduce inflamation with prolonged periods of diarrea... he is suceptable to colic if allowed to eat grass for more than about 30 mins. He can spend all day out in a starvation paddock with no problems. He is suceptable to colic after even small amounts of hard feed. He hates being in and has a poor appetite if confined for more than over night, plus he gets stressed which upsets his gut even more.

He is under medical care, of course, and basically they dont have an answer except steroids when hes really ill. He has colic three weeks ago that was led to displaced gut and a very touch and go night at the equine hospital.

He continues to look like an RSPCA advert, at 16.2 he comes up about 450kg on a weight tape.

Currently he is getting unlimited hay, but he prefers to play with it than eat it. I am feeding speedi beet at about 700g (pre soaked weight) per day, in three meals, each meal laced with a cup of oil, and a little chaff, and about a tablespoon of conditioning mix to give him someting to rummage for. He wont eat more than this per meal, but from today am going to start on this 4 times per day as he is continuing to lose weight.

As i say hard feeds in any sensible quantity just give him colic. Any experiences with feeding more sugar beet than this? According to speedibeet website i can feed up to 500g/100kg but there is no way he would actually consume that volume. Do i need to add chaff or can i feed straight to allow more space for the higher calorie sugar beet? can i give more oil? Incidentally i am also giving him probiotics and a general supplement.

He does seem happy in himself, and plays with the others.

Any thoughts most appreciated!
 
Aww poor boy. I went through a similar thing with my mare, in the end she didn't make it :(. She had worm damage from her old home though that had weakened her digestive system.
Consequently iv'e done a lot of research into feed!
Basically you must not feed him anything with starch.
Have you tried alfa a oil? or a rice bran supplement like equijewel? Don't feed him too much alfa, just try adding a handful and increasing it to a scoop with each feed. Equijewel from saracen is amazing and v low starch. I'd also try a biotic supplement like Brewers yeast and Fenugreek to increase appetite. Lots of people on here swear by linseed but I like the equijewel as even though it's expensive it's balanced with vitamin e.
How about buying some high fibre haylage and mixing it with his hay?
 
Agree with the last post, Equijewel is great stuff maybe check with vet before starting any new feed, I also have had good results with linseed putting on condition, good luck with your horse x

Also wanted to say the hifi no mollasses has fenugreek and mint added to aid palatability mine will eat it on its own, might be worth trying this chaff ? Also if you feed brewers yeast add it slowly most dont like the taste I feed it to my horses good for itchy skin as well as digestion.
 
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lots of questions-sorry but this sort of stuff really interest me

what do your vets advise feeding him?

how long has it been going on?

what have they said it might be causing it?

what type of colic is it?

has he been scoped for ulcers/blood tested? has underlying pain been ruled out?

poor horse at such a young age

i would look at feeding readi grass, grass nuts, micronised linseed, possibly high fibre cubes, ad lib hay (try offering hay from different sources), grazing in hand 2 or 3 times a day for 5 mins and then building it up slowly preferably not on rich new growth, and possibly aim to get to the point you can turn out daily even if it is with a muzzle on him at least he should be more relaxed being with others, you may need to feed him 3 or 4 times a day and take the muzzle of for periods of time each day, and it may increase his appetite if he is out moving around and relaxed?. all this would be after discussion with a vet.

you do not need to feed a chaff it is fed as a bulker to slow a horse down but he needs plenty of roughage going through his system.

TBH it does not bode well if he is not keeping weight on now when his life should be stress free, what will he be like when he starts work?

is he gelded?
 
Firstly, thank you all for your replies. There are lots of products for me to investigate further here. I suspect this his outlook is bleek tbh. After a few good days, hence my renewed focus on his weight this morning, this afternoon he has come in from his couple of hours in the starvation paddock with severe diarrhoea again, despite currently being on steroids, which normally keep him functioning. Just awaiting todays round of colic.

Feeling a bit miserable now! Re specific questions:

what do your vets advise feeding him?
Wet hay, ad lib, keep trying to reintroduce hard feed and grass little and often. I am actually in France where everybody feeds straights and there are far fewer mixes, and haylage is impossible to find. The vet currently advises that he should be in all the time as he is ‘fragile’. This is torture for him, although he does stay insde with a shetland for company, so he’s been allowed out for a few hrs at a time into a paddock without grass, with the laminitic.

how long has it been going on?
I got him at 6months old, full of worms, in the winter. Come the first summer he was on grass he’s had problems. First colic at 9 months old, always lean after that. Gelded at 18months as was large and stroppy. I put his leanness down to the very fast rate he was growing, and everyone kept telling me not to worry as youngsters always look poor, and I’ve had a few, but hes basically always been a few steps down the scale from ‘poor’ since that first summer. Every time the vets have been out to him its been just feed him more and worm him. I do regular worm counts and am very particular about paddock hygiene, so no issues here.

what have they said it might be causing it? has he been scoped for ulcers/blood tested? has underlying pain been ruled out?
As steroids offer him some relief it appears to be the horse equivalent of irritable bowel syndrome says vet. That has been general consensus – but he hasn’t been scoped for ulcers or the like. I know they have run lots of bloods etc, whilst he has had one of his stays in hospital. Both I and the vets have all been hoping he will grow out of it. The last colic and subsequent extreme loss of weight has been the tipping point for me. Time to stop treating the symptoms.

Last colic was left side displaced bowel (behind/under the spleen I think they said, remember I’m trying to go through all this not in my native language, the French vets are very good, but I cant get the level of detail I used to!). It was very serious – the vet said without surgery he didn’t expect him to make it.

So no-one has ever raised the issue of ulcers before.. it hadn’t even crossed my mind, I think of it for TB’s but not so much Shire’s! Maybe that is worth checking out further with the vets here. My instinct is that if he cant be managed in a way that is stress free, i.e. out on pasture with the others, then it isn’t really very fair on him.

As so rightly pointed out he hasn’t even started any real work yet, and I haven’t given him the preparation for breaking that my youngsters normally have because hes always ill, so it will be even more stressful.

He wants to be a normal horse, he does have an appetite for grass and hard feed… he just cant have it. I had hoped to break him this spring as he will be 4 in july, looks like he’ll get away with it this year!

Anyway, lots of products I haven’t even heard of to investigate and bring back from UK… and I think the vet again tomorrow…

Thanks again all for taking the time to reply.
 
I agree it all sounds a bit bleak but maybe try a trial of gastroguard? it does not sound like you can make things any worse.

I would imagine scoping would show any gut damage left from the worm burden he had as a foal, so maybe that would be worth investigating?

at the end of the day it comes down to quality of life and also to finances, good luck with him and keep us informed
 
After reading your story, I can't help but feel you are most probably dealing with a serious case of ulcers. My own mare had a terrible summer, very similar to what is happening to you - anything and everything would induce colic. We had her scoped and confirmed she had grade 4 ulcers and most probably colitis as well. Treated her with Gastrogard but while on treatment I still had to send her once to the clinic due to a really bad bout of colic, fortunately the vet didn't have to operate but was pretty much touch and go.

I would recommend you have your horse scoped before trying anything else.
 
I will only feed straights these days - processed feeds can have anything in the the cooking destroys the vits in them so they add in synthetic extra and I really don't think they vits and mins are that avaliable to horses.

I am a big fan of oats who helped my hard doer a lot to the point over spring / start of summer when we had green grass he didn't need any grain - which was something I hadn;t achieved before.

Is this horse out 24 / 7 movement is the key to keeping agut moving and stood round in a stable is not good for digestion cirulation etc, even loose in an indoor school would be better.
 
I agree that you should investigate ulcers.

I would say though that if he is stressed living in, he would be far better out 24/7 on a bare paddock, and fed his hay out there. Stress itself can bring on colic, as can reduced movement.
 
By the way my horse didn't have ulcers. During her investigations for the colic episodes we had her scoped and she had an untra sound and mri on her tummy. They couldn't see anything but possibly a shadow on the mri. It could well be worm damage too :(.
Did they operated on him? What did they see when they opened him up? That's the only reason we found out what was wrong with my girl. The surgeon said it was a mess in there. Old pock marks and adhesions from worms and previous colic episodes.
Its very sad :(.
My girl struggled with grass also. She was best not fed it all tbh it was far far to rich for her system to cope with. She always looked and felt better over the winter times when fed hay and haylage. When the grass came through it would give her a terrible pot belly where she couldn't process it.
I had her totally worm free but it was too late.
:(
 
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