Feeding for ulcers and to build up muscle

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Liakp

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Hoping someone can help me as I'm getting very confused.

My horse has recently been diagnosed with ulcers and is currently on gastroguard. He also has back pain for which he has had treatment at the vets and we are now trying to build up his muscle.
He is also barefoot. He doesn't have the greatest feet so I have to be careful with his management.

He is turned out 24/7. He is being brought back into work - he is currently being lunged and walked out inhand, he would be being long reined but that's not safe for anyone. He has a small feed before being exercised.

He is currently fed:
Speedibeet
Prohoof
Calmag
Salt
linseed

The vet suggested Equitop myoplast for help to build muscle but it sent him loopy, does anyone have any alternatives they could recommend?
For the ulcers she advised adding a chaff to his feed, does anyone have any recommendations? The vet recommended Dengie Healthy Tummy but I've read mixed opinions online. She also recommended adding corn or rapeseed oil and antacids such as Protexin.

Basically what would you feed this horse?
I'm hoping that if I gather a few opinions it may help me decide.
 
My horse had ulcers, but luckily she is in good condition, i feed Soaked alfa beet, chaff and pony nuts lots of corn oil which is good for weight gain, gastroplus maintance to stop them coming back!!! she has lots of haylage but the haylage which i give her is more on the dry side than the really damp side, it will take time to build up the muscle, with plenty of feed and time for her to make a recovery with also the correct work muscle will build up but this is a long process and be patient, you said she had a back problem?? is this because of a saddle??? i would suggest where a prolite pad under the saddle which will help with any back problem!!! please let us know how you get on hun xxxxx
 
My tb who had grade two ulcers and was a hat rack to get him up to weight had the following


Alfa a molasses free, one stumps scoop four
Alfa beat, soaked one Half scoop split four
ERS pellets, two scoops between four feeds.
Life force formula supplement

That was to get him with weight on.


Now he is on the following


Dengie heathly hooves molasses free, one scoop a day
Life force formula supplement and that's it.

In winter it will be twice a day and if he needs any weight add in either the ERS pellets or Alfa beet.


The life force supplement really helped with his eating and helped him to eat more hay as he wasn't a big hay eater.

If you put him on the life force don't get it from Rutland. Horse extras as they take your money and don't give you the product.

I got mine from here http://www.lifeforcehorse.com very good service
 
I am about to try whey protein or milk powder containing it for my poor doer who doesn't seem to build muscle. Basically you need protein (amino acids) to form soft tissue, not carbohydrates (energy) or fibre (gut health). The grass is beginning to lack protein now as the highest level is in the seeds, and late cut hay will be the same, for the same reason. Check the breakdown of the various feeds, and feed for protein levels or buy additional as a supplement.
 
JillA said:
I am about to try whey protein or milk powder containing it for my poor doer who doesn't seem to build muscle. Basically you need protein (amino acids) to form soft tissue, not carbohydrates (energy) or fibre (gut health). The grass is beginning to lack protein now as the highest level is in the seeds, and late cut hay will be the same, for the same reason. Check the breakdown of the various feeds, and feed for protein levels or buy additional as a supplement.
Click to expand...

Am I right in thinking (please correct me, but seem to remember reading this) that micronised linseed has quite a high level of protein in?
 
Equitop Myoplast is basically spirulina (algae powder - superfood, v high in nutrients) mixed with sugar to make it palatable - the sugar might have been the problem. I feed spirulina in powder form, much cheaper than equitop and just needs to be introduced gradually, a pinch to start with, perhaps worth looking into - strong taste but great stuff for people, too! Don't know how it might interact with ulcers, but available from a couple of barefoot friendly retailers such as Thubderbrook who I am sure could advise on that.
 
Buy straight Spirulina from ebay instead of Equitop which has added sugars in it - could be what affected him rather than the spirulina!! Had mine from Progressive earth on ebay (as do most of my minerals) so its pure.

Remove all cereals, sugars, mollassess etc adn sugar/starch under 5% in feeds and only feed high fibre and oil.
Consider getting a hair analysis done for about £50 to target which minerals are deficient then you can add those as straights.

You name it ive tried it: Pure, Thunderbrooks, Simple are the best for natural nutrition as well as reviews all the shop bought although 99% of all commercial feeds are not suitable. Simple was the best by far but now i use generic local feeds which is much cheaper (grass nuts 25kg £8!) :)

My Tb is anorexic at the slightest hint of cold or long wet days. He lives out as he weaves constantly when stabled so would stress his weight off as well (the joys of being screwed up in a racing yard with constant stables and high cereal diet). Removed all haylage as this would cause stomach upset so adlib hay in winter and grass.
This year ive had more comments than ever before on his condition and we feed:
Lysine, Mag Ox 98% (only just started a week ago as going away on training camp to new place), Cider Apple vinegar, Brew yeast, Linseed (dose of linseed varies from 200g in summer to 1kg in winter), unmolassed beet, small amount of alfalfa oil, and grass nuts for any energy when competing or extra weight in winter. in winter i also add a mug of rape oil each day.
This winter im going to be trying black sunflower seeds for the first time.

Before we ride he gets fed about 2kg dry weight (always soaked) so he is still eating when being tacked up - very high fibre and allowed to have an occasional graze when out plus rest of his meal when we return from rides.
He is also barefoot, ulcers, very easily highly stressed. Now competing up to 2'6 sj and xc so he is having low dose electrolytes in the summer heat and weekly 25-30km rides or endurance competitions.
Usual TB type feet but frequent 5 week trimmer with my own very light rasp if needed in between (now up to 25km rides barefoot but not on very stoney surfaces such as forests when we use his front boots).

Worming to target only not routine but always a 5 day wormer once a year then as needed.
Teeth are done 2x yearly as he has had some development issues (teething 2 years behind his actual age!).
Chiro yearly. Seeing an equine ECS for first time next month after he was kicked in his forehead and fractured his sinus a few months ago.
I have taught him to stretch low between his knees almost to bow to stretch his top muscles as well as along each side of his body when im on the ground with him. Also work him slow long and low to build more top line when riding.
Lots of transitions when working, walk-trot-walk, halt-walk-halt-trot etc. perfect when out hacking. also different speed of gait slow or faster walk and trots. Then worry about hill work and any nice free canter when out riding before schooling in confined area.

What didnt work: copra, milk powder, soaked oats, haylage made things worse, obv all cereals/starches/sugars so read ingredients labels very carefully, blue chip pro, top spec condition nuts and balancer,
 
peh1980 said:
Equitop Myoplast is basically spirulina (algae powder - superfood, v high in nutrients) mixed with sugar to make it palatable - the sugar might have been the problem. I feed spirulina in powder form, much cheaper than equitop and just needs to be introduced gradually, a pinch to start with, perhaps worth looking into - strong taste but great stuff for people, too! Don't know how it might interact with ulcers, but available from a couple of barefoot friendly retailers such as Thubderbrook who I am sure could advise on that.
Click to expand...

Spirulina is great for ulcers as when it mixes with warm water it makes a mucous which lines the gut. I have used it specifically for ulcers, in that sort of mix. I didn't know it was good for weight gain though.
 
Thanks for all the advice.
I had read that myoplast is full of sugar, he's quite a nervy horse and the myoplast made him much worse. It's good to know spirulina will be good for ulcers too.

Is there anything I could feed that might help with his nerves? Some days he's fine but other times, especially when it's windy or the weather is bad, he gets very jumpy.

fuzzle said:
My horse had ulcers, but luckily she is in good condition, i feed Soaked alfa beet, chaff and pony nuts lots of corn oil which is good for weight gain, gastroplus maintance to stop them coming back!!! she has lots of haylage but the haylage which i give her is more on the dry side than the really damp side, it will take time to build up the muscle, with plenty of feed and time for her to make a recovery with also the correct work muscle will build up but this is a long process and be patient, you said she had a back problem?? is this because of a saddle??? i would suggest where a prolite pad under the saddle which will help with any back problem!!! please let us know how you get on hun xxxxx
Click to expand...

He has back pain due to a number of issues, he was being treated by a physio and improved a lot but a few months ago he ended up jumping over several field fences (don't ask) and I think that's when he exacerbated the problems.
 
When my horse had ulcers she had back pain, this is because they hold themselves very tense, think your doing your best for your horse by not ignoring the problem, some horses do run in pain have you thought of using a chiropractor like Mark Windsor or Bruce Hewitt they both travel the country and not that expensive, its elimination of problems here i think xx
 
Mine has ulcers & I also put her on Dengie Healthy Tummy but she starting being very jumpy on it! I can only presume it's the alfalfa so I've now cut it out completely ( which I didn't really want to do as I've heard its good for the stomach). She's now just on Graze on & Equitop Pronutrin + gastrogard & the spookiness has gone. She is a good doer in the summer though. I'm planning on adding Speedi beet to her diet in the winter & possibly micronised linseed as she does lose weight very quickly when it's cold (wb x tb). I just make sure she has a low sugar, low starch diet with no cereals or molasses x
 
Jm2k please can you elaborate on the type of Linseed you are feeding.

I am assuming that when you feed 2kg a day you are feeding it boiled. Is this correct as feeding this amount raw or freshly ground would be poisonous.

OP for muscle development you need to be feeding 10 - 12% protein along with quality work. Food alone does not build muscle, though the addition of weight makes the horse look better. Protein needs a good source of Lysine so that protein can be utilised correctly.
Linseed has a good source of Lysine.
 
Hi,

Mine had a lot of grade 1 and 2 ulcers. He cribs, the vets think from the ulcers. He is very happy and comfortable at the moment after being on 2 courses of gastrogard last year.

I feed him Saracen Essential balancer (used to be on Top Spec Comprehensive but Saracen is cheaper) both low in starch and sugars. He is also on Saracen alfa pellets (simple system do them to but more expensive), he has feedmark ulcer calm and global herbs Restore tonic.

In winter I add Mazola oil which is corn oil into his feed, alfa a mollasses free chaff, conditioning cubes (low starch and sugars), if I think he could do with a bit extra I give him linseed, charnwood milling do a 20kg bag for £20 ish.

He lives out during the summer and has a lot of turnout in the winter, if the grass is low we put hay in the field and when stabled he has ad lib hay. Before I ride he gets hay and a hand full of alfa pellets. When wormed he gets Protexin Quick Fix so he doesnt have stomach troubles.

We (me and the vet) have decided that if anything changes, season or competing a lot he can go on Peptizole as its cheaper than GG and yet the same product. This is just a maintenance dose for a week.

This seems to work for my boy. Good luck :)
 
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