Feeding the overweight but lame horse

[amyjnes109]

Hi guys. We have a 14.3hh rising 7 year old cob who is to put it mildly - obese. When the vet came and commented on his weight which was a kick up the bum so i decided it was time to get him more in shape and increase exercise slowly - he was then chased around in the field (very hard ground) by another horse and came up stiff behind the next morning. Had the physio out and he was sore head to toe although no heat in his legs or swelling she suspects soft tissue damage in the SI area. Long story short she is going to come out again in 2 weeks and if he is no better in his trot up and is still as sore and tense we are getting a lameness workup from the vet to figure out what is going on.

I have opted to turn him out overnight on a field with minimal grass (still more than i want but the field with the least grass) , as he is now only turned out with my horse and neither of them run around much and he is miserable in the stable. I bring him in the day and im soaking his hay and he has small and often amounts throughout the day. I have been walking him in hand on a hard surface (strides up shorter in the menage) for 20 minutes a day and he has improved since last week so physio said to see how he is doing. I worry this just isnt enough for him to lose any weight and i suspect the extra weight along with the hard ground is what caused the injury in the first place. I dont really want to put him on full box rest as he isn't fully lame just stiff and being in the stable all the time seems to make it worse but if needed in the future will have no choice

Physio recommended a supplement called LamiAid and also to do my carrot stretches with celery since he is on a diet. Anyone else been through anything similar and what did they do? It is limited with what i can do - a track would be amazing but the y/o wouldnt want me putting lots of posts in her fields. Im considering electric fencing half the field off near the gate but that's not fair on my other lad who is fine and actually very fit and healthy and regularly exercised and i don't think the horse would cope being on his own. I've heard of people mixing straw with hay to lower calorie intake more but keep forage amount the same.

Any ideas or people who have been in a similar situation in the past? Thanks!

 

[Goldenstar]

If it’s possible I would lead him from another horse
It’s extremely difficult to get this right if he’s stiff with stabling I would get Bute from the vet for him I have one in this situation
Mines in long hours during the day twelve most days sometimes more. If I could I would muzzle him when he’s out but he has no front teeth and can’t eat with a muzzle.
Muzzles really help, in in daytime out at night in a muzzle as much walking as you can manage you will win.

 

[AmyMay]

Before you do anything you need to have him assessed by a vet.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I would just get the work up done now rather than wait 2 weeks if it's soft tissue it needs treatment and rest, I wouldn't walk or work a horse on hard ground with a potential soft tissue injury without knowing what the damage is his only 7 and hopefully with the right prognosis and management can be fixed.

Please don't take advice from a physio they are not qualified to diagnose any horse and I'm surprised they treated him without a vets permission they are not allowed to do that.

 

[HappyHollyDays]

Without any kind of exercise due to soreness and prior to vet workup for a safe and steady weight loss calculate 1.5% of his body weight and feed this in forage over 24 hours. Eg a 450 kilo horse would equate to 6.75 kilos of forage which includes anything that he puts in his mouth. Hay, grass and hard feed. If grass is an issue a muzzle will help to protect against laminitis.

Don’t feed constantly, it’s not natural, weigh and divide the dry hay into 3 or 4 small nets, soak and rinse well then feed at equidistant times. Beware straw which can be just as high in sugar as hay and doesn't soak well.

Once exercise can be reintroduced walking out in hand is better than nothing at all.

ETA All feed should be less than 10% starch and sugar.

 

[Red-1]

It can be done, it just isn't hearts and flowers, as in it is harsh to them. I had to do it for Rigs, for a year. Because of that, he is now treated pretty normally.

When not at grass he was only allowed 8kg of dry weight hay a day, split into 4 feeds. It was soaked and fed in tiny holed nets. This was on vets advice, yours may be allowed more. It was 1.5% of his weight, but that is ideal weight, not current weight. However, it needed bringing down slowly, so he didn't just go from well fed to starvation rations all at once. After a year, some time at grass (muzzled) was introduced, but the hay had to also be reduced and a weigh tape used weekly to make sure I had reduced the hay enough.

Hay is soaked for over an hour, then rinsed. I did longer in winter, min 4 hours when it was properly cold.

Mine had to be off grass for a full year, but then he was metabolic at the time. If yours is not metabolic, then he may not need to come off grass. If yours is obese and lame, I would have the vet immediately. I would do a full work up, including lameness exam and also EMS testing. The vet will be able to advise on diet. Mine was very strict and was hearteningly amazed that I wrote down what Rigs was to have and stuck with it religiously, even when he begged for food. Cobs do.

If your horse is metabolically OK, then I would still always muzzle when at grass. At night, I would give just 3kg (dry weight) hay, soaked. Soaked hay still fills the belly but offers less calories. For a feed, I would once a day give half a mug of speedy beet, soaked, with some uninteresting chop, just to get vitamins in. I would give salt and magnesium, with a multivit. in the feed.

 

[amyjnes109]

Before you do anything you need to have him assessed by a vet.

I abandoned this thread and never responded to the comments - sorry about that! I have been in contact with the vet - he is booked in for a lameness workup this Friday so will keep everyone updated but i wanted to see if full rest eased it as he wasn't notably lame just stiff when brought out the stable. He was stiff a few weeks ago and assumed it wasn't serious and just from excess weight but hes now booked in for a full workup as there have not been any improvement (but he hasn't worsened either)

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Sounds like the best plan let us know how you get on.

 

[amyjnes109]

Sounds like the best plan let us know how you get on.

Hi - sorry again ive been quiet.

A somewhat predictable outcome in hindsight but something I didnt have experience with prior: The horse had laminitis. Hoof testers were done and vet was unwilling to do a full workup as reacted very strongly to them and he could tell straight away. He is now on full box rest with deep bedding and given soaked hay at 1% of his body weight. Its been almost 3 weeks since the vet came out and for the first time i walked him around the yard once just to see how he was on his feet and he was sound in the walk no shortness of stride. He has EMS as bloods tested high in insulun so has been put on ertuguflozin. The vet gave me a stern telling off for his weight so will make sure going forward we keep the weight off. So far hes lost 30kg's on the weight tape and is willing to pick all 4 feet up for me and is no longer resisting me touching him over his back end. Looking to the future the vet will be doing a lameness workup and see if xrays and remidial shoeing is neccesary but he seems to have bounced back really well. Lesson learned

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

That's good but really your plhysio should have advised calling the vet right at the beginning.

 

[amyjnes109]

That's good but really your plhysio should have advised calling the vet right at the beginning.

I wasn't aware physio had to be prescribed by a vet - the physio did mention laminitis and she actually told me to ring the vet if no improvement which is what i did

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I wasn't aware physio had to be prescribed by a vet - the physio did mention laminitis and she actually told me to ring the vet if no improvement which is what i did

They should get vet permission before they treat.

 

[amyjnes109]

They should get vet permission before they treat.

That's interesting - no one that i know personally has ever gotten permission from a vet before they have had their horse seen by a physio. I get the physio out every 6 months for both my horses along with the rest of the livery yard. I have seen a vet prescribe a regimen for them when rehabbing. It wasn't an osteopath it was a sports physio pherapist if that makes any difference.

In hindsight i do agree with you when it comes to lameness i wish i had just got the vet out sooner - as we would be 2 weeks ahead on our journey but i took advice of people around me who said get physio out first. Some people even said he wasnt lame and i was overreacting hence the delay in vet callout. Next time ill take my own intuition instead

 

[amyjnes109]

Sounds like the best plan let us know how you get on.

hey just dropping in for an update. Been a long few months but Apollo is doing amazing now. He was lame as a consequence of the laminitis. He is now back in work hacking having lost 100kg and his laminitis getting under control. The vet is coming out for a follow up insulin and glucose test to determine if he has EMS or not. Hes been on a dry lot daily with soaked hay. If it is still low i can give him restricted grazing and then retest after a month of that. I should have posted some before pictures but here is a before and after from the beginning of april to yesterday. I have learnt so much throughout it - mostly just ring the vet and ignore other peoples advice if they're not qualified! he was humongous lol

 

[Gloi]

He looks a lot better.

 

[meleeka]

hey just dropping in for an update. Been a long few months but Apollo is doing amazing now. He was lame as a consequence of the laminitis. He is now back in work hacking having lost 100kg and his laminitis getting under control. The vet is coming out for a follow up insulin and glucose test to determine if he has EMS or not. Hes been on a dry lot daily with soaked hay. If it is still low i can give him restricted grazing and then retest after a month of that. I should have posted some before pictures but here is a before and after from the beginning of april to yesterday. I have learnt so much throughout it - mostly just ring the vet and ignore other peoples advice if they're not qualified! he was humongous lol

I expect he feels so much better. Well done!

 

[Birker2020]

That's interesting - no one that i know personally has ever gotten permission from a vet before they have had their horse seen by a physio. I get the physio out every 6 months for both my horses along with the rest of the livery yard. I have seen a vet prescribe a regimen for them when rehabbing. It wasn't an osteopath it was a sports physio pherapist if that makes any difference.

In hindsight i do agree with you when it comes to lameness i wish i had just got the vet out sooner - as we would be 2 weeks ahead on our journey but i took advice of people around me who said get physio out first. Some people even said he wasnt lame and i was overreacting hence the delay in vet callout. Next time ill take my own intuition instead

I agree that no one ever asks permission from the vet but some physios won't do more invasive stuff without.

OP I think you should strip graze when allowed back out and increase very small amounts. Never mind people who believe ' postage stamp' paddocks are cruel. So is laminitis and you have to be cruel to be kind.

I've stripped grazed my horses for about the past ten years now although in much bigger paddocks but only cos I know they will cope with the grass.

 

[ycbm]

hey just dropping in for an update. Been a long few months but Apollo is doing amazing now. He was lame as a consequence of the laminitis. He is now back in work hacking having lost 100kg and his laminitis getting under control. The vet is coming out for a follow up insulin and glucose test to determine if he has EMS or not. Hes been on a dry lot daily with soaked hay. If it is still low i can give him restricted grazing and then retest after a month of that. I should have posted some before pictures but here is a before and after from the beginning of april to yesterday. I have learnt so much throughout it - mostly just ring the vet and ignore other peoples advice if they're not qualified! he was humongous lol

Well done.

 

[Birker2020]

Well done.

Yes you've done well to lose that OP.

 

[Clodagh]

Well wow he looks absolutely fabulous!

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

Good job he looks so much better

 

[TPO]

Wow!! Great job

 

[ihatework]

What a fantastic job you have done!

 

[Goldenstar]

Very very well done .

 

[Errin Paddywack]

What a difference, hard to believe it is the same horse. Well done.

 

[AmyMay]

What a difference, hard to believe it is the same horse. Well done.

In such a short space of time

 

[Aperchristmas]

He looks so much better. Well done and keep going! Sadly once they've had lami they are more prone to it in future so I'm afraid you have a life of constant vigilance ahead of you. But you now know what to look out for so with good management, you'll be able to avoid any repeats. Good luck!

 

[Lurfy]

Well done, he must feel a lot better.

 

[Red-1]

Well done on the weight loss. The EMS test will be interesting, I would speak with your vet about doing a cushings one too - if he's had lami, they are free in autumn, aside from the fee to draw the blood.

One note of caution, when Rigs was recovering from lami, he would be allowed to walk out in hand on the road or be ridden for a short time on the school. For some months, he found being ridden on the road a step too far with the concussion and weight combined. His compromised feet would initially cope with one or the other.

His feet were not as strong for well over a year, but he is now properly rock-crunching barefoot, so taking that aspect steady worked for him.