Feeling a bit down, told i must reserve a puppy at 2 weeks old

Shady said:
You are right P and this is what my gut tells me about this breeder and i am sorry that you had that experience :(. I don't know why but it went from him being pleased that i had particularly chosen him , all gushy and oh madame you can have pick of the litter to tough shyte, choose or lose!
Mr Vet has just left me a nice message saying that he has another litter due mid/end July, i can visit any time he is home to see his other dogs and he starts to let people see the pups at 6 weeks, he will reserve earlier but prefers not to, pups leave at 2 1/2 months.He has another male puppy at the moment that he really likes and is torn between keeping so it's possible he may have 2 that i can see next week or i can wait for the next litter
Am feeling a little happier now and all your reply's have helped me a lot
many thanks :):)
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I am glad it helped. Funnily enough the time wouldn't have been right for our puppy as it happens because we have just bought two lovely mini foals which are coming in the autumn so I now think next spring would be much better for a puppy. There is often a reason why these things happen and one thing I've learnt as I've got older is never be in too much of a hurry. I have had to wait two years to get the mini breeding and colours I wanted but I'm so glad I stuck it out. You WILL find the right dog - often they find you!
 
Shady said:
MyBoyChe and ChilliPup ( thank you ChilliPup :)
These are my thoughts too, when i bought Loki the breeder had reserved one to keep, one had an excellent head, one was HUGE, one was finer and Loki just wanted a lap to sit on! he was very affectionate and the breeder felt we would do well together, he could never sit next to you without a paw touching or his head in your lap, but thankfully he had no separation issues or guarding traits. He did however have a horrible habit of dragging knickers into the kitchen when i had company and waving them around, my bad for being a slob! xx
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My collie loves to do this
 
I'm sorry for your loss, and I hope that regardless who you buy from, that you find what you're looking for.

Personally, I once picked out a puppy when she was only 1 week old, and it went so well, that I wouldn't hesitate to do it again. It happened many years ago, when I went and looked at a Norwegian Buhund litter. As said, they were only 1 week old, I decided that I wanted Humla, paid a deposit, and 7 weeks later, I picked her up. I loved her so much, and even though it is now around 9 years since she died, I still miss her. By the way, I had a feeling that she would turn out to be a good looking bitch, and she became a Swedish Show Champion.

Thinking about it a bit more, as I recall, I think I chose Nessie when she was around 5 weeks old, Thera when she was 8 weeks, Raya when she was 4 to 5 weeks, Humla when she was 1 week, and Jonna when she was 4 weeks. The only one which it sadly didn't go well with, was with Thera, who was 8 weeks when I chose between her, and 1 unsold sister. Thera turned out to have both health, and other problems, and had to be euthanised when she was only a bit over 2 years old.

Beata and Blomma is Jonna's daughters, and I felt quite certain that I knew in about how both they, and their brother, would turn out to be as adults, from around 2 to 3 weeks of age. I wasn't wrong about either of the 3 of them.

Anyhow, if your gut feeling tells you the newer option is better, I hope that is where you find your new dog.
 
Shady that sounds like a much better solution. It may also be worth seeing if the other breeder still has any available at 6 weeks - I don't think his approach is unusual for France (admittedly I wasn't dog-hunting when I lived there so my experience is limited) and so I wouldn't judge him too harshly. You will know if the pup is for you so won't just fall for a cute puppy.
 
CorvusCorax said:
I'd spend a lot longer than an hour to select a dog that I want to live with me for over a decade. And no I don't think pet owners should accept lower health standards....why on earth should a family accept/pay for a dog that may have (hypothetically and not talking about this case) a nervy temperament, travel sickness, allergies, unsoundness...all things that will impact on a pet/family life.
I'd still like to see anyone pick 'the best' breeding animal at two weeks old.
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I'd be impressed that anyone could (within whatever time you usually spend at a breeders'?) check a pup for travel sickness, allergies etc. Do you actually ask to see the litter popped in a car for a quick spin?

I'm not sure what age it was identified but the breeder of a pedigree I dog I had via a rehome (got in touch to find out about his history) was quite open about the fact he wouldn't have met the standards for showing (too big for the breed) and so had been sold as a pet rather than kept/sold for breeding. I don't know exactly what age that was at but TBH I didn't/don't really have an issue with that. He was a great pet but wouldn't have been 'right' for breeding or showing of the breed he was.

Shady said:
related to the mum, dad is an unknown and it can make a huge difference who the stud is
I don't really understand this comment GirlFriday , how would the breeder even know at 2 weeks who was ' good' or ' pet '
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As above - could just be a question of not being true to type/meeting breed standard. TBH I'd hope that anyone thinking of future generations would also be aiming for healthy though.

In terms of the temperament - how much time would one be spending with the litter/parents at any point anyway?

I made my last dog decision in less than 60seconds based on previous conversations/breeding/initial impression. It was fine. No better/worse than the rehome I'd known for 7 yrs! But then a range of different things would have been fine. And in that instance I wasn't paying a great deal (my own travel costs, not a large purchase fee).

Anyway I hope you get the experience and dog you want OP.
 
Yes I would take one or other of them in the car for a spin. Not the whole litter at once. Travel sickness can be a big signpost of insecurity and environmental sensitivity in later life.
And yes I would want to see or spend time with the litter in its entirety and one or both of the parents. Genetics are hugely important.

I do totally agree with some of your other points as most of my dogs have been sold as not suitable for showing. But I don't agree that they are somehow 'lesser' animals.
 
I'm sorry to hear about Loki, Shady. :(

The vet's puppies are also forcing you into choosing one pup, maybe a choice of two, so I don't see how that's any better, tbh, unless they're older and the characters are clear. Is the line chasse or pet? Are you happy with the breeding?

I don't agree with having to choose a pup at 2 weeks. The characters were very clearly different between our two when we went to choose them at 9 weeks and I was glad to be able to choose what I wanted as opposed to a random pup. I'd hate to have two like Zak, love him tho I do, he's bloody hard work.
 
cinnamontoast said:
I'm sorry to hear about Loki, Shady. :(

The vet's puppies are also forcing you into choosing one pup, maybe a choice of two, so I don't see how that's any better, tbh, unless they're older and the characters are clear. Is the line chasse or pet? Are you happy with the breeding?

I don't agree with having to choose a pup at 2 weeks. The characters were very clearly different between our two when we went to choose them at 9 weeks and I was glad to be able to choose what I wanted as opposed to a random pup. I'd hate to have two like Zak, love him tho I do, he's bloody hard work.
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Thanks CTxx
Loki was pure chasse, they have a distinctive look that i like. Monsieur Vets are chasse and are ready to leave home next week. I would therefore be able to have a good look at both of them and his other dogs. The breeder i wanted to buy from because of the Loki connection has a mix, chasse on the female side( Loki's sister), a more sporty, narrower look on the male side. The stud is young, first mating i think.
A friend of mine chose 2 Lab x Beauceron pups at 3 weeks, never seen such different dogs, one was fat and lazy, the other a complete nightmare !
I am going to ponder on it all this weekend, the OH is pretty narky with the breeder now, he phoned him last night to question the 2 week thing again in relation to his pricing of the puppies. He is asking a set price which is actually very high( nearly £1000) so again my question would be why would i pay top money for a 2 week pup who could or could not be breed / show/ pet quality.
I am more confused by the minute!!!!!
 
CorvusCorax said:
Yes I would take one or other of them in the car for a spin. Not the whole litter at once. Travel sickness can be a big signpost of insecurity and environmental sensitivity in later life.
.
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really? I've not heard that before. My setter had travel sickness for a short while-you couldn't meet a bolder pup or adult. Quarrie was very car sick for about the first 6 weeks and while not the boldest pup (was determined to not go there again lol) he's not exactly insecure or reactive. Fitz was travel sick for about the first week or so but yes, his mind was blown. I always thought with very young pups it was an inner ear development issue that they mostly grew out of. Both dogs travel extremely well, they have to, I couldn't have a dog that didn't, so I did spend a lot of time getting them happy in it. Given my experiences i'd expect a pup to be car sick-I've only had one that wasn't and he was fairly mental in all other ways.
 
My dog travels very well now. It's manifested itself in other areas. He wasn't sick as in bokey, just insanely drooly, his legs were saturated. It's definitely something I'd be on the lookout for next time.
 
MotherOfChickens said:
really? I've not heard that before. My setter had travel sickness for a short while-you couldn't meet a bolder pup or adult. Quarrie was very car sick for about the first 6 weeks and while not the boldest pup (was determined to not go there again lol) he's not exactly insecure or reactive. Fitz was travel sick for about the first week or so but yes, his mind was blown. I always thought with very young pups it was an inner ear development issue that they mostly grew out of. Both dogs travel extremely well, they have to, I couldn't have a dog that didn't, so I did spend a lot of time getting them happy in it. Given my experiences i'd expect a pup to be car sick-I've only had one that wasn't and he was fairly mental in all other ways.
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Pretty much identical to me, even down to deliberately picking not picking the boldest pup in the litter as I wanted an easier life this time around :lol: Although the pup has never been remotely car sick in any shape or form.
 
GirlFriday said:
I assumed Mister Ted meant so that there is no issue with picking a pup. Adult dog so can see as much as ever...
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knowing this breed as i do i would not be keen on taking on an adult rescue , unless they are brought up with cats they are not very trustworthy with them and i have 6. They are a challenging breed and most that are in rescues have some pretty bad behavior problems, a friend of mine did it with an apparently well balanced dog and the result was catastrophic, not saying that is always the case and i have rescued many animals, but with cats , horses and another dog i would prefer to get a puppy
 
Shady said:
knowing this breed as i do i would not be keen on taking on an adult rescue , unless they are brought up with cats they are not very trustworthy with them and i have 6. They are a challenging breed and most that are in rescues have some pretty bad behavior problems, a friend of mine did it with an apparently well balanced dog and the result was catastrophic, not saying that is always the case and i have rescued many animals, but with cats , horses and another dog i would prefer to get a puppy
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Point taken about the qualities of the breed.Its a pity the breeder is asking to reserve at such a young age.I wonder why there is such a demand for the type.?
 
Mister Ted said:
Point taken about the qualities of the breed.Its a pity the breeder is asking to reserve at such a young age.I wonder why there is such a demand for the type.?
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That's a really good point Mr Ted and because i am miffed about the whole thing iv'e been digging on the net and looking at breeders sites etc. It's been very interesting!
Firstly, most breeders advertise that they are a great family dog, easy to train( god above!), perfect with anything that flies , crawls etc, wonderful with small furry things , children and other bolox like that. Some of that is true of course but this is not an easy breed as you probably know and they don't seem to separate pure chasse lines, in fact they don't seem to see the difference or even care.
Secondly and the thing i found most disheartening. The pups are advertised on free sites for as much money as possible at 2 weeks old, you reserve by collar colour and send 30-50%, sign a contract etc. 2/3 weeks later pups are reduced in price and continue to be reduced until all are spoken for. I have no idea how people choose a pup good enough for breeding like this.
In between are the few breeders who wait and do it properly and you get a choice( there are not many)
Then there are all the rest who buy pure race with papers etc and churn out puppies with no pedigrees attached to them, they have found a sneaky way around the new laws by asking for a 'donation' .
And of course don't forget all the breeders who sell exclusively to pet shops/shows over here
This applies to every breed of dog and cat that i could find.
Sometimes i really do despair after finding stuff out like this

I am going to see Mr Vets 2pups tomorrow morning, he sent me a video and they look wonderful!
 
Shady said:
Secondly and the thing i found most disheartening. The pups are advertised on free sites for as much money as possible at 2 weeks old, you reserve by collar colour and send 30-50%, sign a contract etc. 2/3 weeks later pups are reduced in price and continue to be reduced until all are spoken for. I have no idea how people choose a pup good enough for breeding like this.
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That's pretty depressing. Although surely with that system, it's just pot luck and you'd have just as much chance of getting a good one by waiting until they were older (and cheaper) and then going in person to see if there was anything nice among the leftovers?

Best of luck tomorrow, it sounds like a much more promising situation :-)
 
Shady said:
That's a really good point Mr Ted and because i am miffed about the whole thing iv'e been digging on the net and looking at breeders sites etc. It's been very interesting!
Firstly, most breeders advertise that they are a great family dog, easy to train( god above!), perfect with anything that flies , crawls etc, wonderful with small furry things , children and other bolox like that. Some of that is true of course but this is not an easy breed as you probably know and they don't seem to separate pure chasse lines, in fact they don't seem to see the difference or even care.
Secondly and the thing i found most disheartening. The pups are advertised on free sites for as much money as possible at 2 weeks old, you reserve by collar colour and send 30-50%, sign a contract etc. 2/3 weeks later pups are reduced in price and continue to be reduced until all are spoken for. I have no idea how people choose a pup good enough for breeding like this.
In between are the few breeders who wait and do it properly and you get a choice( there are not many)
Then there are all the rest who buy pure race with papers etc and churn out puppies with no pedigrees attached to them, they have found a sneaky way around the new laws by asking for a 'donation' .
And of course don't forget all the breeders who sell exclusively to pet shops/shows over here
This applies to every breed of dog and cat that i could find.
Sometimes i really do despair after finding stuff out like this

I am going to see Mr Vets 2pups tomorrow morning, he sent me a video and they look wonderful!
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I dont know the breed but some unscrupulous breeders are out to make a heck of a lot of money without the dogs welfare in focus (genes etc) as you point out.I wouldnt dream of buying from such breeders. I am a Cairn terrier owner and have kept them for 30yrs.My first puppy came from a reputable breeder.We saw the parents of our chosen pup at 7 wks. and took her home around 8 or 9 wks. After a wonderful 18 yrs. we had her p.t.s.after a short illnes. I contacted the breeder with the sad news and recieved a lovely letter in return. My last two Cairns were adults from the Cairn Rescue uk. Both happily had been well loved and trained.. one had to be trained to accept cats and they eventually ended up sleeping in the same basket.
My point is if you are unhappy with this breeder which by the sound of her is just in it for the money, speak your mind to her and say you will look elsewhere. I would not keep these people in business by parting with hundreds of pounds if you are not totally satisfied with. What if you had a follow up problem would they be concerned.? I dont think so.
 
cinnamontoast said:
Can we please have an update, Shady?
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Hi CT :)
I really wanted to do a new post with some pics but i'm ashamed to say that i'm not very good on a pc and can't work out how to put photo's from my laptop onto here
I traveled for hours deep into the countryside to find Mr Vets house, maddest journey iv'e ever had, went through tunnels and huge gorges, massive valleys and over wonderful rivers, saw castles and medieval villages hanging off the sides of cliffs and finally at the end of a winding road was a mostly derelict hamlet overlooking an enormous valley and 2 stunning Weim pups were running around with their mum!! I fell in love with one of them instantly, he is called Nickel, pronounced Neeck-el. He's 9 weeks old, house trained , socialised , calm, confident and attentive already, he won't win anything for conformation but he is beautiful and very loving. I completely adore him already :). Mr Vet was charming and so happy that we wanted Nickel he reduced the price to almost nothing :)
As i am writing this ( in bed) i have my beautiful big french hound asleep in one bed and little pup next to her in his, neither will stir till morning :)
Perfect...........:):)
xxxxxxxxxxx
 
Great news Shady, followed your post although I didn't comment. I agreed with your sentiments about the first breeder and am glad you have found a lovely pup.
I collect a flatcoat pup next week, I chose her at five weeks and paid a deposit. It was a bit young but you could see small differences. The breeder of my two current dogs bred the Mother, and I know the father , so all rather different.
Have a wonderful time with your new family member.
 
Chiffy said:
Great news Shady, followed your post although I didn't comment. I agreed with your sentiments about the first breeder and am glad you have found a lovely pup.
I collect a flatcoat pup next week, I chose her at five weeks and paid a deposit. It was a bit young but you could see small differences. The breeder of my two current dogs bred the Mother, and I know the father , so all rather different.
Have a wonderful time with your new family member.
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Thanks Chiffy! how lovely that you will also have a new pup in your life :) i hope she is as wonderful as my little chap seems to be. Leo Walker is going to pop a photo on, i'm just going to send it to her. I have a cat breeder friend who iv'e known for over 30 years, iv'e had kittens from her with her choosing them and i trust her completely but i really felt strongly about buying a Weim pup at 2 weeks old from somebody i don't know. Very best of luck to you with your new girl xxx Pics please :)
 
Chiffy said:
Great news Shady, followed your post although I didn't comment. I agreed with your sentiments about the first breeder and am glad you have found a lovely pup.
I collect a flatcoat pup next week, I chose her at five weeks and paid a deposit. It was a bit young but you could see small differences. The breeder of my two current dogs bred the Mother, and I know the father , so all rather different.
Have a wonderful time with your new family member.
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Happy days Chiffy. Baby flatcoat pictures demanded.........Please
 
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