Feeling a bit down

J

JACQSZOO

Well-Known Member
Joined
12 June 2005
Messages
3,127
Location
Shropshire
Visit site
I'm not having a good day. I'm struggling bit time with Georgie and its getting me down.
Georgie is a laid back chilled kind of guy, which has been great for my confidence issues after Tallagh, but he is such hard work. Hes not forward thinking at all and after spending many years riding nothing but really forward horses I dont have the necessary skills to get him going. My instructor finds him hard work and so does my YO - but they are making headway - its me that seems to have come to a standstill.
The left rein is coming along - hes now walking and trotting, working correctly, its still very hard work but its making progress. Its his right rein that causes the most issues, its a battle to get him to bend. Its a battle to get him going forwards.
The lack of forwardness isnt just in the school, hes like it hacking too. I went hacking on Sunday and went for a canter with my friend - Georgie stopped half way and decided it was too much like hard work. He is improving as he is getting fitter, he can now hack for 2 hours without dieing on me after 1/2 an hour.
It doesnt help that my arse is so close to the ground and Georige now stands at nearly 16.3hh - he was just under 16hh when I bought him.
Last nights schooling was a waste of time, he wouldnt go forward, he wouldnt bend. I got off after 3/4 hour, my legs knackered, sweating like a pig and puffing like I'd just run a marathon....and Georgie - did'nt look like he had done a thing.
I know I'm uselss, I have no strength in my legs which in turn affects my upper body position. I so want to be able to do this but right now feel like I havent got a cat in hells chance.
I've started running in a hope to up my fitness levels but I'm not sure what else I can do.
Sorry for going on and sorry for being such a moaning minnie when there are people in this world with real problems.
frown.gif
 
Do you have the opportunity of riding other horses?? You are probably doing a much better job than you think, but becuase you are always 'battling' it's not that obvious to you.

Riding other horses can help - well it has me anyway.
 
Due to your size and the size of the horse have you thought of using spurs, just to help accentuate your leg aids. I don't usually recommend relying on spurs but I find we use spurs on the lazier horses and once they have learned with them, we take them off and we find they are actually more responsive than they were before. Just another question has he always been this lazy have you had some bloods taken to check he's not under the weather.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Due to your size and the size of the horse have you thought of using spurs, just to help accentuate your leg aids. I don't usually recommend relying on spurs but I find we use spurs on the lazier horses and once they have learned with them, we take them off and we find they are actually more responsive than they were before. Just another question has he always been this lazy have you had some bloods taken to check he's not under the weather.

[/ QUOTE ]

I had spurs on last night made not a jot of difference. And yes, he's always been lazy - its just the way he is.
I was keeping him in in January due to the bad weather, he was no more forward going then and turning him out is hilarious - its like taking a tortoise for a walk.
 
I would get a different instructor. If they can't get him to work properly they aren't going to help you. Whenever I've had a really lazy horse my instructor has got on them spent 15 mins installing the basics of you will not ignore my leg I get back on and its a different horse.

You are going to have to be tough. Have him stood still, ask him to go forward with the lightest of aids and if he ignores you give him a massive PC kick or a smack. give him a pat when he moves forward, if he trots let him just don't restrict the forward movement. Keep repeating until he works it out, and he will. If when you are moving and he starts going slow, ask him for more with a light aid and if he ignores you big kick. You have to be really strict with yourself to be consistent and don't get into the habit of nagging with your legs.

He will get better. You don't need strong legs just a horse that listens to what you've got already
 
Oh no looks like we're in the same boat, its a roller coaster but sometimes its good to stand back and look at the progress you HAVE made. It made me laugh you get so knackered too, I was schooling the Ryu other night and the steam was pouring off me me friend was creasing I call him my four legged multi-gym. Look on the bright side these people with forward horses get cold feet because they're not nagging with their legs all time. Perhaps we should form the 'A bit backward horse clique'
 
I know exactly where you're coming from - I've got 2 lazy girls to ride
frown.gif
.
What's he like on the lunge? Does he respect the lunge whip? I've spent many a lesson being chased round by my RI with her whip in order to get a bit of forwardness. It might help a bit.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Oh no looks like we're in the same boat, its a roller coaster but sometimes its good to stand back and look at the progress you HAVE made. It made me laugh you get so knackered too, I was schooling the Ryu other night and the steam was pouring off me me friend was creasing I call him my four legged multi-gym. Look on the bright side these people with forward horses get cold feet because they're not nagging with their legs all time. Perhaps we should form the 'A bit backward horse clique'

[/ QUOTE ]

You are so right- the inside of my riding hat is testament to how hard I'm trying - its minging! Its just soo blinkin disheartening. I have not got great ambitions, I'd just like to have a reasonably schooled horse that I could do a bit of unafilliated pre-lim dressage.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I know exactly where you're coming from - I've got 2 lazy girls to ride
frown.gif
.
What's he like on the lunge? Does he respect the lunge whip? I've spent many a lesson being chased round by my RI with her whip in order to get a bit of forwardness. It might help a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]

On the lunge hes the same - unless of course he has one on him and then he can become quite athletic - but no the majority of the time I have to chase him round - I end up working just as hard as he does.
 
[ QUOTE ]
I would get a different instructor. If they can't get him to work properly they aren't going to help you. Whenever I've had a really lazy horse my instructor has got on them spent 15 mins installing the basics of you will not ignore my leg I get back on and its a different horse.

You are going to have to be tough. Have him stood still, ask him to go forward with the lightest of aids and if he ignores you give him a massive PC kick or a smack. give him a pat when he moves forward, if he trots let him just don't restrict the forward movement. Keep repeating until he works it out, and he will. If when you are moving and he starts going slow, ask him for more with a light aid and if he ignores you big kick. You have to be really strict with yourself to be consistent and don't get into the habit of nagging with your legs.

He will get better. You don't need strong legs just a horse that listens to what you've got already

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't get me wrong - my instructor and YO can get him going but both have said he isn't easy. Its not that he can't do it - more that he doesnt want to. Why work when you can pretend to be a seaside donkey. He is getting better as he is getting fitter, its just that I seem to have reached a level and am struggling to get any further - does that make sense?
 
Ok I have my hands over my head as I say this! and getting ready to run!

We don't use normal stubby spurs, we have western spurs with blunted rowls.

OK running for cover before I get massively told off. We found this method does work, but you have to be really careful with your use of these spurs, if you are a person who has a tendancy to kick rather than squeeze then for goodness stake don't put them on, all you want is for them to back up the request from your leg. Also long reigning and asking for active forward work from the floor helps.

Also getting the horse to work with no contact on the mouth just to get it to move forwards may help.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Ok I have my hands over my head as I say this! and getting ready to run!

We don't use normal stubby spurs, we have western spurs with blunted rowls.

OK running for cover before I get massively told off. We found this method does work, but you have to be really careful with your use of these spurs, if you are a person who has a tendancy to kick rather than squeeze then for goodness stake don't put them on, all you want is for them to back up the request from your leg. Also long reigning and asking for active forward work from the floor helps.

Also getting the horse to work with no contact on the mouth just to get it to move forwards may help.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its OK you dont need to run from me! TBH I dont think I would be happy with the spurs, I dont feel my leg position is strong enough and I do have to use a lot of leg. We are doing exaclty what you suggest on the right rein at the moment and just concentrating on getting him forwards and asking for the correct bend with little contact. Its just a very very slow process and it doesnt feel like were getting anywhere.
 
You will get there, although sometimes this does feel like you are constantly slogging uphill. Try not to get too disheartened, you will get there. OK really evil thought how about strapping some of those electic zapper dog collers onto your boots so he gets a zap to go forward!
tongue.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
You will get there, although sometimes this does feel like you are constantly slogging uphill. Try not to get too disheartened, you will get there. OK really evil thought how about strapping some of those electic zapper dog collers onto your boots so he gets a zap to go forward!
tongue.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

lol I did suggest last night that someone could chase us around the arena with a cattle prodder.
grin.gif
 
Hi JZ

Just wondering what you are feeding your lad, whether it might be worth feeding him something to sharpen him up a little. Obviously not too much but something to make your life easier?

Keep going with it youll get there in the end.

Hb x
 
[ QUOTE ]
Hi JZ

Just wondering what you are feeding your lad, whether it might be worth feeding him something to sharpen him up a little. Obviously not too much but something to make your life easier?

Keep going with it youll get there in the end.

Hb x

[/ QUOTE ]

Funny you should say that - at the moment he has ad-lib hayledge and two feeds of alfa a, handful of sugarbeet and a general supplement. YO who is schooling him for me twice a week wants to hold off on upping the feeding at the moment until he accepts that he has to work. He can be very nappy and the YO is concerned that upping his feed too soon while he is in this "can't won't shan't" phase will only give him more energy to evade rather than work. Perhaps we are barking up the wrong tree?
confused.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
I would get a different instructor. If they can't get him to work properly they aren't going to help you. Whenever I've had a really lazy horse my instructor has got on them spent 15 mins installing the basics of you will not ignore my leg I get back on and its a different horse.

You are going to have to be tough. Have him stood still, ask him to go forward with the lightest of aids and if he ignores you give him a massive PC kick or a smack. give him a pat when he moves forward, if he trots let him just don't restrict the forward movement. Keep repeating until he works it out, and he will. If when you are moving and he starts going slow, ask him for more with a light aid and if he ignores you big kick. You have to be really strict with yourself to be consistent and don't get into the habit of nagging with your legs.

He will get better. You don't need strong legs just a horse that listens to what you've got already

[/ QUOTE ]


I totally agree with DD.

I was in the habit of nagging with my leg until I took lessons and my instructor sorted me out!
Now I ask once or twice and if I don't get respect then I enforce my leg aids with schooling whip. Now she is much more responsive to leg aids but I have to keep reminding myself not to let her away with it as I am a soft touch and she knows it!
Lots of transitions help too.

Obviously on the other hand you want to check he's not actually in pain etc.
Mine is also much better in the winter when her feeding is upped so thats also a route you could think of.
 
My friend has just changed her horses feed and he's gone from being a complete tortoise to relatively forward going and seems to have a bit more of a zest for life. I shall ask her what he's now on.
 
[ QUOTE ]
He can be very nappy and the YO is concerned that upping his feed too soon while he is in this "can't won't shan't" phase will only give him more energy to evade rather than work. Perhaps we are barking up the wrong tree?
confused.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

No you are right, you dont want to give him too many straights so he becomes a pest to ride. What suppliment are you feeding him? Have you recently given him a pre/pro biotic to make sure his enzymes in his gut are ok?

Maybe I am clutching at straws here.

Could you have lunge lessons to help you with your seat and leg positions, that way the person lunging will be doing speed and steering?

Hb
 
[ QUOTE ]
I.

You are going to have to be tough. Have him stood still, ask him to go forward with the lightest of aids and if he ignores you give him a massive PC kick or a smack. give him a pat when he moves forward, if he trots let him just don't restrict the forward movement. Keep repeating until he works it out, and he will. If when you are moving and he starts going slow, ask him for more with a light aid and if he ignores you big kick. You have to be really strict with yourself to be consistent and don't get into the habit of nagging with your legs.

He will get better. You don't need strong legs just a horse that listens to what you've got already

[/ QUOTE ] I agree totally - we had a friends cob at my yard. My daughter and I could get her going after a short 'you will do as you are told' session. The owners couldnt be bothered to spend the time and be consistent. The mare just took the micheal with them. It may help if someone watches from the ground and shouts at you to remind you that you are being strict, it only takes a couple of 'nags' from you and the horse getting away with it for the whole session to be undone.

I would also agree with getting vet check and perhaps looking at your feed regime just to be on the safe side - Good luck
 
It's a good idea to investigate it.

I normally use the 'can't or won't' to decide about feeding levels lol

If mine is being lazy when schooling but then I put a jump up and she charges round I know it's not feeding problem but that she's just having me on!

I also found that a lot of variety helps, as its just schooling she hates I make sure I don't school twice in a row and do lots of different excercises when I do.
 
I have a very lazy boy too, i always look like i've runa marathon after riding him and he's as cool as a cucumber lol! I did find spurs helped a little, but what really gives me confidence is looking at the progress we've made. Try not to be too hard on yourself, you'll get there in the end.
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He can be very nappy and the YO is concerned that upping his feed too soon while he is in this "can't won't shan't" phase will only give him more energy to evade rather than work. Perhaps we are barking up the wrong tree?
confused.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

No you are right, you dont want to give him too many straights so he becomes a pest to ride. What suppliment are you feeding him? Have you recently given him a pre/pro biotic to make sure his enzymes in his gut are ok?

Maybe I am clutching at straws here.

Could you have lunge lessons to help you with your seat and leg positions, that way the person lunging will be doing speed and steering?

Hb

[/ QUOTE ]

He gets nafs general min & vit supplement. Hes not on or had any probiotic. I have had him now for 12 months and he is just a generally laid back sort of fella. Hes had his teeth, saddle etc etc all checked. I'm as certain as I can be that there is nothing physcial going on, as when in the correct frame of mind my instructor can have him going like a dream.
 
You have reached a 'learning platue' (sp) which everyone reaches and it just means you may need to change tactics.

I agree with DD, ask him lightly and if he refuses give him a boot then praise him when he moves forward. If you feel him backing off again or slowing down then boot again. DONT nag with your legs otherwise he will become dead to the leg and not respect your aids.

You need to be really firm with him and at first it might not seem like it is working but it will eventually sink in.
 
I had the same problem with Bob. I used to do 20 mins and end up TOTALLY knackered.
I felt like I was nagging away with my leg constantly to keep any momentum and it was killing me.

I've been having once, sometimes twice weekly lessons with my instructor for a couple of momths now, and have also upped his feed (nothing heating), and there is a definite improvement.
HE is now much more forward and lighter off the leg, and listens more.

Instructor also spent some time schooling him during our lessons, and she didn't let him away witth ANything!!! As soon as he went backwards, he was pushed on strongly.

she also encouraged riding with 2 schooling whips , one in each hand( not used unless neccessary to back up legs), and it seems to get them more forward.

I've actually been managing to get and maintain canter recently, whereas i was struggling to get it before.!

Also, what is your horse like with poles? We found even if you introduce a few on the ground when schooling, it get's them more interested and thinking forward, rather than thinking....oh no...more boring circles.....

Feed wise, I just upped his fibre ( hay and chaff) but also added sugarbeet and a pro-biotic.

Instructor raves about Top-Spec conditioning flakes, so I may consider introducing them, depending on how we get on.

Jsut try and remember, however disheartening it seems....on a positive note, a lot of people would Kill to have a safe, steady hack that doesn't b*gger off with them

grin.gif
 
Thats good to hear. We are a month and a bit in to the new work regime so theres hope for us yet. I just hoped we would have at least got a nice trot going by now. We have also started using poles this week, in a square, going round them to help encourage the bend and over them etc - in fact last night I had the poles down but we were going backwards instead of forwards so spent practically all the session attempting to get a forwards trot round the school.

And please everyone, dont get me wrong, I love him to bits and hes helped my confidence no end.

Thank you all for your advice.
 
[ QUOTE ]
He gets nafs general min & vit supplement. Hes not on or had any probiotic. I have had him now for 12 months and he is just a generally laid back sort of fella. Hes had his teeth, saddle etc etc all checked. I'm as certain as I can be that there is nothing physcial going on, as when in the correct frame of mind my instructor can have him going like a dream.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you hack him out he might need a change in routine to liven him up a little. Dont forget you can school hacking out, try a little leg yielding to get him to listen. Also turns on the forehands will help engage that bottom and mean it is easier for him to use his engine.

A sharp little reminder of the whip will also help to back up your leg. Let him shoot forwards as that is what you want him to do and then when you next ask with your leg his should respond better.

Hope that helps
crazy.gif


Hb

ET I type like a muppet
tongue.gif
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top