Feeling seriously overhorsed at the moment - help please

[Pidge]

Ok so have ridden Pidge in double bridle last two nights. Hold my hands up and admit I did ride him off the curb only for a couple of minutes last night as I just couldn't hold him

We then had some semblance of control back. Have tried kk snaffle with flash and market harborough, jointed pelham with 2 reins and now the double bridle.
My problem is that he is NOT supposed to be cantering - vets instructions whilst his hock spavin is fusing. however Pidge seems oblivious to this. I am trying to get him working properly as his movement is far better then. But at the moment I would just like to be able to do some trot work without having him pinging round inside out trying to canter

My instructor is very good and have booked 3 sessions with her next week to help to try to crack this, but I really could do with some tips from you guys as to how I can just get him to trot without cantering as I need to do more trot than I am at the moment but am struggling as he just ends up cantering.
He is on a small paddock with ad lib hay and his feed now consists of his TopSpec feed balancer, 2 handfuls of alpha a (only so powders mix in ok), garlic, naf d-tox, bute and newmarket supplement so isn't on a great deal of food. I can't lunge him as I would have less control so am really after some much needed advice. Just feel so dispirited at the moment. I know deep down I am not overhorsed as I've done loads with him and all in a snaffle

just having a bit of a problem at this moment in time.
Sorry for the long post, cookies to those that made it to the end

 

[K9Wendy]

Just a thought, but maybe he is finding it more comfortable to canter than to trot. Have you considered hacking, at walk and trot or would still canter on the road? Even long reining instead of lunging as you have heaps more control.

A calmer may help, although I personally have no experience off them I have friends who does, and it helps with the spookiness, leaping out of their skin behaviour..

It must be incredibly frustrating and you are having so many highs and lows with him right now.. But hey, you know Pidge inside out, and you know you are not over horsed; he just has different ideas to yours at the moment!!

Sorry not much help, just wanted to offer my support... and get my cookie please

 

[dozzie]

If he has pain in his hocks then he may be trying to avoid engaging them, falling onto the forehand and into canter. In other words I suspect this is linked to the Hock Spavins.

So I dont think it is either your fault or his.

But I think I would explain this to the vet as if the canter is going to do damage then you may need to keep everything at a walk and take things more slowly. I dont really know the answer tbh but I do think hes trying to please you but also trying to avoid the pain

Poor chap.

I would speak to vet to establish what will do more harm.

Hope this helps a bit!

 

[Jemayni]

Interesting what the others have said. Have you tried a calmer? Something like 'so calm' can be given like a wormer, so you notice quite a significant difference. The other thing I thought of, but depends on finance & what the ever; my friend recently had similar problems with her horse as he was coming back from suspensory problems, she is very nervous, so decided to send him up to Beaver Hall, they're rehab livery was really fantastic for him & she didnt have to worry about him at all!

 

[K9Wendy]

Had another thought (not good this time of the morning) but is his dose of bute high enough? I ask because it does sound like he could be in a bit of pain, therefore either cantering to avoid the discomfort in trot or running away from it.

As your know our little mare if on box rest due to soft tissue damage in foot/fetlock area. Before she was very lame her behaviour changed, and basically we think she was running away from the pain, if you know what I mean, she was avoiding engagement and the next step was getting the rider off!!!!

With Spavins the treatment is to bute and work through to fuse the joint, so what I am thinking is his level of bute is not high enough for him to do this comfortably... He is a big boy... and so adorable!!

 

[Pidge]

cookie winging its way to you

just think he is feeling very good at the moment as opposed to hurting when trotting so will have to see how he goes. Every vibe from him at the moment is that he is feeling sooooo good

can only walk on the roads at the moment - again on vets advice. might give the long reining a go thanks for that.
Have tried calmers before but they did nothing to him at all

 

[Patches]

Another point to consider.....Patches was really "gobby" when on bute and lacked certain manners when riding. She was not only over mouthing the bit but jogging constantly and trying to take off on the roads. It's the only time I've ever felt I lacked control/brakes with her and coming to junctions was sometimes terrifying! I had no choice but to hack her though as it was when she'd got the adhesions on her knee. As soon as I dropped the bute off she returned to normal.

I didn't associate it with the bute until I made a post on here and then spoke to the vet. It's not common, but it does happen with some horses. Someone on here made a reference to a horse Princess Anne was riding once that took off with her when it was being ridden on bute.

When Patches needed pain relief after her hock treatments, she was put on Metacam instead to avoid a repeat. It's expensive though, so not really an option for longer term dosings. I only used it for two weeks.

 

[ruscara]

Well, two things occur to me: One - as other people have said, he might just find canter more comfortable than trot at the moment; and two: Top Spec balancer sent my horse loopy! I don't know how long yours has been on it, but it could welll be that. I have heard other people say this, too (although it has good reports too) but I think it could be that the balancer is not helping. I know it's only a small amount, but it really sent my horse barmy.

 

[Moggy]

Give long reining a go , you'll have far more brakes. I know a lot of people would disagree but if he gets any worse I'd talk to your vet about using ACP or Sedalin before you ride, not ideal but it saves you both getting hurt.

Cx

 

[Madam_max]

Hi, I echo what Patches had said Corroy was horrible to ride on bute, I had no control whatsoever.

 

[Pidge]

Sorry for not replying earlier as am at work and have to keep sneaking on here! Have rung the vets and someone will be calling me back so I can talk this through with them
Dozziesmummy – you see this is the problem I have, how do I know if it is pain he is trying to avoid or just that he is feeling well? He does drop and engage in walk but bearing in mind we have only recently (this year) been trying to get him to work like this it does not come easy to him. And I can get it in the trot as well but harder to achieve than the walk. Plus he does try to please me; he is a very genuine horse and will do something just because I have asked him to.
Jemayni – tried him on that ‘magic’ calmer (think that’s what it was called) and it did no good whatsoever so am loathe to spend money on another calmer if it doesn’t work, plus I need a quick fix rather than one that will take a couple of weeks to take effect. Hadn’t thought about Beaver Hall, not too far from me, but how expensive would that be?
Keisha – he’s only on ½ satchet in the morning and ½ at night – which he has after I have ridden him in the evening. Will ask the vet when he rings back if he thinks the bute is high enough – wish Pidge could talk and tell me if he was in pain or just full of life!
Patches – now that’s very interesting as that sounds exactly like how Pidge is at the moment, we have also discovered jogging and I hate jogging!!!! Just have no brakes whatsoever, he has turned into a yob. Will definitely mention this to the vet when he rings back, hopefully insurance will be footing the bill for all of this so not worrying too much about the money at the moment, and if not will just take some out of the building society to cover it.
Marius Mum – He’s been on the topspec for nearly two years now and has never made him loopy before so pretty certain its not that that’s making him like this. He’s only on the alpha a so the powders mix in properly.
Moggy – Will try the long reining as have lots of time after today as on hols all next week. He was on 5ACP in the morn and 5 at night but this stopped on Wednesday, so hasn’t really made a difference to how he is ridden!
Madam-Max – Thanks for this, will definitely be asking the vet about an alternative to the bute then. What did you use instead of the bute? Was it Metacam like Patches used?

 

[LeneHorse]

could you try Danilone (sp) (Yellow granules) instead of bute? My vet tends to give it instead of bute - says its less hard on their liver

 

[Madam_max]

I had to take her off it anyway as she got really bad colic, vet said it was related. She had been on it for months. Touch wood she hasn't needed bute for years and obviously I wouldn't give it to her, so I am afraid I don't know about alternatives.

 

[1CTrenowath]

[ QUOTE ]
Keisha – he’s only on ½ satchet in the morning and ½ at night – which he has after I have ridden him in the evening. Will ask the vet when he rings back if he thinks the bute is high enough – wish Pidge could talk and tell me if he was in pain or just full of life!


[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm, definitely worth asking I would have thought - Pidge being the large chap he is. I know when I was trying to find a dose which kept Torc (17.hh h/w ID) happy, my vet was quite scornful of anything under a sachet at a time - as in ' well that won't do a thing'

(she is really nice, she just says it as she sees it!!)

Could it be that he is quite bored on restricted grazing ?- i.e. would a snack ball of some kind keep him busier, so it isn't quite so overwhelmingly exciting when mummy comes to ride?

Hope you get sorted.

 

[Pidge]

Ok, have spoken to the senior vet (he's been involved in what is happening with Pidge anyway as my vet is on hols) he has reassured me that Pidge is feeling fine and doesn't sound like he is in pain. He wouldn't be doing what he's doing if he was in pain as the one bute a day wouldn't really mask a lot of pain. He also said that if he was in pain then he would be showing signs of going lame again which he hasn't. He is moving well and no signs of it hurting him as its not coming underneath him like it was originally when he first went lame.
He advised letting him canter if he wants to, and keep him on the 1 bute a day, with a review of how Pidge is on Monday. thanks ever so much for the help and advice everyone, much appreciated

thanks for putting up with my endless posts about Pidge

 

[Butterbean]

Sounds like good news from the vet. I'm sure you'd be able to tell if Pidge were in pain, as you are pretty in tune with him, it does sound like he's full of the joys of spring!

We were advised that cantering was ok while trying to fuse the joint, that there is a school of thought that it is actually better for the horse to canter rather than trot - just keep it in straight lines to begin with, no tight turns or small circles. In fact a lot of the time Marco is warmed up in walk then canter (cantering large round the school), before working in trot. It seems to suit him.

 

[ruscara]

That is good news, then, and a relief for you that you can relax a bit when it comes to riding. I hope everything continues well, and the vet has positive comments when he comes again.

 

[dwi]

Hugs, you're not overhorsed, just going through a difficult time with him at the mo. I can't offer any help because I also have a strong three legged horse other than to say why not look back at some of your old photos to remind you how much fun you had together when you were out and about last summer. He knows you're his mum and I'm sure he wouldn't want anyone else

 

[H's mum]

I was just going to ask... why won't the vet let you canter - it's a far more easier gait for the arthritic horse to loosen up in - so much easier than trot which is bilateral - You'll probably find that your horse is "anticipating" the pain and therefore not wanting to trot but to canter instead - My old cob used to do this when he had hock problems.
Good luck!
Kate x

 

[Pidge]

thanks again everyone

tried a different tack tonight and hacked him out for 30mins before schooling him. Hacked at a good pace but not working in an outline as he is too damn nosey when out hacking and loves to see what is going on

so just made sure he was striding out well.
Schooled him and he was fine, did lots of trot and





no canter at all

Ok so there wasn't really a lot of working properly but I schooled him for a good 30 mins and did lots of trot and only once did he think about cantering. And to make me really happy I trotted him on a long rein on both reins and he was fine

think he might have realised he'd pushed me to the limit yesterday

so am a happy mummy tonight

just have to see how he is over the next couple of days but at least I know that if he does canter then its not a major problem. thanks once again for all the help and advice this place is worth its weight in gold