'first time xc only broken 5 days!'

Tiddlypom said:
Lovely little horse, sympathetically ridden.

However, what if someone posted the following question on HHO.

'My horse has not been ridden for three years, through no fault of his own. He's a very easy, genuine type. I've just started to ride him again this week, and I've been offered a chance to take him cross country schooling at the weekend. Do you think I should take him?'

We'd all reply 'No, he won't be fit enough!'. So what's the difference here? Born broke or not, that was a lot of jumping for a baby.
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As devils advocate here, I would say a major difference would be that to be just broken, it is highly likely that there has been a decent amount of groundwork done for the pony to be that balanced and it doesn't look as weak as most, not did it look to be finding it hard, so I think a just broken horse that has been in consistent ground work is far more capable than a horse coming in from the field for 5 days.

This is based on assumptions of course.
 
Tiddlypom said:
Lovely little horse, sympathetically ridden.

However, what if someone posted the following question on HHO.

'My horse has not been ridden for three years, through no fault of his own. He's a very easy, genuine type. I've just started to ride him again this week, and I've been offered a chance to take him cross country schooling at the weekend. Do you think I should take him?'

We'd all reply 'No, he won't be fit enough!'. So what's the difference here? Born broke or not, that was a lot of jumping for a baby.
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That's assuming the horse has just been sat in a field until he was broken. There could have been a lot of groundwork that took place beforehand that would have helped with fitness. Though I still stand by my thoughts that his muscles wouldn't have been developed enough to deal with this if he had indeed been broken for just 5 days.
 
Kikke said:
'born broke' or 'broken at first contact' poor pony don't want to know what will be in store for her. poor joints.
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I don't understand that. If these are dealers and this pony gets sold, being an honest, genuine little thing means that she will most likely find herself in a good home. It's not these ponies that need our worry, it's the ones that can't/won't/don't go well that face the most uncertain futures. This little one is probably headed for a life of being treated like a little princess.
 
_GG_ said:
I don't understand that. If these are dealers and this pony gets sold, being an honest, genuine little thing means that she will most likely find herself in a good home. It's not these ponies that need our worry, it's the ones that can't/won't/don't go well that face the most uncertain futures. This little one is probably headed for a life of being treated like a little princess.
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This what I think too.
A pony like that will be away from the dealers soon and with a mind like that it has every chance having a very very happy life.
 
annagain said:
I don't believe that pony has only been broken 5 days. Apart from anything, his steering is way too good, that canter, whilst far from perfect is too balanced for a real baby and there's not one second look or babyish jump in there. He knows what he's doing. If they're dealers, I imagine they're trying to make out he's doing that after just 5 days to suggest he's very easy to train and bump his price up (not that a horse doing XC after 5 days would be attractive to me)
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I agree with this. But if it is true that it's only been broken 5 days, then I find it abhorrent tbh.
 
Kikke said:
'born broke' or 'broken at first contact' poor pony don't want to know what will be in store for her. poor joints.
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Yeah - thanks for singling me out!

What's in store for this pony? Probably a very nice PC home where he/she will be loved to bits, and have a very nice life. Good safe ponies who do the job without drama tend to land on their feet.
 
Auslander said:
Yeah - thanks for singling me out!

What's in store for this pony? Probably a very nice PC home where he/she will be loved to bits, and have a very nice life. Good safe ponies who do the job without drama tend to land on their feet.
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That's a fair point, and probably correct. However it doesn't make it right that a newly broken pony should be put under strain in that way.
 
Auslander said:
Yeah - thanks for singling me out!

What's in store for this pony? Probably a very nice PC home where he/she will be loved to bits, and have a very nice life. Good safe ponies who do the job without drama tend to land on their feet.
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not singling you out at all except that I don't think any pony or horse is born broke and that was your comment so there you go.
sure a pony like that may be very popular doesn't change the fact that it is unhealthy to make a pony jump like that after only 5 days of work! And well yes it may well land on it's feet at a good home but again doesn't change the 'bad' start and the consequences for the poor thing in the future!
 
I was at the sales he was sold at, and he was indeed brought by these people as unbroken, however from his general behaviour at the sale if say his groundwork was excellent!
 
who knows when it was backed there's a lot of b***** goes round in the horse world. My been backed 6 months welshie would have a break down trying to work out where his legs were if I asked him to do this but, I hopefully have the rest of his days to enjoy him and aren't looking to make a fast buck
 
annagain said:
I don't believe that pony has only been broken 5 days. Apart from anything, his steering is way too good, that canter, whilst far from perfect is too balanced for a real baby and there's not one second look or babyish jump in there. He knows what he's doing. If they're dealers, I imagine they're trying to make out he's doing that after just 5 days to suggest he's very easy to train and bump his price up (not that a horse doing XC after 5 days would be attractive to me)
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I agree. And its a lovely little horse.

Why on earth does it need leg protection? And of course the rider is not to heavy.
 
Kikke said:
not singling you out at all except that I don't think any pony or horse is born broke and that was your comment so there you go.
sure a pony like that may be very popular doesn't change the fact that it is unhealthy to make a pony jump like that after only 5 days of work! And well yes it may well land on it's feet at a good home but again doesn't change the 'bad' start and the consequences for the poor thing in the future!
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I don't think i said anywhere that I thought it was correct to do so - I commented that it was going sweetly and jumping confidently.

"Born broke" is just an expression, and one that people who start a lot of youngsters will understand. You may have had a different experience with the horses you have started - I've found that there are always some who seem to understand what its all about right from the word go, and are naturally balanced, confident and find work easy, just as there are always others who take far longer than you'd expect just to get the basics installed.
 
Lovely horse with a cracking attitude. Without knowing whether the background is true or cock and bull, it's a horse that's worth a second look. Then its up to the skill of the buyer to see exactly where the horse is at, regarding maturity, age and what training it's actually had.
 
What I saw in that video was a green, honest baby following his friend over some jumps. He'll make someone a lovely mount whatever the politics behind jumping so soon after breaking.
 
That was a lot of fences / cantering for something broken 5 days but I wonder what the owners def of broken is - maybe its when its buttons and steering is all established so could well be quite fit by then. If it was 5th time being ridden very different story.
 
maccachic said:
That was a lot of fences / cantering for something broken 5 days but I wonder what the owners def of broken is - maybe its when its buttons and steering is all established so could well be quite fit by then. If it was 5th time being ridden very different story.
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This. It says "5 days after being broken" not "5 days after being backed". Everyone is always so keen to judge, assume and pour scorn on others but when you really look at the video, all I see is happy little youngster, enjoying the experience and being ridden really nicely through it. Not cantered into everything, not forced, not pushed, kicked or bullied.

5 days after being broken could well mean 5 days after a predetermined period of training. It would certainly seem that way given the ease of the pony in this video.
 
Moomin1 said:
That's a fair point, and probably correct. However it doesn't make it right that a newly broken pony should be put under strain in that way.
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How do you know its not 5, 6 or 7 plus and been free jumping since it was 4 over 1.10m+ ? Popping over dome little jumps once broken is hardly going to be hard for it!
 
_GG_ said:
This. It says "5 days after being broken" not "5 days after being backed". Everyone is always so keen to judge, assume and pour scorn on others ...........

5 days after being broken could well mean 5 days after a predetermined period of training.
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How would you count five days after being broken though? When is a horse 'broken', to start counting from if you don't count from when it is sat on? I don't think people were unfair to assume that it meant from being sat on, and your comment is a bit harsh.

I don't think it's true, but that's beside the point.
 
fawaz said:
How do you know its not 5, 6 or 7 plus and been free jumping since it was 4 over 1.10m+ ? Popping over dome little jumps once broken is hardly going to be hard for it!
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Free jumping is hardly the same as having a rider on. Whilst the rider on board isn't over heavy for the pony IMO, she's not lightweight either. Secondly, some of those jumps are hardly little...or they certainly aren't what I would class as small for a newly broken pony anyway.

I am quite perplexed as to how people can think doing the jumps in the vid would be 'easy' for a newly broken pony with a rider on board.
 
Just to throw my two pen nth in!
Maybe he was sent away to professionals to be "broken"? He might have been on a pro yard for a couple of months and now returned as "broken"?

I had a friend send hers away to be broken at a pro yard as a 5 yr old after she'd done months of ground work. She just didn't have the self confidence to put in place his early schooling. He came back a lovely, sweet, correctly going young horse, a little green. And he certainly would have jumped like this pony.... Who I think is a very sweet little thing BTW!

Not saying I agree with hammering young horses... Far from it. But extremely difficult to judge the situation on the title of one YouTube video!
 
Moomin1 said:
Free jumping is hardly the same as having a rider on. Whilst the rider on board isn't over heavy for the pony IMO, she's not lightweight either. Secondly, some of those jumps are hardly little...or they certainly aren't what I would class as small for a newly broken pony anyway.

I am quite perplexed as to how people can think doing the jumps in the vid would be 'easy' for a newly broken pony with a rider on board.
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exactly. even if this pony had done tonnes and tonnes of groundwork/long reining/lunging/free jumping, nothing can prepare a pony's muscles for having a rider on board, no matter if its a 4yo or 7yo..

I really dont get how people are defending this video saying its okay... I was horrified when I saw it, they're not small jumps either.

the title is "first time xc only broken 5 days".. i dont get how that is not clear? the pony has been broken 5 days... had a rider on its back for the first time 5 days ago.
 
We all know who this is...but, for what it's worth, she only takes them round XC for the purposes of the video for sale. As the MO is to buy 'unusual' coloureds (heavily into spotties these days) that didn't make it through the sales on the Emerald Isle, no doubt the pony has been hunting. Ironically, one of her many guises, to be found on face ache, is 'horses described with integrity' (or words to that effect). I think I've seen pics of that pony on there and it probably has gone by now.

ETA... just be careful saying things here or anywhere - there have been some very big hoohaas that have resulted.
 
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joycec said:
How would you count five days after being broken though? When is a horse 'broken', to start counting from if you don't count from when it is sat on? I don't think people were unfair to assume that it meant from being sat on, and your comment is a bit harsh.

I don't think it's true, but that's beside the point.
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I don't know and that is just the point. We don't know. It certainly doesn't look.like a pony that has been.sat on for 5 days. When I used to back and break, it was just that. If people asked what stage a horse was at, I would say it was just backed, in training or just broken, the latter meaning walk, trot, canter and popping a small jump. But that's just me.

Nowhere have I said I would do the same as in this video and I don't think I have been harsh. The posters who have said things like the rider is far to big and bouncing on his back are being harsh...and rude. Too many assumptions have been made and judgement poured out based on those assumptions.

Would I jump a young horse like this? No...but I've been on here a while now and most know me well enough to know that I am against any kind of pressure/force/overfacing a horse. The fact is, I don't think it's great but I certainly don't think it has warranted some of the comments.
 
I don't believe he has only be backed 6 mm5 days.

While far from balanced.
He doesn't seem green "enough"

He much be a horse broken older than normal and it it very wrong to rush any inexperienced horse like that.

Just all wrong :-(
 
smellsofhorse said:
I don't believe he has only be backed 6 mm5 days.

While far from balanced.
He doesn't seem green "enough"

He much be a horse broken older than normal and it it very wrong to rush any inexperienced horse like that.

Just all wrong :-(
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Yes, it is wrong. I guess I personally would just like to see a little perspective here as some really odd things have been said.

I don't agree with working a recently backed horse like this, BUT, I can't get too high up on my horse about it because it is work that is creating a quality pony that has a fantastic chance of getting good homes for the rest of its life. I would much rather that approach than novices buying cheap ponies from the sales, faffing around and confusing them, taking things slowly slowly without knowing how to assess the horse properly and ending up with something unruly/potentially dangerously spoilt as that is the kind of horse that people like myself and Moomin1 have had so many dealing with at the other end of the scale after years of never being good enough to get the good homes, so being passed on from one questionable home to another....and that's if they're lucky.

All I have said in a previous post is that I disagree with people jumping to conclusions and judging the rider based on those possibly erroneous assumptions, but I have been called rude?

Perhaps I am. Or, perhaps my eyes have been opened to a degree that whilst I would never do or advise anyone else do this and it is not my choice of sales prep, it does vastly increase the chances of these ponies getting really nice homes, where they will be properly brought on. In short, I would rather a horse do a little too much for a few days to get some videos that will secure it a great home, than be messed about with and end up back at the sales with the kind of future that none of us want for any horse.
 
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