Flash nosebands – why do you use one?

[Jingleballs]

I know a lot of people use a flash and that every reason and every horse is different. I’m interested in finding out, for those of you that ride in a flash, why do you use it?

I’ve used them occasionally in the past – generally this was on the advice of instructors who said I needed it to have a bit more control as I have a strong cob who will pull your arms out of their sockets if you let him – I’m so used to him that I barely notice but my RI has ridden him and says that she really struggles as he likes to pull you forward too.

I’ve not used a flash for years – I don’t feel he likes it but whether this is due to a discomfort issue or he dislikes the fact that I do have more control I don’t know.

I’ve recently started using a new trainer who often likes to have a sit on him to see how he’s feeling at the start of a lesson which I find really useful. She is pretty adamant that he needs to be ridden in a flash – just for a little while until he learns to stop opening his mouth/trying to get his tongue over the bit and rushing off. I’m not quite so sure and have yet to be convinced as I think he’ll be less likely to relax if he feels his mouth is being forced shut but I understand the point that if he won’t listen to my seat aids and subsequently my half halts – which sometimes need to be quite strong to get him to listen, then I need to find some way to have a bit more control.

I have recently changed his bit from a loose ring revolver to a tongue saver French link hanging cheek and he is definitely happier in it but still has his moments of “I’m going to ****** off and ignore you” – this is a particular issue with lateral movement which he finds a bit harder and often chooses to interpret the lateral aids as “let’s go faster”.

I’m planning on hiring a micklem bridle to see if that helps – RI doesn’t think it will but I’m more hopeful. I was also wondering about perhaps the action of a drop nose band as a compromise. RI has also suggested riding him a couple of times in a double which I'm also a bit unsure about.

I absolutely know that schooling is the main answer here and he needs to learn to balance so we are doing all the usual – lots and lots and lots of transitions including those within the gait. Lots of lateral work, working on poll flexion and bend. I also sometimes use the arena fence for our canter/trot to halt transitions just to show him that he can do what I’m asking of him (he's safe enough that I don't think he'll ever try to jump the fence).

His teeth/back/saddle etc are all up to date and absolutely fine – RI says she thinks it’s just his cheeky cob “I’m bigger and stronger than you” nature that is causing this behavior and I need to get tougher with him!

So is a flash the answer? Or have others had success with similar issues using a drop or micklem bridle?

 

[HaffiesRock]

I use a flash on my Haflinger (only very recently tried one) as he opens his mouth and evades me. It's not on tight at all but it has really helped and he is much easier to ride now. My instructor thinks it is a comfort thing for my pony as he could so easily continue the mouth opening as it is so loose.

I will hopefully wean him out of it in the very near future.

 

[Pinkvboots]

I think if a horse is opening its mouth and putting the tongue over the bit it is not comfortable mainly as there may not be enough room because of a large tongue or the bit may be hitting the roof of the mouth, so why would you want to clamp there mouth shut that would make it even more uncomfortable, some cobs have very large tongues and very fleshy mouths so not much room in there for bits I find a straight bar or something with a port like a cambridge snaffle, or even a myler snaffle can help this, I also think using a slightly thinner bit can help too, or even just lowering the bit down I see so many horses being ridden with the bit too high in the mouth.

 

[LittleRooketRider]

the flash would prevent him from opening his mouth to evade the bit=more control....it shouldn't cause too much discomfort as after all its just keeping the mouth shut which they do naturally anyway when they are behaving.....plus it is safer to have a horse that is in control than one out of control because their rider thinks they might dislike being put in their place.

 

[Pinkvboots]

But why would the horse be evading the bit? Most horses in my view evade the bit because of discomfort they dont just think oh hey I am going to evade the bit, so clamping the mouth shut is just ignoring the root cause of the problem.

 

[soulfull]

I don't. Don't like or need them

 

[3OldPonies]

Because I have a crafty pony who is quite capable of getting his tongue over the bit or opening his mouth wide at just the wrong moment if I don't use a flash.

And no, he's not in pain or anything like that, he just has a very wilful streak that occasionally decides that he will go where he wants and not where I want. He's of the age where all the tricks for avoiding being ridden have been learnt!

 

[StoptheCavalry]

I have gone back to using a flash for the time being on my boy. He fidgets with his mouth and while I found I could happily hack him out without the flash he pulls his angry face (yes he has one of those) and pulls constantly. When the flash is on he seems to be much more settled not just in his mouth but everything seems more relaxed. Plus I feel like I am just a passenger without the flash if anything were to happen I don't have confidence I could stop him from going. I found myself having to use a stronger bit to keep him under control whereas with the flash he happily goes in a snaffle

 

[jinglejoys]

Before I gave up driving the first time Blue used to avoid the bit put her tongue over etc etc .I got lots of "advice" from the "experts" until her mouth was virtually tied shut and I decided that if this was going to be her life of tack feeeeerrget it!!!!!!!!!!!
10yrs later I'd learnt that not all "experts" are expert, got different tack, called her in from the field and got a different animal.
Not quite sure why people use them they were never heard of when I was a kid so what has changed with the "modern" horse/pony that it "needs" them (or is the way we ride the problem nowadays?)

 

[jennyf]

I've never used one, don't like to see them, but that's my opinion and not all would agree.

If the horse is opening his mouth, crossing his jaw, evading the bit etc., then the horse is not happy with what he's got in his mouth surely, and this should be investigated before tying the mouth shut. Flash nosebands are a prevention, not a cure. But if it's a safety issue temporary use might be OK, but I would still investigate further. They just look awful on a bridle, there again, just my opinion.

The shape of the mouth and the 'fleshiness' of the tongue should be taken into consideration when buying a bit.

I don't like jointed bits, my preference is ported Pelham (NeueShule) for big tongues or PeeWee for one who leans.

 

[tonitot]

I put one on my girl for our lesson today as whenever I ask her to slow down or go down a pace she opens her mouth, sticks her nose out, leans on my hands and just ignores me. Shes had her teeth checked so no problems there, its just something I've always let her get away with and now I want to go out and do some dressage/sj/eventing she needs to stop it We started the lesson without it and put it on about half way through and the difference was amazing! I have her noseband a bit loose as when it's done up tight she seems to protest by clamping her mouth shut herself and goes completely dead on me so I put the flash on loose too and it stopped her opening her mouth as much as she normally does.

 

[blitznbobs]

I use one. He goes better in it. Simple as that really.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Because it looks nice.......


I joke, but I do think this is a reason many ride in them, that and the fact that most bridles seem to come with them when purchased.

I do ride in one when im cantering or going out on a long ride alone as it means the difference between control and less control! - other than that I remove it. Its the bridle my horse came with.

 

[noblesteed]

Mine wears one for jumping, hunting or xc, or if he's being difficult in the school or hasn't hacked out on his own for a while. He has the ability to spook&spin, or attempt to take off and throw a buck. It's only occasionally and it's his idea of a good laugh... So if I feel there is a risk of that happening he has his flash on! Better to have more control in these cases. He can lean and poke his tongue before he tries to shoot off. He's in a loose ring french link but I am looking at a similar NS bit for him to encourage him to lean less.

 

[Shantara]

I used to ride with one simply because the horses had them and they weren't mine to mess with.

Ned mostly goes no noseband now though
I did make him go in one for a hunt I went on as I was told many horror stories about him! If I ever went hunting again (doubtful) I would not used one.

 

[sjp1]

I did for a while as instructed by RI, but he hated it, and so I stopped. Changed his bit and he is better, but not cured of opening his mouth.

This I put down to my bad riding. I bought him a Neue Schule Verbindend - better clearance for large tongue and low palate - changed out of the Happy Mouth snaffle which was VERY thick and no good for his mouth conformation.

I think more lessons and better seat control and mouth opening should cease.

 

[khalswitz]

I use a flash to stabilise the bit in the horse's mouth. For horses that tend to get heavy on the contact, but dislike the instability of a loose ring, the flash is great for stabilising the loose ring and simultaneously maintaining the effect of the cheekpiece in not allowing a horse to lean. Also useful for loose ring bits like Balding gags when jumping for the same reason. Be careful with a flash and a single joint bit though, as it exacerbates the nutcracker effect and can cause upset ponies!

For open mouths, lunging in a lunge cavesson is the best cure. A lunge cavesson soon stops the mouth opening, and also shows you where you are making the horse uncomfortable enough to be opening its mouth... and if a horse is *really* crossing its jaw and taking the p when jumping etc, then a grackle is a much nicer way of regaining control than over-tightening a flash to do so.

 

[spotty_pony]

I think if a horse is opening its mouth and putting the tongue over the bit it is not comfortable mainly as there may not be enough room because of a large tongue or the bit may be hitting the roof of the mouth, so why would you want to clamp there mouth shut that would make it even more uncomfortable, some cobs have very large tongues and very fleshy mouths so not much room in there for bits I find a straight bar or something with a port like a cambridge snaffle, or even a myler snaffle can help this, I also think using a slightly thinner bit can help too, or even just lowering the bit down I see so many horses being ridden with the bit too high in the mouth.

This! My ISH has a very large tongue and can be strong at times. I tried him in a flash and he hated it - understandably as it was causing the bit to press against his tongue and causing him discomfort. I then changed him to a 14mm NS Universal Gag and the immediate difference was amazing! He was much more relaxed straight away and although he opens his mouth still, I would much rather he did this then be uncomfortable because I had tied his mouth shut!

 

[dreamchaser]

I have never had the need to use 1 before but am contemplating it with my present horse. She too has an awful habit of opening her mouth to evade.

Have heard many reasons for their use including that they assist with their breathing. I havent read anything to support this, and fastened overly tight as many people do cant see how that theory works if the nostrils are restriced

 

[wench]

As long as its positioned correctly and not yanked tight should be ok.

I've used one on various occasions for different things. They are very useful for stopping a nose net from flapping around in the wind

 

[Kokopelli]

I really hate the way flashes work and wish people would look for other alternatives before jumping at using one.

First port of call would be teeth, then check the comfort with the bit in, then schooling issues ( I personally think every horse can be stopped from opening their mouth as it is often down to lack of schooling. If you do all this and still feel you need a flash I would personally try a drop nose and or a Mexican grackle first. They make everything much more comfortable for the horse.

 

[Quadro]

If you want to try a grackle which might be a better option i have a cob and a full size you can try!
I use grackle on the "big" horses as both are strong into fences and cross their jaws to run through the bit to get to the fences.
Q

 

[budley95]

I use a flash as it didn't matter what bit I tried, bud would take the bit between his teeth and bomb off and then bronc. He put me in hospital 5 times in the 2 weeks I had him on trial. Not entirely sure why I brought him? Putting him in a cherry roller with a flash works for him. I always only rode in a cavasson or didn't have a noseband on at all before. It's what works for each horse. I've tried a Dr cook for 6 months when he bit through his tongue, He listened in it, but didn't seem happy. He likes a contact for reassurance. He gets quite nervous on a long rein as well. I'll go with what keeps him happy and enjoying his work

 

[shannonandtay]

Whenever a thread comes up about flash nose bands it's always mentioned that a drop nose band or a grackle is a better option if needed. Can someone tell me the reason for this, sorry just would like to know why theyre considered a better alternative.

 

[Grumpy Jewel]

I used to use a flash on mine, but a drop was suggested by a friend who then lent me one to try. I felt obliged to try her historic 80's noseband and found she went brilliantly in it. In a flash there was never any obvious resistance, or I would have done something about it, but there was less fiddling about in transitions and she felt more relaxed. Convinced it was a fluke, I tried it again and found the same, tried it while jumping too and will not use anything else now. Different physiology of the horse affects how comfortable the horse finds things and in return, how we'll the horse goes in each item of tack.

 

[Lyle]

I use a flash purely because when fitted correctly it can help keep the bit still in the mouth. It supports the bit in the mouth and can reduce vibration and movement.

I can fit quite a few fingers under mine, my horse can still open his mouth and chew if he needs to as well.

 

[khalswitz]

Whenever a thread comes up about flash nose bands it's always mentioned that a drop nose band or a grackle is a better option if needed. Can someone tell me the reason for this, sorry just would like to know why theyre considered a better alternative.

They are a better alternative for a horse that opens its mouth - as previously said there are many more uses for a flash than that. A grackle is kinder and more effective as it doesn't cross the sensitive cartilaginous area of the nose as a flash does (you have to be careful of flash positioning because of this), and instead crosses higher up the jaw to more effectively stop jaw crossing and opening. When people use a flash to stop jaw opening, in order to do the flash tight enough for this purpose, you put pressure on the cavesson and pull it out of place too, effectively creating an unbalanced, too-low down the face grackle in terms of the physics.

Drops seem to have come back into fashion - I personally don't like them as I've found over time the leather rots and stitching goes because of where it sits on the face - and whilst that happens with old flashes as well, it's easier to replace a flash strap than a whole noseband. Plus you see SO MANY mis-fitted drops and I think that's more dangerous than a flash.

But that's my personal opinion.

 

[moana]

I don't - I don't use any noseband.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I used on for dressage as a grackle was legal. I dont like them though, I prefer grackles as they dont force the cheeks onto the teeth therefore causing more pain.

My oldie has no noseband on at home for hacking now but for schooling he has a grackle done up loosely, my mare only evades when schooling, the rest of the time she is fine, she does have a grackle on for XC as can take a cheeky pull and go out the side occasionally, using an open mouth to do so

If it works for the horse then fair enough, some people like the multibridles, having seen them in action I think they can be a useful piece of kit for some horses, I personally wouldnt spend the money on one unless it was guaranteed to fix the issues.

 

[Iberian girl]

V interested in this thread. Rode my new horse without the flash his previous owner said was necessary for the first time this week as he has a sore nose and he went much better - more submissive and relaxed. And another owner in our yard had exactly the same experience with her new horse last week. I don't really understand why but I won't be putting his flash back on in a hurry.