Flash or grackle?!?

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Greys

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I've got a young horse who I wanted to keep things simple with so I've used so far a plain noseband. I've hunted him resently and would of appreciated more breaks, people have said to add a flash.

Bit wise I use a snaffle with three rings, riding mostly one the middle ring, effectively a drop snaffle and hunting/canter work I go down to the lower ring.

After googling flashes seem to help with closing the mouth although a lot of people seem confused with their popularity as they were developed to give a drop/grackle effect whilst allowing you to use a standing martingale. Also people don't like their use as they say they are easily fitted badly restricting airways?

After reading post on grackles it seems that the main reason for use is if your horse crosses his jaw or avaids the bit? From the reviews I've read those who use a grackle are amazed with amount of control they now have instead of resorting to stronger bit. Does it give more control as your horse can no longer avoid the bit? Possibly obvious question!

Anyway sorry for a small essay! Any advice ideas would be much appreciated!
 
I would go for a Mexican grackle - It is far more stable and not prone to dropping so low that pressure is placed over the bottom of the nasal cartilage, restricting the nostrils. Also agree with Goldenstar

I find them more effective too.
 
Just googled it can be called 2 ring gag. Sorry for any confusion I meant the middle of three rings including the top one on a 2 ring gag! Anyway I'm more interested in nosebands!
 
On nosebands and hunting I avoid shutting the horses mouth for hunting if I can .
Hunting is a long day to have your mouth clamped shut .
For example on Monday J was tacked up ready to leave at quarter to ten and returned hacked back to the yard at five fifteen that's too long to have your mouth tied shut unless its essential .
If a horse is young and becoming unruly I would rather remove from the action for half an hour to learn its manners than tie its mouth shut .
 
Greys said:
Just googled it can be called 2 ring gag. Sorry for any confusion I meant the middle of three rings including the top one on a 2 ring gag! Anyway I'm more interested in nosebands!
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Ah so when you use it on the middle ring it acts like a hanging cheek snaffle. Noseband-wise, I always avoid flashes. I always try to use just a plain noseband. However, so long as you are sure your horse is 100% comfortable with his bit then I would use either a drop noseband or a grackle, not a flash. BUT never with a single joint bit that is not shaped to avoid the joint contacting with the roof of the mouth. Closing the mouth with such a bit amounts to a torture device. Make sure it's a French link, lozenge bit or a single jointed that has been shaped to avoid contact with the roof of the mouth such as the NS demi anky.
 
Wagtail said:
Ah so when you use it on the middle ring it acts like a hanging cheek snaffle. Noseband-wise, I always avoid flashes. I always try to use just a plain noseband. However, so long as you are sure your horse is 100% comfortable with his bit then I would use either a drop noseband or a grackle, not a flash. BUT never with a single joint bit that is not shaped to avoid the joint contacting with the roof of the mouth. Closing the mouth with such a bit amounts to a torture device. Make sure it's a French link, lozenge bit or a single jointed that has been shaped to avoid contact with the roof of the mouth such as the NS demi anky.
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Bit of a thread hijack question here, but this has just prompted me to think of my own mare... Thank you for pointing this out, bit of a dumb question, but the myler level 1 comfort snaffle should avoid the above mentioned 'torture', yes? I'm fairly sure it should, given its got a wide barrel in the middle, but I just wanted to check! I use a flash or grackle and this has never occurred to me...
 
emmad96 said:
Bit of a thread hijack question here, but this has just prompted me to think of my own mare... Thank you for pointing this out, bit of a dumb question, but the myler level 1 comfort snaffle should avoid the above mentioned 'torture', yes? I'm fairly sure it should, given its got a wide barrel in the middle, but I just wanted to check! I use a flash or grackle and this has never occurred to me...
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Yes, that would be fine. The Myler bits don't have a problem with digging into the roof of the mouth.
 
Disagree Wagtail, as a long time user of only a single jointed bit and a drop I have never had a problem and all the ponies and horses I've brought on in a Fulmer and drop have all progressed to a single jointed eggbutt snaffle and cavesson. The joint only digs into the roof of the mouth when the horse is led by the reins and the reins used sharply.

A drop should only ever be used with a cheeked bit.
 
I remember a vet showing me, over twenty years ago, the bruising on several horse's roofs of mouth due to single jointed bits used in combination with tight nosebands of various types. One horse had a deep ulcer from the bit. I have never used one since.

In an ideal world, I'd avoid bits all together because I am not 100% comfortable that it is kind to use them. This video is very thought provoking:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0a-aV0Rsxmg
 
If you have neither trial a grackle. If you have a spare flash strap pop it in your pocket next time you go out so you can just put it on to a trial!
 
I use a flash for more control, my pony is still strong but it definitely helps and she seems more comfortable in it than without it, as it keeps the bit in place much better. I've seen bad things about them but I make sure it's never too tight and I've never had a problem.
 
Wagtail said:
I remember a vet showing me, over twenty years ago, the bruising on several horse's roofs of mouth due to single jointed bits used in combination with tight nosebands of various types. One horse had a deep ulcer from the bit. I have never used one since.

In an ideal world, I'd avoid bits all together because I am not 100% comfortable that it is kind to use them. This video is very thought provoking:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0a-aV0Rsxmg
Click to expand...

I've also seen many horses with fussy mouths in a double jointed, with bruising on the bars. They two lower jaw bones where the bit sits is only about 1" apart and the joints from the double jointed bit bash the bars with every movement.
 
I hate riding horses that have had their mouths strapped shut with either flashes or grackles. They become reliant on them and lean on the bit. Or maybe that's just the ones I have to ride every so often and not everyone elses in the normal world.
 
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