Foal Registration update

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MillionDollar

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As some of you know i've had problems finding a society that i can register my foals with (not born yet, out of NF mares by Goshka Ringo). I could easily register with Wetherbys but it would cost me between £400-£500
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So i tried CHAPS but no they they would have to have parentage stated as unknown on the passport because Ringo isn't registered with them. So i tried BSPA who have told me that the parentage will be stated on the passport, thats good enough for me
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I just have to have it clarrified with the secretary tomorrow.

I still think Goshka should get Ringo registered with CHAPS or BSPA, it would make it a lot easier for mare owners though.
 
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I still think Goshka should get Ringo registered with CHAPS or BSPA, it would make it a lot easier for mare owners though.

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I quite agree with you; well, I wrote it last time too didn't I?!

Although it's good that he's gone through the very rigorous vetting to be accepted onto the NTR, so many of his mares are either hunter types with no particular breeding or ponies and to have him only eligible for expensive NTR papers is very unfair I think on top of expensive stud and keep charges. I say nothing about the competition type horses as they do need excellent paperwork that will be accepted anywhere but for others I think it's way over the top.
Perhaps if you explain the trouble you have had to the stud they might consider changing things, you never know. After all, if his name isn't on a passport, he's not going to be credited with the success of his youngstock is he and surely that's half of his marketing done for them.

I hope BSPA do accept them for sure, it'll be one in the eye for CHAPS. They seem to rake in the money but don't want to help in situations like this, GR's pedigree is verified for goodness sake, they have no reason at all to refuse to credit him on a passport, he's coloured isn't he? They deserve to lose your custom IMO.
 
Yep you did say it, and i completely agree.

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Although it's good that he's gone through the very rigorous vetting to be accepted onto the NTR, so many of his mares are either hunter types with no particular breeding or ponies and to have him only eligible for expensive NTR papers is very unfair I think on top of expensive stud and keep charges

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Totally agree and he's getting more and more non-WBs put to him, they should definitely get him in with BSPA, they've got one of their other stallions, Festivo, with BSPA! Anyway hopefully it will be sorted. I just can't get over how stupid it is, Ringo has verified breeding so do my mares. Typical of the UK equine industry?!
 
Love Ringo, cant wait to see your little foal! make sure you have the camera ready and waiting! Thinking of putting our mare back in foal next year either to uptons deli circus or Ringo, did you go and see him?
 
Thank you, i will have camera ready and waiting.
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Yes i saw Ringo several times as my mares went to the stud. He is so much nicer in the flesh. Pictures do not do him justice and he has the best temperament a stallion could have! Their children even ride him!
 
Hi there Claire im a bit confussed about your post ? did you not ask about what papers your foals could get before using the stallion ? I believe you can get KWPN B papers ?
CHAPS UK will not register Ringo because he is not graded with them, why should people go to the expence of grading there stallions with a society if they will hand out verified breeding papers to anything ?
It states in the CHAPS UK handbook and grading guidelines and rules {these guidelines come from DEFRA} that any youngstock that is not by a graded sire is only entitled identifiaction documents{ CHAPS studbook 5} because the sire is not graded with them, then there is no DNA sample taken and held at animal health trust to cross reference. NTR documentation is not recognised, as NTR is not Defra approved.
It seems that lots of stallions now are advertising as papers available from X when really all they can get is ID documents, in all societys to have top stud book papers with verified breeding the sire has to be graded with them.
feel free to shoot me down.
 
I think I will have to go and see him! are both your mares in foal to him?

Getting my mare and foal tested to see if they are homozygous as they both have spots, I believe Ringo is?? looking forward to seeing your coloured babies!
 
I agree with special design that CHAPS shouldn't have to register Ringo foals with pedigree verified, as he isn't registered or graded with them.

However, KWPN B papers are available from him with an appropriate mare, or could you not register the foals as PB NF?

The BSPA are everso helpful though!
 
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, then there is no DNA sample taken and held at animal health trust to cross reference. NTR documentation is not recognised, as NTR is not Defra approved.


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DEFRA are an absolute joke regarding most things but particularly not recognising the NTR when they have to go through a rigorous testing, blood typing and possibly DNA testing too (not sure about that bit yet) before they will be accepted. The majority on the NTR do have verified breeding, definitely on one side of the pedigree at least but CHAPS in their wisdom, can grade something that has come straight off an English moor, an Irish bog, Welsh hill or Scottish mountain (just so nobody feels left out!
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) with no breeding known whatsoever as long as it is coloured; where is the logic in that when you don't even know what's behind some of those horses and what lines they come from? I'd rather trust a Weatherbys passport than a CHAPS one any day.
 
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I'd rather trust a Weatherbys passport than a CHAPS one any day.

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*CLAPS REALLY LOUDLY* Here, here!!!!!
 
Claire, just had a thought - could you not get your mares graded with the Sports Pony Society (may have the title wrong there, but you'll know what I mean & if not ask Pat!) If your mare(s) are graded, then you can register any progeny with that governing body - it's partly why I graded B!
 
MFH_09 Have you any dealings with the CHAPS grading ? if you call the grading officer he will help you to understand the procedure. No animals will able to grade by 2010 without a pedigree, native pony or not, no sporthorse can grade without a pedigree from now, seen as everything has to have a passport there is no reason for parentage not to be registered, I would personally have a studbook 1 passport from CHAPS than an NTR passport as i know the stallion it was by was graded and the pedigree was verified, but then we all have different tastes as to what we want.
 
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MFH_09 Have you any dealings with the CHAPS grading ? if you call the grading officer he will help you to understand the procedure. No animals will able to grade by 2010 without a pedigree, native pony or not, no sporthorse can grade without a pedigree from now, seen as everything has to have a passport there is no reason for parentage not to be registered, I would personally have a studbook 1 passport from CHAPS than an NTR passport as i know the stallion it was by was graded and the pedigree was verified, but then we all have different tastes as to what we want.

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Not personally, no, only from hearsay from people who have been through it, but that wasn't my point and you are talking about in the future, not what has gone on before.
The fact of compulsory passports has been - and still is to a point - that many horses who now have one are of unknown breeding, whereas proper passports of before were only for horses whose breeding could be verified by certificates, blood typing and recently DNA. The fact now, that a horse might have a passport is no guarantee of its' breeding unless it can be guaranteed by the aforementioned methods, to come from registered stock.
Up to relatively recently, as you say yourself, there has not been any restriction on what has been graded with CHAPS but it will now in the future. So something with no known recognised breeding behind it could easily have been graded on his conformation, ability and colour alone not knowing where or what it comes from, whether it actually could be a freak of nature, with no guarantee that it will produce similar to itself or as a throwback to further back generations.
Why are they waiting so long, another 3 years away, to insist that breeding has to be known for several generations before it's eligible for grading, that doesn't make sense to me at all and several other people too I should imagine? How many 'unknown' mares will have been to those 'unknown breeding' stallions thus perpetuating the unknown lines? It's a little like shutting the door after the horse has bolted, don't you think? That is what I have had against the 'unknown' gradings, not against those with verified breeding, but hopefully, in the future, this should be improved. What I can't make out is that CHAPS has been going for some years now, just why has it taken them so long to fall into line with other registration societies re pedigrees unless it is/has been just to make hay while the sun shines and coloureds are so popular.

As to preferring a CHAPS passport, that is your prerogative of course, but as I would never risk using an 'unknown breeding' stallion anyway, so it doesn't actually apply, but if I had the choice, I would still stick to my NTR or Weatherbys one thank you, at least I know the parents will have been thoroughly tested, blood typed, DNA'd for several generations and so on before being accepted onto the register.
 
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