Foot issue

Birker2020 said:
In view of the fact it's been 6.5 weeks since last trimmed do you think a five week cycle would benefit?
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Yes. Absolutely. Tho you might need to flex if he has periods where he isn't growing much.

Now you have Lari at your yard, could your farrier show you how to lightly maintain his feet between trims?
 
Birker2020 said:
In view of the fact it's been 6.5 weeks since last trimmed do you think a five week cycle would benefit?
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I think a two week cycle to start with until those feet are under control.

Genuinely, it is not that hard to do yourself. I would get the farrier to sell you a proper rasp and show you how to use it.

The walls are so long they are splaying. The frog is down to a crack, with will have infection in as there is no way to clean it.

When you do it yourself, you can have a light rasp around the walls a couple of times a week to start. The frog need attention from the farrier and then you taught how to keep it open so it can be cleaned.
 
His feet are very long. The central sulci should also be much wider and more open than that. As they are currently they are a perfect breeding ground for thrush 😬.

Agree with Red about 2 weekly trimmings by farrier in the short term, plus you being shown by farrier how and with what to keep them tidy in between farrier visits. Be prepared to buy a rasp and a hoof knife.

In the immediate short term, and before the farrier can come out, spray the sulci with blue oxytetracycline antibiotic spray you can get from your vet (it’s a POM) making sure you get it in as deep as you can, and then pack them with Red Horse hoof stuff. Deep seated thrush can cripple a horse.


www.viovet.co.uk

Engemycin 25m/ml cutaneous spray

Buy Engemycin for your cattle, sheep and pigs from viovet.co.uk, FREE DELIVERY available over £29. Great prices and super easy to use to use website, see for yourself now.
www.viovet.co.uk www.viovet.co.uk
 
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Purbee kindly wrote this reply to me on the forum I think it was around 14th March from photos I took then.

It looks like the same situation is occurring as it did last time. I will ask him why this is.

To be fair to the farrier it might be due to change in grass flush, diet, the fact he's not walking around so much, all the keratex I've been putting on his feet to try to make his sole harder.

The vet said he has extremely hard feet anyway so maybe I've exacerbated the issue with thekeratex. Maybe all along it's nothing to do with standing on stones, soft tissue damage or even cushings. Maybe it's simply due to the shape of his growth of feet (or dare I say it) innaffective trims.

Feel like I'm in a spin dryer atm.
 

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I agree with Red that your he would be better off if you can learn to do it yourself than the job that's being done at the moment. It's such a minefield finding someone who really knows how to trim. Is there any chance you can get him walking on some abrasive surfaces, B? That might do more for him than trimming will. You need rid of those bars and that false sole first though.
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Just on rasps and in case this is helpful - standard rasps are just around 14inches long and heavy. I find them very unwieldy. The Diamond rasp is much shorter and I find it easier to use with my weaker wrists (broken both more than once) and as a novice. They are very sharp - do wear gloves!


I tried the radius rasps too. My horse's hooves are like granite in summer and they were useless at removing anything much.
 
I’m shocked it’s only 6 or so weeks since last trim. There’s a lot of wall that needs to come off, the frog needs tidying up and the bars need removing like a few others have said.

Don’t underestimate how crippled a sulcus infection or thrush can make a horse. Was he more comfortable in a pair of fronts?
 
Those feet look like everywhere, but don't panic

And typical of may grass intake when hooves seem to shoot in every direction overnight

Too much wall growth, excess sole, wonky bars


The current dry spell and hard ground is causing chipping on walls at ground level and even with heavy dew hooves are drying out and may benefit from some water

I would try a short trim cycle for at least next trim see if that helps
Any cracks will be liable to infection, if that happens the crack needs to be opened by farrier and the hoof soaked

The false sole could be making it tender to walk on hard ground

If you could get a rasp and look for rough wall at ground level and keep smooth and file out over any fine lines on the surface and squirt with iodine around the wall at ground level or over any suspect areas where vertical lines have shown on the hoof wall from the ground up

I only generally cut off excess frog and leave alone if poss, but clean up may help and clean out thoroughly at night, which I'm sure you do anyway, and I would definitely squirt a good dose of iodene down inside the central sulcus twice week, it really needs to fill up and be more of a surface than a crack.

I would test for cushings

First port of call in a horse of his age, specially foot wise,

Get the walls under control and then walk him out on smooth tarmac

As always great admiration for the effort you put in caring for your horse

Why don't you get a little rasp and hoof knife, I am sure you could do it
 
Birker2020 said:
Where do you get this from? Or do you dissolve yourself as Meleeka has said they do?

The vet offered me powdered paracetamol but knowing how much they charge I declined.

I've got to try and convince the chemist to let me have some hydrogen peroxide. That will be the ext challenge 😬
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You might have to convince the chemist about that quantity of paracetamol! And don’t mention it is for a horse, either - try supermarket or wholesaler, instead. Agri store for the hydrogen peroxide, or dairy bleach, or a foot-rot solution.
If he eats speedibeet (or other wetted feedstuffs) dissolve in the water intended for soaking, subsequently lace with honey, jam, whatever, to disguise taste.
But you really need to prioritise whatever is causing the pain. Good luck.
 
Exasperated said:
You might have to convince the chemist about that quantity of paracetamol! And don’t mention it is for a horse, either - try supermarket or wholesaler, instead. Agri store for the hydrogen peroxide, or dairy bleach, or a foot-rot solution.
If he eats speedibeet (or other wetted feedstuffs) dissolve in the water intended for soaking, subsequently lace with honey, jam, whatever, to disguise taste.
But you really need to prioritise whatever is causing the pain. Good luck.
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He came in this morning perfectly sound, which was nice although realise he's on pain relief. Bright and alert.

He's eaten 13 out of 15 of the paracetamol this morning so not too bad! Just bought some speedibeet and some honey 😁

Going to start tapering off pain medication after farrier has been to trim.
 
IrishMilo said:
I’m shocked it’s only 6 or so weeks since last trim. There’s a lot of wall that needs to come off, the frog needs tidying up and the bars need removing like a few others have said.

Don’t underestimate how crippled a sulcus infection or thrush can make a horse. Was he more comfortable in a pair of fronts?
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Yes he was great with shoes, he's always been a competition horse so didn't go barefoot to my knowledge from the age of 4 to 12 until we started roughing him off for the bloodbank. Then when I couldn't part with him he went to barefoot to retirement instead. Seemed to cope very well without shoes initially but his first winter we had total unprecented weather withconstant rain for 4 months and the ground was sodden. There were five or six of the herd with constant poultices on.

I really don't want to go down that route again if I can help it, as he had to wear two pairs of over reach boots 24/7 as he was prone to pulling them. Also the cost is a huge thing, £100 every five weeks for shoes.

I'm hoping it's an infected sulcus. Been told today hydrogen peroxide is too nasty to use so completely lost.
 
tristars said:
Those feet look like everywhere, but don't panic

And typical of may grass intake when hooves seem to shoot in every direction overnight

Too much wall growth, excess sole, wonky bars


The current dry spell and hard ground is causing chipping on walls at ground level and even with heavy dew hooves are drying out and may benefit from some water

I would try a short trim cycle for at least next trim see if that helps
Any cracks will be liable to infection, if that happens the crack needs to be opened by farrier and the hoof soaked

The false sole could be making it tender to walk on hard ground

If you could get a rasp and look for rough wall at ground level and keep smooth and file out over any fine lines on the surface and squirt with iodine around the wall at ground level or over any suspect areas where vertical lines have shown on the hoof wall from the ground up

I only generally cut off excess frog and leave alone if poss, but clean up may help and clean out thoroughly at night, which I'm sure you do anyway, and I would definitely squirt a good dose of iodene down inside the central sulcus twice week, it really needs to fill up and be more of a surface than a crack.

I would test for cushings

First port of call in a horse of his age, specially foot wise,

Get the walls under control and then walk him out on smooth tarmac

As always great admiration for the effort you put in caring for your horse

Why don't you get a little rasp and hoof knife, I am sure you could do it
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Yes I think I might buy a rasp. Will get my farrier to show me how to use it. X
 
Birker2020 said:
I'm hoping it's an infected sulcus. Been told today hydrogen peroxide is too nasty to use so completely lost.
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What treatment did the vet suggest for the thrush?

My vet recommends and prescribes the Engemycin blue (oxytetracycline) spray that I linked to above. It’s not expensive, maybe £15 a can which lasts ages. It can be be a bit ouchy to apply if the thrush is very deep seated and the central sulcus is very sore, but not normally. You do need to get it in deep.

I find that the Red Horse hoof stuff wadding rammed in well also helps to open up the central sulcus, so it’s doubly useful.

You really do need to hit that thrush hard and urgently.

ETA edited to clarify that the Engemycin blue spray that my vet recommends for thrush contains oxytetracycline.
 
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In the 80’a in Australia we used to pour hydrogen peroxide on cuts to clean them (our own). It is a bit stingy but not bad at all. Terramycin (is that what @Tiddlypom is meaning?) doesn’t sting in cuts.
 
skinnydipper said:
Hydrogen peroxide damages healthy tissue, no longer recommended for cleaning wounds.
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I would agree with you on flesh wounds but I think frogs need something copious and very wet that will soak into all the tiny crevices and tunnels that thrush creates, in order to kill it all so it can't just brew up again. The blood supply is quite a long way under the surface of the frog so the tissue being treated is mostly dead anyway. You're not trying to get a surface wound to heal, you're trying to kill off the thrush so the live tissue deeper in the frog can harden and become a leathery surface.
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Very dilute hibiscrub is good but it, too, can be dehydrating and harsh to the point of killing of healthy tissue if used too strong (it should look like water).
Personally, i use hydrogen peroxide in small amounts to dip corals so wouldn't have any qualms about using it on a hoof, especially one with persistent/reoccurring thrush to really show the causative bacteria the door.
 
Exasperated said:
Yes, but this isn’t a wound, it’s a necrotising infection.
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I'm just sharing what I know about hydrogen peroxide and wound care.

I know next to nothing about horses and the little I do know I've gleaned from reading posts on here. So now I know that hydrogen peroxide is okay to use to kill thrush in hooves :)
 
Birker2020 said:
He came in this morning perfectly sound, which was nice although realise he's on pain relief. Bright and alert.

He's eaten 13 out of 15 of the paracetamol this morning so not too bad! Just bought some speedibeet and some honey 😁

Going to start tapering off pain medication after farrier has been to trim.
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That’s good going, many wouldn’t touch tablets without a saturated disguise.
People also have success applying manuka honey for thrush, never tried it and m.honey isn’t cheap, but might be less chemicals for you to mess with.
 
ycbm said:
I would agree with you on flesh wounds but I think frogs need something copious and very wet that will soak into all the tiny crevices and tunnels that thrush creates, in order to kill it all so it can't just brew up again. The blood supply is quite a long way under the surface of the frog so the tissue being treated is mostly dead anyway. You're not trying to get a surface wound to heal, you're trying to kill off the thrush so the live tissue deeper in the frog can harden and become a leathery surface.
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I agree. Thrush has to be zapped hard and fast and deep. If Lari is to be trimmed this week then that is presumably going to put the frog and C/S closer to the ground.

I have used peroxide however I find copper sulphate to be the most effective and quickest of all. A soak and then another 3/4 days later. You are not using it forever.



Exasperated said:
People also have success applying manuka honey for thrush, never tried it and m.honey isn’t cheap, but might be less chemicals for you to mess with.
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I have tried manuka (I have tried lots of things :D) it is OK but messy and there is the problem if getting in and keeping it in when it gets runny. Plus good manuka is very expensive.


I have found syringing stuff in to be pretty effective at getting it in the right place. (the tiny syringes that come with loxicam or something similar you can poke in)

I have also found mixing ground up copper sulphate with sudocream and syringing that in can work. Also tea tree oil can by syringed in.

Longer term I would attempt to put hoof stuff in changed regularly

ester said:
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I'd be flossing that central sulcus
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this is the most important though. Either floss with a torn up piece of sheeting or possibly a cotton bud if you can get one in to get right down to the bottom. How much that will be possible ATM I don't know.

I experimented with a horse many years ago, no treatments for thrush but I thoroughly cleaned it twice a day. That alone made a lot of difference.
 
paddy555 said:
I agree. Thrush has to be zapped hard and fast and deep. If Lari is to be trimmed this week then that is presumably going to put the frog and C/S closer to the ground.

I have used peroxide however I find copper sulphate to be the most effective and quickest of all. A soak and then another 3/4 days later. You are not using it forever.




I have tried manuka (I have tried lots of things :D) it is OK but messy and there is the problem if getting in and keeping it in when it gets runny. Plus good manuka is very expensive.


I have found syringing stuff in to be pretty effective at getting it in the right place. (the tiny syringes that come with loxicam or something similar you can poke in)

I have also found mixing ground up copper sulphate with sudocream and syringing that in can work. Also tea tree oil can by syringed in.

Longer term I would attempt to put hoof stuff in changed regularly


this is the most important though. Either floss with a torn up piece of sheeting or possibly a cotton bud if you can get one in to get right down to the bottom. How much that will be possible ATM I don't know.

I experimented with a horse many years ago, no treatments for thrush but I thoroughly cleaned it twice a day. That alone made a lot of difference.
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Some really good options here (a hypochlorite, dairy-bleach girl, myself);
would just add that if fiercely squirting any of the bleach liquids into central sulcus / under manky bits of tissue, worth putting a pair of clear goggles on - splash back isn’t funny. Good luck!
 
skinnydipper said:
I'm just sharing what I know about hydrogen peroxide and wound care.

I know next to nothing about horses and the little I do know I've gleaned from reading posts on here. So now I know that hydrogen peroxide is okay to use to kill thrush in hooves :)
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Well, you weren't wrong as such in suggesting not to use hydrogen peroxide - there is definitely a move away from hydrogen peroxide being the 'go-to' thrush treatment which it used to be.

There are many alternatives available now, so I think hydrogen peroxide, whilst still okay to use, is favoured when other first-line treatments haven't been effective enough, or sometimes by more old-school horse people. (And that's not in any way a criticism of old-school horse people either!)
 
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