forage analysis...does it make a difference?

Mineral balancing can never be exact but I do believe that balancing to forage is the best we have especially if there are problems. I've gone for a high mineral spec average mix and supplementing omegas etc. on top as I can't balance due to inconsistent hay supply. I started a month ago after previously supplementing copper, salt, zinc and magnesium. I don't want the fillers as one of my horses is sensitive to many things and I want good levels and a quality form of copper and zinc especially which are commonly deficient in my area by what local farmers supplement. I also feed extra salt and magnesium.

The sensitive horse has an event line (dip) at the top of her hoof which doesn't seem to be growing out so I suspect it is going to mark better wall connection as the hoof grows down but only time will tell on that one.
 
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For some horses some of the time it makes a huge, massive, incredible difference. Depends on what they are already eating.

If you are blessed to live in a part of the country which has forage which is not really high in (for example) iron, manganese, or calcium then your horse will probably be fine on a high forage diet with a reasonable general purpose supplement or adequate amounts of a suitable concentrate.

But not all of us are so blessed. Where I live the local forage is very high in iron, some of the highest recorded. There are no concentrates or general purpose supplements which are suitable to 'balance' this iron overload.

Another horse I am working with has failed to shed properly for over 14 years. He hasn't lost his coat until August and has then promptly grown his winter coat back in. And he isn't cushings. We tested his hay, found it had toxic levels of selenium, so it has been changed and mineral balanced and hey presto, he started shedding normally in February. His coat colour has deepened by 2 or 3 shades and his feet have never been better.

Feed companies are not all bad, some of them are fabulous actually. But if you know the right questions to ask and can speak to the right people you will quickly learn which ones try really hard to do the right thing and which ones not so much. You will also learn that the better ones are frustrated by EU legislation which because of the law of unintended consequences, actually prevents them from supplying some useful 'off the shelf' products.
 
Trot_On_Dressage said:
Firstly sugar isn't a problem! Horses need sugar and your grass will contain far more sugar than any feed product. The problem lies in starch.
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I have to disagree here I'm afraid as we talked about before. The total of sugars and starch is important and especially to horses prone to laminitis including lower levels of laminitis.
If high sugars weren't a problem why does soaking hay, which can only remove water soluble sugars not starch, help my pony and many many others? It can bring the sugar/starch total content of the hay low enough to reduce symptoms in my understanding and belief. Some hays are just too high in sugars and starch for some horses for soaking to have much of an effect. There is no way to tell the levels of sugars and starch in your hay unless you have it tested...

Yes horses need sugars and starch but they need much lower levels than many get imo. There are so many good doers and fat horses and ponies to illustrate this. Like you say grass (and hay) contain more than enough, so why add more?
 
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Trot_On_Dressage said:
But this makes it so hard for you. You can't in all honesty work out exactly how much vits and mins your horse needs in their hard feed from the amount they get in their hay/grass diet! God, that would be impossible! Tbh it doesn't matter if your hay is lacking, as long as the hard feed diet is their than that's it! Sometimes I think we make it all seem harder than it is!
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TOD this couldn't be further from the truth! if you have a forrage analysis done and a diet plan writen by forage plus (for example) you'll understand why.

I was actually talking to a friend of mine who works for one of the big fibre feed companies who was holding a clinic at our yard last week... he was very interested as to why I was no longer feeding alfa-alfa products and asked me what I was feeding instead... when I told him, he asked how I'd come to be on that diet, so I explained that I'd had a forage analysis to which he piped up 'we do those' and then a diet plan written ' we do those too!' which involves certain minerals being supplemented in relation to eachother - 'what do you mean???!' So I explained. I'd previously had my boy on high fibre cibes for example but because they are high in calcium and the calcium phospherous ratio in our hay is way out, they were making things worse... he's been put on bran to help with that now. After a lengthly chat he took down the details of forage plus to look into it some more.

So from the above what I'm trying to explain is that while commercial supplements / balancers provide a 'healthy balance' of vitamins and minerals they are only 'balanced' to themselves / zero so unless you are only going to feed your horse that one product and NOTHING else (which no person in their right mind would ever do!), he is not recieving a balanced diet. therefore if for eg. the calcium phospherous ratio is out in horse's main fibre source, you're only going to add to that by supplementing calcium and phosperous through the use of a commercial 'balancer' which makes a bit of a joke of the term 'balancer'...

OP... in answer to your question, evidently it does make a difference... my boy is just about to start on his diet plan so I'll keep you posted!
 
Wow! I go away for 24 hours and come back to Feed Buckets at dawn! lol!

Going back to my original questions..."Forage analysis...does it make a difference?"

It seems that those who have done it and adjusted the diets accordingly the answer is yes, and it is worth doing.

I do have a pretty quirky (behaviour) horse and subtle changes in his current diet definitely impact him noticably, so I will definitely respond to the forage analysis and see how things go/ improve.

As an aside he is barefoot, eats mainly grass and soaked hay, plus 500g of Speedibeet, micronised linseed, cal mag, pink powder and charcoal as his hard feed. I do not feed any commercial mixes or cubes as he is sugar/starch sensitive and a VERY good do-er.
 
Sorry, not trying to hijack your post op but I was just wondering if I could ask.....
When you go about getting your forage analysed do you have to do it at a certain time of year as the nutrients in the grass vary throughout the year or do you do several tests throughout the year?
My usually calm sensible mare has become spooky, jumpy and has a lot of energy at the moment, she is out 24/7 on grass and also has hay from our field that was made last year (the field next to the one she is kept in) I was wondering if it may be deficient in something that could be causing this behaviour?
She also has a small feed of fast fibre in the mornings.
 
Have to say i'm another who wouldn't be looking to the feed companies for advice. My local feed merchant however is another matter, he's pretty clued up on local forage & has always been spot on with any feed, balancers or supplements as he isn't paid to promote one brand. If I fed my horse a quarter of what the feed companies recommend I'd have either an obese horse or a dangerous one. They're ok to ring with specific questions but I'd never put my full faith in their advice alone. In an ideal world we'd all have great forage without the need for balancing it. As my horse is in light work, I aim to get as close to this as possible with just a supplement for the missing vits & minerals, rather than large quantities of hard feed to supply them.
 
rose bud said:
Sorry, not trying to hijack your post op but I was just wondering if I could ask.....
When you go about getting your forage analysed do you have to do it at a certain time of year as the nutrients in the grass vary throughout the year or do you do several tests throughout the year?
My usually calm sensible mare has become spooky, jumpy and has a lot of energy at the moment, she is out 24/7 on grass and also has hay from our field that was made last year (the field next to the one she is kept in) I was wondering if it may be deficient in something that could be causing this behaviour?
She also has a small feed of fast fibre in the mornings.
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Sarah at Forage Plus is probably your best person fro advice on this.

I'm sure there is a 'right way to do it' but I just got handfuls from a few bales of haylage in Nov 2010. My YO does his own haylage from fields all over the village...so you might consider that worthless....however it seems to be working with Obi so I'm happy enough with that :p

I keep meaning to do another one just for my own interest....but there's always something else to spend my cash on instead ;)
 
Trot_On_Dressage said:
Firstly sugar isn't a problem! Horses need sugar...
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Yikes, am I the only one who finds that a bit scary coming from someone who advised people about feed as a profession? :eek:

I haven't had a forage analysis yet, but it would be my first port of call if I wasn't happy with my horses' feet or overall health/condition.
 
I believe it's too much sugar (and starch) that can be the problem as I said earlier. This can be an individual tolerance depending on conditions such as IR and Cushings. Keeping sugars/starch low will help prevent obesity and probably IR in some ? many horses.
 
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