Foul mouthed child on hound exercise ride - what to do?

The point is that it was a ten year old child. If I'd have heard it then I'd simply have said something along the lines of 'there's no need for that disgusting language young man'. Would have made no difference at all but at least he would have had one adult attempting to set a decent example. Pony kicked or not, that language was unnecessary.
 
amymay said:
And I expect he was shocked at his pony being kicked! I'd have said a lot worse.
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MiJodsR2BlinkinTite said:
So six of one; half dozen of t'other.

Girl shouldn't have let her pony kick out: boy shouldn't have sworn.
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Agree with the above, no big deal really, yes his language was disgusting but so was the behaviour of the kicking pony, maybe there was a delayed reaction in his comment because he was expecting an apology from the girl and didn't get it in which case she is exactly what he said!
 
And THIS is why I am so disapproving of young children going out hunting unattended! I'm sure some people think I'm grumpy and unfriendly about this, but any child under about 12 or 13 should have an adult with them all the time to look after them and also to educate them about keeping themselves and other people safe. Which means being mounted with them once your child can canter along a field. There are quite a few people who send their children out hunting and seem to think it's ok to be in a car several fields away, and then other people have to rescue the children when something happens, whether it be righting a slipping saddle, checking a kicked pony or picking a crying child off the floor. Children this age don't know the risks, they need to gradually learn what they are and how to behave to avoid them from adults who are with them. Of course people will always help, but if it's a 9 or 10 year old it's not fair on the child or the person who does the helping to be dealing with a crying and possibly hurt child of that age. I think those big "hound exercise" hunt fun rides sound lethal!

As to the swearing - as someone else said, I'd just be grateful it wasn't my child!
 
A bit strange that amymay's quote of the now withdrawn comment from ycbm remains in place, but then the words themselves were clearly implied, so there was no need to reinforce the thoughts! Silly ycbm. There's also the point that it may seem strange to feel that a child needs to be admonished for offensive conduct, and then repeat the very same words on here, a section which is also read by the youthful. Even sillier ycbm! :) Mind you, I'm hardly one to talk, I've had more rockets from Admin about my language than you could shake a stick at! :)

Just as I wouldn't speak to another as the boy reportedly did, and certainly not a girl, so his tirade says more of his parents than him. My son would never have used such language at another child, and publicly. Foul and offensive language most certainly DOES have a place, it's just where and when, and the Hunting field is no place for anyone, children or otherwise, to speak to another in such a fashion.

I shall welcome the return of ycbm and her mostly pertinent and timely posts. Holidays give us the chance to consider how we are! :)

Alec.
 
100 followers out on 'hound exercise' sounds like it could be fairly chaotic. Would this pack be the Cheshire Bloodhounds? Maybe they will have to limit the size of their field, that number is IMHO pretty unwieldy in these parts.

A hundred riders out on a 'fun ride', with riders setting out individually or in small groups over a period of hours, is very different and more manageable.
 
tootsietoo said:
Alec, girls don't get any more offended at swearing than boys do!

……..
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The problem, all so often, is that the timely and acceptable delivery of foul language is rarely understood by children and so they're best discouraged from its use and until they learn when it's acceptable, and when it isn't. It's my view that the occasion referred to by the OP was one of those times when it may have been a little more seemly for the boy to consider his manners.

Whether girls are today more accepting of being sworn at, isn't the point. The point is that with a display of good manners so the boy may have been held in greater respect by those who heard his comment.

Alec.
 
If I had spoken like that on the hunting field my mother would have given me what for! You can express yourself with out f'in and blinding. And if you can't someone who is part of the hunt should step in and have a word.

Alright his pony may have been nearly kicked, but why is that any excuse? It's a risk you take when you go out and if you are concerned at all you remove yourself from the vicinity of other horses. I was hunting un attended from the age of 14 and would never, ever dream of being so disrespectful to anyone in the field or on foot! If you are not properly educated you should not be out, regardless of whether you are 14 or 64!!
 
I doubt the boy would have been held in any greater respect whether he'd sworn or not, judging by ycbm's remarks about his mother. Seems he's already tarred and feathered by that association. I would most likely have used the exact same words as him if some other kid's horse had kicked mine. I doubt his language would have even registered with me in those circumstances.
 
Sorry Alec, it's just a tiny bug bear of mine - I used to sit in meetings where I was the only woman, someone else would swear and then turn to me and apologise! As if I was the only one in the room who would be offended!

I completely agree with you, it's not necessary, and I hate hearing small children swear. Although this makes the husband and me chuckle like mad: https://youtu.be/_RW_fIWuG2c (I can't do links! will work out how and edit)
 
tootsietoo said:
I used to sit in meetings where I was the only woman, someone else would swear and then turn to me and apologise! As if I was the only one in the room who would be offended!
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This happened to me the other day. I was in a group and one chap swore when saying something to another chap, and he turned to me and apologised for his language. As it happened, I wasn't offended as it was all in good humour, but I liked that he did that. However, I admit I've not thought about the fact other men may be offended too!

I absolutely detest hearing children swear. It's even worse if you know they've picked it up from adults who should be caring for them.
 
I'm assuming you're female Spilletta? You see, I used to hate it, because it suggested that I was more sensitive than everyone else in the room and the only reason I could think of for them thinking that was that I was female! It's just another tiny bit of everyday sexism. Anyway, off topic!
 
tootsietoo said:
I'm assuming you're female Spilletta? You see, I used to hate it, because it suggested that I was more sensitive than everyone else in the room and the only reason I could think of for them thinking that was that I was female! It's just another tiny bit of everyday sexism. Anyway, off topic!
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Yes, I am female. I've never thought of it like that, but I see your point.
 
tootsietoo said:
I'm assuming you're female Spilletta? You see, I used to hate it, because it suggested that I was more sensitive than everyone else in the room and the only reason I could think of for them thinking that was that I was female! It's just another tiny bit of everyday sexism. Anyway, off topic!
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I wonder if it may not be because of the simple courtesy that whilst men may eff-n-blind whilst in male company, they wouldn't do so in the company of a lady. I don't and wouldn't, until invited to do so by her own choice of language! I suspect that many men would feel the same.

Alec.
 
I would discipline my child for being rude to the other rider (assuming she had little control over her pony kicking), rather than the fruity language. I don't care if they swear (within reason)... but I do care if they're nasty, hurtful or rude to someone.

The girl was probably just as shocked as he was, and being called names must have been upsetting.
If an adult is near enough to chastise in such a circumstance, they should do so.
 
tootsietoo said:
I'm assuming you're female Spilletta? You see, I used to hate it, because it suggested that I was more sensitive than everyone else in the room and the only reason I could think of for them thinking that was that I was female! It's just another tiny bit of everyday sexism. Anyway, off topic!
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I think that it means that they don't assume that you are as crass and vulgar, and I'd take that as compliment not an insult.

But then again, I like it when men open doors for me, stand up when I enter a room and are generally well-mannered.

And not too off-topic because my first thought was, goodness, child or not, that is no way to speak to a lady. The lack of respect is quite scary, I'd be very concerned about what kind of man a child like that becomes. I'd also wonder what his parents' relationship is like and what sort of thing he must witness that would make him think it's ok to behave like that.

I get the anger, I do not get the manner of expressing it.
 
No, I don't like the excluding of women from the effing and blinding. It's sometimes very necessary (and satisfying) to throw a swear word in here or there and by the men apologising to me for swearing it was as if I wasn't part of it, wasn't allowed to be part of it! It's something I came across a bit working in a fairly male dominated industry. I suspect it is mostly the older generation who have this code of manners, I don't think it was men of my own age who did it. But generally the swearing is about someone or something else, it's never nice to have someone curse you to your face whether you are male or female. It's not a good way to react to any situation. If this "hunt" wants their field to be a fun and safe place for people to be then perhaps they should be enforcing manners. Then again, maybe they just want the cash from the punters.
 
HGA-12 said:
I think swearing coming from a minor is disgusting, it is bad enough out of an adult but out of the mouth of babes!!!! No but then again I am not a fan of minors anyway and feel parents should not allow children to behave like that. There are other words which can be used rather than the *F* word
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Have to agree, if either of mine came out with that their lives wouldn't be worth living (for a while, at least) and I don't think I'd ever be able to show may face with that hunt again, regardless of who did what and who's fault it was. No excuse IMO.
 
Not sure if this post does refer to yesterday's hound exercise with the Cheshire Bloodhounds, but it fits the description...about 100 riders and a small number of hounds out on a Sunday. I was there.
I'm not saying that it's the same incident, but a regular child hunter - a very 'gutsy' young boy - had his pony kicked by another, ridden by a young girl. It happened just a few yards away from me. I'm amazed that the boy's pony wasn't hurt as it was a hell of a noise, but fortunately it seems that no harm was done. I heard the girl say 'sorry' but she didn't go over and check that the boy's pony was OK.
Thing is, me and the OH were there and we just didn't hear the alleged swear words. I can't say 100% that there wasn't any swearing but it can't have been all that loud if it did happen. I've also hunted with the Cheshire Bloodhounds since the pack started up; the boy is a very regular rider and I can honestly say I've never heard him swear. So it just goes to show that if someone did indeed say that he was regularly foul-mouthed they might not necessarily have been telling the truth.
There were a lot of horses out yesterday that clearly had not been out in such a big group, but as always the organisation by the Bloodhounds team was excellent. There were Masters all over the place and I have no doubt that they would tell off any child who used bad language - but I think that this would be very unusual with our hunt and certainly not something I've come across myself.
 
tootsietoo said:
If this "hunt" wants their field to be a fun and safe place for people to be then perhaps they should be enforcing manners. Then again, maybe they just want the cash from the punters.
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I have been out with several packs and the Cheshire Bloodhounds is, without a doubt, the friendliest, most welcoming and - importantly - most safety conscious of the lot. We regularly have a field of 60+ and everyone has an excellent day because of the superb organisation. It is very much a 'fun and safe place for people to be' and, as I said in my previous post, I have never come across anything other than first-rate manners.
Also, the income from the hunts is shared between several charities and the landowners. The hunt is a not-for-profit organisation.
 
I would just like to remind everyone that this is a public forum. The Law takes a very dim view of people making accusations against people, particularly children, who are unable to defend themselves. Naming an Organisation on such a public forum and in such circumstances is also unwise from a legal point of view. Not naming, but in any other way identifying a child, and making allegations against them without first putting that child and an appropriate adult, on notice that this is going to be done and offering them the opportunity to put the record straight is extremely unwise. Please remember that this forum, like all social media spaces is not an ungoverned place in which to say things that may be actionable at law.
 
jumptillyoudrop said:
I would just like to remind everyone that this is a public forum. The Law takes a very dim view of people making accusations against people, particularly children, who are unable to defend themselves. Naming an Organisation on such a public forum and in such circumstances is also unwise from a legal point of view. Not naming, but in any other way identifying a child, and making allegations against them without first putting that child and an appropriate adult, on notice that this is going to be done and offering them the opportunity to put the record straight is extremely unwise. Please remember that this forum, like all social media spaces is not an ungoverned place in which to say things that may be actionable at law.
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Agree 100%.
The OP does not name the hunt but gives sufficient information for others to identify the organisation. Sure enough, later on, another poster uses the hunt's name and makes a comment.
I cannot be entirely sure that the OP is referring to the pack I hunt with, but too many things tie in - hound exercise on a Sunday, approximate number of riders, approximate number of hounds, incident involving a male child and a young female rider where a pony was kicked.
Now, just in case the OP is referring to the pack I hunt with - and clearly, I cannot be 100% sure of this - I would like to make a few points.

- I was close to the 'kicking' incident and heard no bad language whatsoever. Other people around me also confirm that they heard no bad language from anyone.
- The OP makes reference to a comment allegedly made about the child's routine behaviour with regards to bad language and also mentions the child's mother. Again, if this post is referring to the pack I hunt with - and I repeat that I cannot be absolutely certain about this - then I must protest in the strongest terms and state that I have never heard any of the children come out with any bad language whatsoever in the dozens and dozens of meets that we have attended. The child in question has exemplary manners and is always incredibly polite. His mother is also extremely courteous and I have never heard her use any bad language whatsoever.

The very worrying thing about any forum post is that we, as readers, tend to take things in good faith rather than questioning. As a result of the OP citing second-hand information allegedly relating to the character of a woman and her child, we have people making all sorts of judgements about these people and the hunt itself. As jumptillyoudrop states, this is very dangerous territory in legal terms.

i would simply reiterate that the allegations do not chime in any way with my experience of this hunt, which has provided me with some of the best days on horseback imaginable.

Of course, if none of this relates to that particular pack, please feel free to ignore my musings on this topic.
 
jumptillyoudrop said:
I would just like to remind everyone that this is a public forum. The Law takes a very dim view of people making accusations against people, particularly children, who are unable to defend themselves. Naming an Organisation on such a public forum and in such circumstances is also unwise from a legal point of view. Not naming, but in any other way identifying a child, and making allegations against them without first putting that child and an appropriate adult, on notice that this is going to be done and offering them the opportunity to put the record straight is extremely unwise. Please remember that this forum, like all social media spaces is not an ungoverned place in which to say things that may be actionable at law.
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Your child, then?
 
jumptillyoudrop said:
Naming an Organisation on such a public forum and in such circumstances is also unwise from a legal point of view.

Please remember that this forum, like all social media spaces is not an ungoverned place in which to say things that may be actionable at law.
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Steady on. It was me who suggested a possible name of the pack involved. Not much detective work required. I am currently looking at a colour half page ad in the Kelsall Hill BE horse trials programme detailing on which date CBH hound exercise starts, and listing the day of the week and the start time. It's hardly a clandestine activity.

It's good that people who follow this pack have posted to say that hound exercise is, in fact, well organised. It would have to be, with 100 followers out.
 
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