Full Livery - bring in, am I being unreasonable?

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Summer pudding

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Paddocks are arranged so I have to take mine first through a paddock containg two horses, sectioned by tape only (rarely on) - one can be playful and follow. Then another paddock containing a horse I don't know. I ask for help occasioally if I'm on my own, I'm on full livery...not always well received and I'm treated like a wimp. Today I even asked for pony to be brought in before I arrived as I was on a tight schedule and I had vet coming..went down like I'd asked them to eat horse poo!! What is reasonable to expect on full livery..should I be charged for this as an extra, bearing in mind they arrange the paddocks with tape so I have to go through other horses and have no choice as to where mine goes. My pony is new to me so I'm not totally sure how he would react if one of the horses played up.
 
You're on full livery. Why are you bringing your horse in yourself? What am I missing here as that is the one of the points of paying for full livery? You do not ask for help. You request that your help be brought up by xx:xx time and be ready for xxxxxx. That's the end of the story, otherwise the yard is taking the mickey.
 
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It's not unreasonable to have to catch your own pony, but neither is it unreasonable to ask for it to be caught for the vet. What is unreasonable is you being made to feel scared or stupid because you're wary (and perfectly rightly) of walking through strange horses. When I had liveries I sectioned a walkway so that everyone could get to different paddocks without going through other horses. To me it made perfect sense to try and prevent accidents if I could.

OP I would try and have a chat with your yard owner (with your parents if you're young), and let them know you don't feel safe. If nothing changes I would look for somewhere else.
 
Sebastian, on full livery you'd get your horse fed, mucked out, turned in and out etc. I suspect the OP is bringing in earlier than usual to ride - the horse would be brought in by the yard later, but not ad hoc if the owner was riding. Some yards will bring in for riding if they can, or if they know, but it's a nice extra rather than part of what you're paying for..
 
Honey08 said:
Sebastian, on full livery you'd get your horse fed, mucked out, turned in and out etc. I suspect the OP is bringing in earlier than usual to ride - the horse would be brought in by the yard later, but not ad hoc if the owner was riding. Some yards will bring in for riding if they can, or if they know, but it's a nice extra rather than part of what you're paying for..
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Obviously we differ on what we expect from full livery. I expect that when I phone and tell the yard that I want my horse to be ready at 13:20 pm on Tuesday for the vet, then it better be ready at 13:20 pm on Tuesday. I do not expect to feel like I had just asked for the person on the phone to eat poo. ;)
 
Full livery on my yard is everything except riding, that's extra. Even for the assisted liveries (turn out OR fetch in) the YO will fetch in for farrier or vet if owner isn't there yet and either turn back out or put in stable depending on time free of charge. Assisted on our yard is turn out or fetch in (obviously rug changes and hooves picked out and feed).
 
Honey08 said:
It's not unreasonable to have to catch your own pony, but neither is it unreasonable to ask for it to be caught for the vet. What is unreasonable is you being made to feel scared or stupid because you're wary (and perfectly rightly) of walking through strange horses. When I had liveries I sectioned a walkway so that everyone could get to different paddocks without going through other horses. To me it made perfect sense to try and prevent accidents if I could.

OP I would try and have a chat with your yard owner (with your parents if you're young), and let them know you don't feel safe. If nothing changes I would look for somewhere else.
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Btw I'm very mature (old)...you make my point precisely..it's not having to bring in it's going through the others that worries me. If I got into difficulties I could not be seen from the yard...not only could my pony get kicked but one of the others could be too, and how would that owner feel? Walkways would mean problem solved...i will speak to YO (who is away) - they didn't witness my meaningful exchange of words today...rather forceful as I'm at the end of my tether with Manager...providing a service not on her radar. Btw it is an expensive, smart yard so a bit of help is not an unreasonable request I thought? Ho hum, I feel I'm on a loser here and needed to share my pain...thanks!
 
You feel that you are being treated like a wimp because you are hesitant to lead your horse through a field of other horses. Thats not being a wimp,that's being sensible. I have seen plenty of gung ho types carted off to A&E after being kicked or trampled.
Even on fairly basic full livery you should not have to do something like that.Even on DIY you shouldn't have to lead through a field of strange horses. You are being sensible,they are being arrogant and stupid. One kick from a horse can irrevocably alter your life.
 
Sebastian said:
Obviously we differ on what we expect from full livery. I expect that when I phone and tell the yard that I want my horse to be ready at 13:20 pm on Tuesday for the vet, then it better be ready at 13:20 pm on Tuesday. I do not expect to feel like I had just asked for the person on the phone to eat poo. ;)
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Wow, can I come to your yard?? I have always been really polite and undemanding...been in same yard for years, managers have come and gone, I'm not a flitter but I'm turning into the livery the girls avoid but I genuinely don't think I'm unreasonable, or have I lost the plot?!
 
Mike007 said:
You feel that you are being treated like a wimp because you are hesitant to lead your horse through a field of other horses. Thats not being a wimp,that's being sensible. I have seen plenty of gung ho types carted off to A&E after being kicked or trampled.
Even on fairly basic full livery you should not have to do something like that.Even on DIY you shouldn't have to lead through a field of strange horses. You are being sensible,they are being arrogant and stupid. One kick from a horse can irrevocably alter your life.
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I saw someone kicked in the head by an over exuberant 'nice' sensible horse just milling around as horse are wont to do.
 
Summer pudding said:
Wow, can I come to your yard?? I have always been really polite and undemanding...been in same yard for years, managers have come and gone, I'm not a flitter but I'm turning into the livery the girls avoid but I genuinely don't think I'm unreasonable, or have I lost the plot?!
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Unfortunately we are DIY only, but, no,I don't think you have lost the plot at all and your expectations are not unreasonable.
 
Your not a wimp! We all saw a poster on here last year go through horrendous injury due to a fight at a gateway. CinnamonToast almost lost her leg in that.

I wouldn't lead my horse through a field with others on a daily basis on DIY, or full livery. It's too dangerous, all it takes is a small kick, right angle, chipped bone and ridden career over for the horse.

My mare lives with others but I wouldn't be happy to lead through others herds fields.
 
Mike007 said:
You feel that you are being treated like a wimp because you are hesitant to lead your horse through a field of other horses. Thats not being a wimp,that's being sensible. I have seen plenty of gung ho types carted off to A&E after being kicked or trampled.
Even on fairly basic full livery you should not have to do something like that.Even on DIY you shouldn't have to lead through a field of strange horses. You are being sensible,they are being arrogant and stupid. One kick from a horse can irrevocably alter your life.
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^^^^^this :)
 
Again, full livery means full livery to me. Unless a owner turn up without notice, the horse is to be done/bought in/etc for them without a second thought. Its what staff are paid for and what the owner pays for.

Vet visits are included in full livery, here anyway, also.
 
I have worked with horses for too many (over 25yrs) OP, I deal with the difficult and rehabbing as well as the everyday polite ones, there are not many things I will not do but walking a horse though a field of horse (known or unknown) is one of them, it puts you and your horse at high risk of serious injury-stick to your guns on this one.
 
The paddock arrangement certainly doesn't sound like a safe set up. For me it would depend on the what is stated in your livery contract. What is included in full livery can vary so much from yard to yard and area to area.

What I don't think is acceptable is the response of the staff, clients should be treated with courtesy at all times even if they were to say "I'm sorry that isn't something we normally do for liveries but we will accommodate you this time". I suspect the yard owner would be horrified to hear of the attitude of the staff and a quiet word, outlining your concerns, would be more beneficial than confronting the manager. On my yard we generally don't catch in for vet etc unless specifically asked to so but I would expect my staff to do as requested without hesitation when asked and I definitely wouldn't have paddocks set up like option describes - an accident waiting to happen IMO.
 
EventingMum said:
The paddock arrangement certainly doesn't sound like a safe set up. For me it would depend on the what is stated in your livery contract. What is included in full livery can vary so much from yard to yard and area to area.

What I don't think is acceptable is the response of the staff, clients should be treated with courtesy at all times even if they were to say "I'm sorry that isn't something we normally do for liveries but we will accommodate you this time". I suspect the yard owner would be horrified to hear of the attitude of the staff and a quiet word, outlining your concerns, would be more beneficial than confronting the manager. On my yard we generally don't catch in for vet etc unless specifically asked to so but I would expect my staff to do as requested without hesitation when asked and I definitely wouldn't have paddocks set up like option describes - an accident waiting to happen IMO.
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This isn't something I have ever requested before (no mention either way in my contract). I endeavour to have help, so this was a one off as I was alone and short of time - I arrived to find pony not in and imminent arrival of vet although the yard had been warned the day before. They had ackowledged receiving my text but had NOT me they wouldn't be doing it. Then rude, grudging help as if I was asking for the moon, sadly I lost it..only the manager was available. I should have had a friend to help but she had to attend a funeral - I certainly didn't mention that in my rant but it gives you the bigger picture. I don't think I'm a demanding livery but I do admit to completely losing it as I think it's really rude when you have someone coming to your horse (vet, farrier) and your horse isn't in. The current field arrangement is a worry and is to max turnout before the horses are in for the winter..a compromise I have to accept.
 
I find this a perfectly reasonable request, I have a small yard and bring in horses if owners are wary about entering the field with the other horses or are concerned about leading their horses (not everyone is confident especially with a new horse. You have my sympathies OP as I have been on a full livery yard in the past where if I asked for help bringing my mare in (I had to lead my lively mare through a field with 5 very lively geldings in), then I was treated like dirt, eyes rolling asking can't I manage on my own?? Safety has to prevail and your request is reasonable. Can you speak to your YO as a previous poster has suggested and if the situation doesn't change then I would look for somewhere else to keep your horse. Good luck and hope it works out for you x
 
I'm on part livery and the owner came with me last week as I wanted to get my horse in early and the others were milling round the gate. Also brought in for vet etc. at no charge.
 
Princess Rosie said:
I find this a perfectly reasonable request, I have a small yard and bring in horses if owners are wary about entering the field with the other horses or are concerned about leading their horses (not everyone is confident especially with a new horse. You have my sympathies OP as I have been on a full livery yard in the past where if I asked for help bringing my mare in (I had to lead my lively mare through a field with 5 very lively geldings in), then I was treated like dirt, eyes rolling asking can't I manage on my own?? Safety has to prevail and your request is reasonable. Can you speak to your YO as a previous poster has suggested and if the situation doesn't change then I would look for somewhere else to keep your horse. Good luck and hope it works out for you x
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Thanks...yes lots of eye rolling, you get the picture.I dread going to the yard today! Moving is not easy as we all know but I will def speak to YO as a chat with the staff could be helpful, but the contempt of the Manager does filter down to the lovely youngsters who have to do as they are told. I usually play the oldie card with them when I ask for help, and they are really nice with me..old enough to be their mum etc.!
 
You are the customer, and you're making a reasonable request in my view. If they don't want to have to help their customers in situations like this, then they should arrange their turnout a bit better. I'm on full livery, and our YO is fantastic - he fetches in my nightmare of a horse to catch so I can ride out on time, and doesn't charge a penny for it even though he sometimes has to spend a considerable time in gentle persuasion and bribery!! Bringing in for the vet and farrier is part of the livery arrangement, and if a livery was feeling a bit nervous about turning their horse out in bad weather or for any other reason, he would do it without question. Ours are turned out individually, or in small groups, and we don't have any issues - it works. I understand that it can get a bit of a pain if liveries are constantly asking for things to be done throughout the day (been on the other side of that), but it's part of the job and I would want to help someone in your situation.

I HATE having to lead horses through other horses' fields - it's downright dangerous. It's bad enough having to battle out of gates with your own, whilst trying to keep others from escaping and open and shut the gate. You're not being unreasonable. Maybe you could ask the YO outright what the problem with helping you is? Or find a yard where they are more sympathetic.
 
We do only part livery. That's everything except exercise, tack cleaning and non essential grooming. I do not expect to have to bring horses in for clients to ride, although will do so if they are in a hurry and text to ask me. I don't charge extra for this. I also automatically bring in for vet, dentist and farrier. I do not have any paddocks where you have to go through others to reach them. I think this is dangerous. Also, if a client's horse is out with another that I know is bothersome at the gate, then I will do my best to be around to assist them getting their horse out.
 
I am on DIY and but even then if someone was having difficulty with getting a horse in or with anything and YO was available then she would help often free of charge.

I can understand if this was an everyday request to catch in at a different time but if it was a one off as the vet was coming then I would expect someone to help you {even if they charge you extra} if you have given then enough notice to make sure someone is available if it is not normal coming in time. It may be that as your pony is on full livery and normally caught in by yard staff that they catch the horses in in a certain order so the ones in the paddocks you have to walk through are caught in first so they don't have to bring your pony through the fields when there are other horses are in them.

For some time of the year my pony is in a diet paddock and I do have to bring him through another field with other horses in to get him out and at first I was a bit anxious about this but these are normally horses he knows because he joins this group when he needs more grass later in the year and they are quiet bunch. Additionally sometimes horses are bought through the field he is in too when he is dieting and that does not seem to be a problem either as the ponies in his field who are dieting are only really interested in eating.
 
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SO1 said:
I am on DIY and but even then if someone was having difficulty with getting a horse in or with anything and YO was available then she would help often free of charge.

I can understand if this was an everyday request to catch in at a different time but if it was a one off as the vet was coming then I would expect someone to help you {even if they charge you extra} if you have given then enough notice to make sure someone is available if it is not normal coming in time. It may be that as your pony is on full livery and normally caught in by yard staff that they catch the horses in in a certain order so the ones in the paddocks you have to walk through are caught in first so they don't have to bring your pony through the fields when there are other horses are in them.

For some time of the year my pony is in a diet paddock and I do have to bring him through another field with other horses in to get him out and at first I was a bit anxious about this but these are normally horses he knows because he joins this group when he needs more grass later in the year and they are quiet bunch. Additionally sometimes horses are bought through the field he is in too when he is dieting and that does not seem to be a problem either as the ponies in his field who are dieting are only really interested in eating.
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Full livery, a one off and they had notice so could decline in advance, I arrived to find him not in! You are right about bringing in in safe order, but this doesn't get round liveries having to bring in to ride through other fields which could be risky. Thank you everyone for your helpful replies..I think we might have covered all points...I now have to face the yard. Ho hum..this is supposed to be a hobby.
 
Mike007 said:
You feel that you are being treated like a wimp because you are hesitant to lead your horse through a field of other horses. Thats not being a wimp,that's being sensible. I have seen plenty of gung ho types carted off to A&E after being kicked or trampled.
Even on fairly basic full livery you should not have to do something like that.Even on DIY you shouldn't have to lead through a field of strange horses. You are being sensible,they are being arrogant and stupid. One kick from a horse can irrevocably alter your life.
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Or even non gung-ho types!

I don't think you're being unreasonable, OP and yesterday, a friend and I helped a fellow DIY get her horse in because others were milling round the gate and she was worried. It's only fair to help where you can and if you asked for yours to be brought in early, then that's what should have been done.
 
I think its totally ridiculous and dangerous to bring horses in and out through paddocks containing other horses. Stupidity really. surely the electric tape could be organised so there is a walkway up the middle with paddocks off each side?
 
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