Full loans/leases- someone tell me about them please! Your experiences

[Gingey]

Hiya, I am considering loaning out my horse as I am going to uni. Have had several people ask about possibility of loaning/leasing, up until now he has just been advertised for sale- but sadly with the market how it is, no success as yet.
I haven't loaned or leased a horse out before, and have only loaned off other people through informal agreements with the owners (friends).
In general, what's the arrangement? I know that loans differ in terms of what is agreed between loaner and loanee(? ) and of course a contract would be drawn up. But as a rule of thumb, cost-wise, who is responsible for what? Am I essentially giving my horse away to a new home (but still retaining ownership), therefore transferring all costs to them as if he were their own?
- This is what I would like if so!

Am trepidatious though as have heard so many horror stories about loans gone wrong. Am desperate for him to have a lovely home as he is great.
Any experiences/advice welcome please.

 

[Luci07]

Loan, no money changes hands but loaned takes on full responsibility and running costs. Insurane is sometimes kept on by the owner to ensure this is covered. Very occasionally rugs and seem tack go too but not normally. Lease is when the owner is paid a fee each month for the use of the horse but again all costs etc are met by the leasee you need to get get a contract which clearly states what the Horse can do,ownership, shoeing etc and take out references. Pref a vet! While a contract does not cover all it would at least ensure you have a common ground. If you have a horse who is still out competing and improving I would be tempted to hang on for a bit to try to sell though. Loans come back! Maybe consider a good college to lend him to for the winter?

 

[Tai.Ni.Po.Ni]

I've loaned my horse out and it was only ment to be for a year however I was so happy with the way she's going and how happy she is I have said to the girl she can keep her until she wants. Best thing I've done for her !

 

[Molly'sMama]

I full loan a horse at the moment ,its perfect

Am I essentially giving my horse away to a new home (but still retaining ownership), therefore transferring all costs to them as if he were their own?
- This is what I would like if so!

Thats what we do,and what a lot of people do. That [in my experience] is known as a full loan and lots are happy to do that.

Maybe consider a good college to lend him to for the winter]

If youre worried about you're horse,I would not recommend this,I've looked into it before,horses are worked for about 2 hours a day ,and possibly by some very amateur riders . At least with a loan ,you could see them ride the horse,let them have it for a bit before you go.

 

[spottyfilly]

Ive just taken one of my horses back from loan, NEVER AGAIN! He was with them a whole 6 weeks and he has come back a hatrack, covered in mud fever and bald on his face They seemed lovely when I met them and they ran a professional establishment but failed to advise me of the problems that arose with him, by luck I spotted a photo on fb of him and went to see him pronto, well the sight was unbelievable. He left me looking fab and came back a state. If they had kept me informd in the first place I would have helped them but the fact that they didnt got my back up. To think what he would of looked like if i hadnt seen the photo and waited until sept/oct until I went to see him as planned i dread to think what he would have been like.

 

[Gingey]

Thanks Luci07 that is just what I needed to know!
I'm now inclined to think that maybe a lease is the way to go. Yes had already thought that I'd want to see some references from instructors/PCs/RCs/YOs- vet is a good idea. In your experience is there a reason for rugs/tack etc not normally going too? He has an extensive wardrobe which I'd be happy to let go with him!
Someone did mention the colleges to me but I really don't think that would suit him, as a TB he can be a bit stressy, and whilst he thrives in his current routine with one rider, lots of turnout and a smallish yard, I'm not sure he would be great on a busy college yard where I understand turnout is often limited (eg Hartpury etc). Thanks for the thought though.
Unfortunately the one thing I can't do (although I desperately want to ) is hang onto him, as he can't come to uni with me. Hopefully if I do go down this route I won't struggle to find someone as like I say I've already had people asking, I guess in this climate people just can't afford the initial large cost of buying.

 

[Tai.Ni.Po.Ni]

Ive just taken one of my horses back from loan, NEVER AGAIN! He was with them a whole 6 weeks and he has come back a hatrack, covered in mud fever and bald on his face They seemed lovely when I met them and they ran a professional establishment but failed to advise me of the problems that arose with him, by luck I spotted a photo on fb of him and went to see him pronto, well the sight was unbelievable. He left me looking fab and came back a state. If they had kept me informd in the first place I would have helped them but the fact that they didnt got my back up. To think what he would of looked like if i hadnt seen the photo and waited until sept/oct until I went to see him as planned i dread to think what he would have been like.

Surprising how he ended up like that only after 6 weeks

 

[Gingey]

I've loaned my horse out and it was only ment to be for a year however I was so happy with the way she's going and how happy she is I have said to the girl she can keep her until she wants. Best thing I've done for her !

This is great to hear

I full loan a horse at the moment ,its perfect



Thats what we do,and what a lot of people do. That [in my experience] is known as a full loan and lots are happy to do that.



If youre worried about you're horse,I would not recommend this,I've looked into it before,horses are worked for about 2 hours a day ,and possibly by some very amateur riders . At least with a loan ,you could see them ride the horse,let them have it for a bit before you go.

Glad to hear you're having a positive experience
Yes that was part of my concerns about the colleges. Whilst he's a very lovely, genuine horse and has given me a huge amount of fun, he's quite sharp and sensitive and wouldn't be suited to real amateurs/novices, especially not by lots of different ones! Yes that's my thinking, and even better if I were able to find someone fairly local.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

He left me looking fab and came back a state

This happened to mine too when he went out on loan last autumn. He's got sweet itch, which is easily managed, and in the contract I'd given strict instructions that he had to have his SI rug on at all times when he was out. I also spoke with the YM who said she'd look after his condition.

Within a week he was in an awful state. I'd sent him with a lovely full flowing mane and tail, and within the week they'd turned him out, when it was hot and the midges were biting, and he'd rubbed himself raw and bleeding. God I was SO upset. And then the YO had to temerity to tell me that he was in this state when I'd sent him to the yard to week before. Jeez I was incandescent.

And THEN, to beat it all, only five weeks into the loan, the numpty girl that had taken him on loan (and was keeping him at livery at this yard) calmly announced she "couldn't afford it anymore" and would I have him back please. (He's now back with me and won't ever leave the yard again).

OP, just a suggestion, but you could consider "loaning" yours to an equestrian college? This would solve your problem in many ways, in that he'd be looked after, schooled & exercised while you were at uni and you wouldn't have to worry. In the holidays you would have to pay for whatever livery was available there though, or bring him home to your yard. But I did it with my boy when I had a family/caring commitment - and it worked fantastically for me. You can still visit and ride your horse (by arrangement) and he'll be well looked after.

 

[Tai.Ni.Po.Ni]

Thanks Luci07 that is just what I needed to know!
I'm now inclined to think that maybe a lease is the way to go. Yes had already thought that I'd want to see some references from instructors/PCs/RCs/YOs- vet is a good idea. In your experience is there a reason for rugs/tack etc not normally going too? He has an extensive wardrobe which I'd be happy to let go with him!
Someone did mention the colleges to me but I really don't think that would suit him, as a TB he can be a bit stressy, and whilst he thrives in his current routine with one rider, lots of turnout and a smallish yard, I'm not sure he would be great on a busy college yard where I understand turnout is often limited (eg Hartpury etc). Thanks for the thought though.
Unfortunately the one thing I can't do (although I desperately want to ) is hang onto him, as he can't come to uni with me. Hopefully if I do go down this route I won't struggle to find someone as like I say I've already had people asking, I guess in this climate people just can't afford the initial large cost of buying.

I let all my girls stuff go with her, was doing more good there than it was sitting in my garage

 

[Gingey]

Ive just taken one of my horses back from loan, NEVER AGAIN! He was with them a whole 6 weeks and he has come back a hatrack, covered in mud fever and bald on his face They seemed lovely when I met them and they ran a professional establishment but failed to advise me of the problems that arose with him, by luck I spotted a photo on fb of him and went to see him pronto, well the sight was unbelievable. He left me looking fab and came back a state. If they had kept me informd in the first place I would have helped them but the fact that they didnt got my back up. To think what he would of looked like if i hadnt seen the photo and waited until sept/oct until I went to see him as planned i dread to think what he would have been like.

Oh dear- this is my worst nightmare about loaning! Have you loaned out any others with success or was this the first you've loaned out?

 

[Gingey]

This happened to mine too when he went out on loan last autumn. He's got sweet itch, which is easily managed, and in the contract I'd given strict instructions that he had to have his SI rug on at all times when he was out. I also spoke with the YM who said she'd look after his condition.

Within a week he was in an awful state. I'd sent him with a lovely full flowing mane and tail, and within the week they'd turned him out, when it was hot and the midges were biting, and he'd rubbed himself raw and bleeding. God I was SO upset. And then the YO had to temerity to tell me that he was in this state when I'd sent him to the yard to week before. Jeez I was incandescent.

And THEN, to beat it all, only five weeks into the loan, the numpty girl that had taken him on loan (and was keeping him at livery at this yard) calmly announced she "couldn't afford it anymore" and would I have him back please. (He's now back with me and won't ever leave the yard again).

Oh dear, these bad experiences are not making me feel very positive about loaning So sorry to hear about your poor boy. Believe me, if I could keep mine with me for ever, I would!

OP, just a suggestion, but you could consider "loaning" yours to an equestrian college? This would solve your problem in many ways, in that he'd be looked after, schooled & exercised while you were at uni and you wouldn't have to worry. In the holidays you would have to pay for whatever livery was available there though, or bring him home to your yard. But I did it with my boy when I had a family/caring commitment - and it worked fantastically for me. You can still visit and ride your horse (by arrangement) and he'll be well looked after.

Thanks for the suggestion but as I said I'm not sure it would suit him, though glad it worked for yours. Plus, having the financial aspects and responsibility of having him back in holidays just wouldn't work for me, I need him to be in a stable home (excuse the pun ) with loaners, rather than continuing to have him as my own in hols. My non-horsey parents wouldn't really be keen on this arrangement as they don't really want to carry on paying for him at all, and as a first year I won't have the money

 

[FfionWinnie]

I let all my horses stuff go with her, in fact it was my entire life's collection of stuff.

She wasnt meant to come back however she did and I got hardly anything back.

She had top quality rugs and everything and came back with crappy ripped ones and the woman said oh we'll it's been 6 years they don't last. I felt as they were brand new Rambo rugs they DO last and if not should have been replaced with similar.

Didn't really argue at the time because I was totally out of horses and didn't think it that important but now we are back in and it's gutting.

So make an inventory of EVERYTHING inc condition/make etc.

 

[Luci07]

So colleges. Pregnant friend who had a tricky horse and just would not have the time for her boy sold him to her old college. Full disclosure and he will neither be ridden by real novices or worked into the floor so not everywhere does that! She has been to see him twice ans he has settled in well. I personally would not send out a huge wardrobe of tack and rugs as these items are costly to replace. My old mare went with a decent MW stable and turnout and came back with nothing. Had been under a lot of pressure to send her tack with her but didnt as tack was all expensive. References are vital and I said vet etc so you can judge how long someone as been around. Just a thought but have you looked at maybe yards near you at Uni? with possible share to help out when you get there?

 

[Luci07]

Surprising how he ended up like that only after 6 weeks

Not really. Some TBs would drop that fast if incorrectly managed.

 

[spottyfilly]

Surprising how he ended up like that only after 6 weeks

God knows, he's been back less than a week and he's putting weight on already just being out in a field full of grass! He will never leave my yard again!

 

[spottyfilly]

Not really. Some TBs would drop that fast if incorrectly managed.

He is a tb and I stipulated how he needs to be managed, I just couldnt believe my eyes when I saw him.

 

[spottyfilly]

Oh dear- this is my worst nightmare about loaning! Have you loaned out any others with success or was this the first you've loaned out?

I will never loan out again after this, I know some loans work really well but I personally wouldnt after being stung like this.

 

[rubysmum]

I have the spotty pone on full loan.
We have a BHS style agreement, had a mutual 6 week initial trial, owner has now extended it on a year contract. I provided employer, personal and equine refs, showed them my driving license and CRB check to confirm identity. I send regular e-mails updating them on her progress and have friended them on FB.
I have provided saddle, bridle and some rugs, she came with some stuff and this is all detailed in the loan contract.
I sent them a copy of her insurance certificate and the owners also have details of my equine dentist, trimmer and physio.
They are in regular contact with my instructor.
We have a clear understanding that they can visit the horse at anytime, without my knowledge.
After the sad death of my big mare, i was not in a position to buy and am extremely grateful that someone is kind enough to loan their horse to me.

 

[Tai.Ni.Po.Ni]

God knows, he's been back less than a week and he's putting weight on already just being out in a field full of grass! He will never leave my yard again!

Glad he's back with you and making a recovery. Mines is a good doer so wouldn't matter if she only had grass she wouldnt loose weight dramatically. You wonder how people don't notice it and wouldn't think to contact you ? Strange people.

 

[Gingey]

So colleges. Pregnant friend who had a tricky horse and just would not have the time for her boy sold him to her old college. Full disclosure and he will neither be ridden by real novices or worked into the floor so not everywhere does that! She has been to see him twice ans he has settled in well.

Glad it's worked for her but just not the thing for my boy. Thanks though

I personally would not send out a huge wardrobe of tack and rugs as these items are costly to replace. My old mare went with a decent MW stable and turnout and came back with nothing. Had been under a lot of pressure to send her tack with her but didnt as tack was all expensive.

Ahh I see, makes sense!

Just a thought but have you looked at maybe yards near you at Uni? with possible share to help out when you get there?

Afraid as mentioned above, keeping him myself is not an option- partially financially (managing on a student budget) and also because I don't think I'll be able to devote the necessary time and effort that he deserves- he's a fit and active horse who loves to go out and about, competing, hunting etc, and trying to keep him that way whilst trying just to cope with being a fresher as well would just be too much! Plus, the moving back and forth for holidays etc wouldn't really work as we are selling the trailer (uni fees need to be paid..!) and I think would probably unsettle him. I am ready to move him on to a new home for his own good.
Thanks for your reply!

 

[Gingey]

I let all my horses stuff go with her, in fact it was my entire life's collection of stuff.

She wasnt meant to come back however she did and I got hardly anything back.

She had top quality rugs and everything and came back with crappy ripped ones and the woman said oh we'll it's been 6 years they don't last. I felt as they were brand new Rambo rugs they DO last and if not should have been replaced with similar.

Didn't really argue at the time because I was totally out of horses and didn't think it that important but now we are back in and it's gutting.

So make an inventory of EVERYTHING inc condition/make etc.

...Oh dear, another story confirming my fears about loaning Sorry about all your stuff. Was the horse in OK condition though?

 

[Gingey]

I have the spotty pone on full loan.
We have a BHS style agreement, had a mutual 6 week initial trial, owner has now extended it on a year contract. I provided employer, personal and equine refs, showed them my driving license and CRB check to confirm identity. I send regular e-mails updating them on her progress and have friended them on FB.
I have provided saddle, bridle and some rugs, she came with some stuff and this is all detailed in the loan contract.
I sent them a copy of her insurance certificate and the owners also have details of my equine dentist, trimmer and physio.
They are in regular contact with my instructor.
We have a clear understanding that they can visit the horse at anytime, without my knowledge.
After the sad death of my big mare, i was not in a position to buy and am extremely grateful that someone is kind enough to loan their horse to me.

See now, you sound like the IDEAL loaner! Are you sure you don't want to loan another He's not spotty but he's very sweet...
If I do go down the loan route i would LOVE to find someone like you.

 

[Honey08]

I have loaned two ponies from other people - one of which we ended up buying, the other we had six months and sent back as it was too much. Neither of these came with much tack or rugs.

I have loaned out my first pony for over ten years. Two out of four homes were wonderful, and both had him for over four years. As they were so good and he was always well when I visited (and also as he was over 100 miles away), I didn't check him very often, and both of them took it upon themselves to pass him onto another loan home when they outgrew him - despite a contract being signed saying he should come home afterwards. It annoyed me. The final time especially, as they gave him to a riding school. He was 20, and used loads as he was a good pony. Luckily I knew someone nearby who let me know and we took him home.

As for equipment, I always send a horse/pony on with tack and rugs that fit them when I sell/loan them. I like to know that the horse is comfortable. Yes the pony came back with different rugs years later - I agree that after a few years things wear, and I wouldn't expect everyone to be able to replace them with top of the range stuff. I would send them in well fitting cheaper rugs that you aren't so "proud " of.

Generally I would not ever loan a horse out again. Even with the great loaners, they often come home at the drop of a hat and its always in winter! Having been a student when they came home, it was hard work. I would sell your horse to a really good home (they always seem better when sold - people put more time into problems rather than shooting them back PDQ..) and buy another horse when you have got through uni and found where your life is going..

 

[rubysmum]

See now, you sound like the IDEAL loaner! Are you sure you don't want to loan another He's not spotty but he's very sweet...
If I do go down the loan route i would LOVE to find someone like you.

Thank you

I am just so grateful to be able to have a horse again and would never dream of treating a loan any differently to a horse i owned.

There are people out there like me, who can offer kind, experienced and useful homes to loan horses.

Good luck with your search

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

It might help OP if you had a look on the BHS website as they have a sample loan agreement.

HOWEVER, the problem with these DIY arrangements is that they're not legally binding. So if loaning again (I shan't be!) I would consult a legal beagle with experience of equine to make sure everything is as watertight as can be.

Is there anyone within your "horsey" circle of friends who might be able to take yours? Or know someone who could? You really need to have a buddy who can look in on him regularly (and spontaneously as well) to make sure he's OK.

I've got a mare on loan from my trainer: and this is what works for us, if it helps:-

1. Know your loaner well (we've known each other since schooldays, with a gap in between)

2. Knowing the horse will suit the loaner: even though a few tweaks may be needed

3. Open and honest communication at all times

4. Loaner & owner to be able to discuss any problems as they arise in an open and honest manner

5. Owner to be able to relinquish day-to-day management of their horse to someone else and trust that person implicity (hard for owners to "let go" if a loaner is doing particularly well with the horse - v. easy for jealousy to creep in here if not careful)

6. Arrangements put in place re. vets fees, replacement of tack, medical issues etc etc. Basically who pays for what.

7. An agreement of what will happen if the horse injures itself and the owner cannot be contacted, i.e. euthanasia. Owner MUST agree for the loaner to allow vet to do this if they are not contactable. Awful subject, but must be agreed upon in advance.

Good luck with yours anyway.

 

[Grumpy Jewel]

I have loaned horses in the past and have been very lucky as the owners have all been supportive but not intefering. My mare went out on full loan yesterday to a lovely home. She has everything booked in that needs doing and ishe is already being totally spoiled. I do worry as she is
nearly 2 hrs away, but I have to
trust that the loaner will do
everything she says. Having
spoken to her lots and met her
lots I do believe what she says.
I'm hoping it's karma paying me back!

 

[debsflo]

We loaned a horse for 3 years. Had a contract with owner,they had insurance as did we. We paid all normal bills and cared for her as if she was ours ie feed ,shoeing,tack,competitions. They paid for any vet bills out of the ordinary and needed to be informed. They visited several times and we would keep them updated. Worked really well. We loved her and she returned once outgrown by my daughter.

 

[Gingey]

I have loaned two ponies from other people - one of which we ended up buying, the other we had six months and sent back as it was too much. Neither of these came with much tack or rugs.

I have loaned out my first pony for over ten years. Two out of four homes were wonderful, and both had him for over four years. As they were so good and he was always well when I visited (and also as he was over 100 miles away), I didn't check him very often, and both of them took it upon themselves to pass him onto another loan home when they outgrew him - despite a contract being signed saying he should come home afterwards. It annoyed me. The final time especially, as they gave him to a riding school. He was 20, and used loads as he was a good pony. Luckily I knew someone nearby who let me know and we took him home.

As for equipment, I always send a horse/pony on with tack and rugs that fit them when I sell/loan them. I like to know that the horse is comfortable. Yes the pony came back with different rugs years later - I agree that after a few years things wear, and I wouldn't expect everyone to be able to replace them with top of the range stuff. I would send them in well fitting cheaper rugs that you aren't so "proud " of.

Ok, good advice, thanks Awful about your ponies being sold on though. I would hate that.

Generally I would not ever loan a horse out again. Even with the great loaners, they often come home at the drop of a hat and its always in winter! Having been a student when they came home, it was hard work. I would sell your horse to a really good home (they always seem better when sold - people put more time into problems rather than shooting them back PDQ..) and buy another horse when you have got through uni and found where your life is going..

I don't WANT to loan, I would much rather sell to a really good home, for the reason you have stated- but unfortunately no one is buying and I'm running out of time before uni...
I want the best for him, hence not trying to keep him with me through uni as it's just not viable for me.

 

[Honey08]

Oh I see. i'd drop your price and suck it up.

ps. My ponies weren't sold on, just passed onto new loan homes without me being told by their previous long term loaners, who both thought they were doing me a favour, but didn't find them good homes...