Funny letter in the H&H...

H

H-J

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Has any body seen the letter in the H&H this week saying riding club opens are equivilent to a BE novice/intermediate I had to laugh, lots!! Does he need his eyes testing!!!

Riding club ODE are for people just starting out etc and they then progress to BE. Think that he thinks you do BE then progress to riding club ODE's!!
 
Dont know why we are wasting our money registerring with BE guys!!

Just to say I am not in anyway putting down people who do riding club, just that this guy needs to get his facts right on heights!!
 
Havent read it but when I did riding club open ODE it was at sulihull and the xc was most definitely over the Novice BE course!

Again the Open RC hunter trial was also run over the Novice course with a few PN options at Milton Keynes.
 
Yes but they are championships and are held at places that run BE events therefore are going to be stiffer. But you usual local riding club is about 3ft, not Novice BE or Intermediate!!

And it isnt just the height its the technicality of the fences BE
 
Oh sorry I think i read it wrong then.

All the RC qualifiers that were Novice (run over Intro/PN courses) and the Open was BE Novice standard).

However, if youre just talking random RC (not affiliated) then some of them yes are up to around 3ft - but I suppose its just where I live as all the courses our riding club used were BE affiliated courses.
 
i also wrote a letter in (not published) but i said i think that my local RC ODE is just as challenging as an intro in some repects-mostly xc wise im talking about.

and i think that some of the biggest Rc/PC courses are probably heading up to Novice BE level, from what i have seen..but thats just my opinion!
 
Not the majority though and the technicality is no where near the standard of BE courses.

And I DO NOT believe that a RC novice 2ft 3 is teh same as BE intros in the majority of cases.

The main things which I thought was wrong was that a RC open is of the same height and technicality of a Novice/Intermediate, has anybody seen a RC open and a BE intermediate track lately?? I challenge my local RC Open friends to go and jump a BE Intermediate track!! They wouldnt dream of doing it, they say a BE Novice trackis massive!
 
Off Churchbury is quite a testing course for the RC championships! I havent ridden it but seen it!

A friend of mine won it a couple of years ago - she regularly rides at Novice level eventing.

Shall go and find my HH copy and have a read, because if he is talking about affiliated RC horse trials standard then yes I do agree with him. However, if they are just talking about a bog standard RC hunter trial/horse trials then no I wouldnt agree - unless of course they run their competitions at the likes of Solihull, Milton Keynes etc
 
When walking the course at solihull last year for our area's ode qualifier, the novice course (2ft 6-2ft9) was way more technical that any intro on teh circuit. the Open then was a mixture of PN and Novice fences, with the combinations being of novice standard. Just with PN let up fences- this is the case with pony club too- but with the champs being run mostly over the cic**/intermediate track.

I wouldnt underestimate the strength of some of the unaffiliated championships! they are strong, and in alot of cases alot more competitive!
 
Yes but they are championship standard. Your normal bog standard riding clud ODE is certainly not up to the standard of BE. I am taking a friends horse around an un-affiliated intermediate next week and that is quite capable of that, but I wouldnt dream of Pre Novicing the horse, it would fall on its face!
 
maybe they just ment chamopionship standard and didnt mention it, i know after opur RC came back from the nationals they said the 3ft3 ish course *thinks* intermediate? was very technical and they compete at PN....oi think it probably depends on the standard of the courses around you, and by that i mean either RC ?PC or BE
 
No - Neither Jack or I are just talking Championship standard - we're talking (we're from the same area) that our RC uses course like this for their events.

Some of the RC courses i have attended are more trappy, and are definitely not Intro standard (for intermediate) but these have been Unaffiliated RC's not Affiliated to BHS - the BHS RC's do tend (around our way) use tougher courses.

Although they do hold a minimus/very novice class at the beginning of the day.

Our intermediate class is run over the Intro/Pn course the Novice classes are run over a good standard 2'6 but the Open is very much run over a PN/N standard and if its a qualifier it would be slightly stronger - I guess thats just our area then?
 
Maybe. Some of the Open courses around me, the odd fence is PN height but you never see an a,b,c,d combination with a narrow at the end like you get BE Novice. So I think BE courses when you look at the majority are more technical then RC XC courses. They usually run over longer distances too and have more fences.
 
I wonder what area the guy who wrote the letter was from.

I am saying this from my experience of competing unaffilaited and affiliated quite far spread.

I think if you looked at every BE course and every un-affiliated course then 9 times out of 10 the ratio this guy used would not be correct.
 
I'm sorry, but I agree with Jacko here - you are underestimating the standard. Most Riding Cubs hold their Novice over BE intro courses, intermediate over Pre-Novice and Open over Novice - most of the one's around here do. It is a very arrogant attitude to underestimate the standard at RC's - this is the problem with affiliated in that they sometimes tend to look down their noses at unaffiliated - which is exactly what you have done, and not stopping to think before your original post. Yes, the champs may well be run over near enough intermediate courses, but the horses still have to do it so therefore need to be capable of it.

Stop and think next time about what you say and how you come across - you've come across as down right snobby.
 
I did not intend to come accross like that at all. As I said in my original post that I do not wish to put down un-affiliated people.

I have competed un-affiliated for a long time and thoroughly enjoyed it. I still compete un-affiliated XC if I have a baby and DO NOT look down my nose at people.

It was just a comment about my thinking this person was wrong based on what I have seen in my area.

I could have easily been the other way round, I am sorry you took offence
 
I have been on the floor enough times eventing both un-affiliated and affiliated to not be snobby at all in the slightest I am really not like that!!
 
I also do not underestimate the standard of un-affiliated I did the RC course at Poplar park, I did the Open and sure enough it was round the BE Novice/Intermediate.

I am talking about normal non qualifying/PC ODEs just your normal XC events and from what I have seen I disagree with his comments of comparing RC and BE. I have not in anyway said that BE is better or the people etc, just about the heights.
 
I haven't taken offenSe at all - I speak as I find. The guy that wrote the letter was quite correct with what he has said, and has his facts spot on. Like I said earlier, before you go posting in such a flippant way thinking "this'll make 'em laugh", maybe you should get YOUR facts right.

RC's and PC's provide a high standard of competition and are often friendlier than affiliated events. I myself am not going to bother affiliating BE next year in favour of some very good unaffiliated events run over intro and Pre-Novice courses, with some over Novice - correct me if I'm wrong anyone but...Llanymynech, Eland Lodge, Somerford, and I'm sure many more over the country.

Sorry if I'm being rather blunt, but it's quite easy to provoke a debate on here.
 
Tell me about it seabiscuit!! Just making a simple post about a letter I disagreed with and was asking other people what they thought?

Obviously my un-affiliated tracks round here are smaller!! Im not too proud to admit that
 
I don't know what courses they run PC events over where you live, but round here they are over the normal BE courses!
The Open for instance at Bicton a year ago was the Novice and Intermediate course, and the local Winkleigh Course does lots of Pony Club comps over their BE courses too.
I measured the course and many of the fences were at least 3' 3" and the degree of difficulty was such that only two horses did clear XC rounds out of 9...
I agree some RC courses are 1' 6" but don't lump them all in the same bracket, when you get the sort of fences like trakeners and jumps over big logs into water that they use for Intermediate they are a fair test...
(there are two fences on my blog in the archives proving what I mean, go to www.henryhorn.blogspot.com, look in the archives on the right for Aug 2005.....)
 
See round here we would never have anything like that!!!! You are all so lucky to have un-affiliated courses like that!

I will post some of round here to show you what I mean!!
 
Our RC and PC events are normally 2'3, 2'9 and 3'3. The 3'3 would be a cross between PN and nov and the 2'9 might use some intro fences. When I read the letter in H&H I assumed the writer was talking about the RC champs, and possibly area qualifiers for said champs.
Here they are a lot lower. There would never be an intermediate fence in an RC class even the open.
Fiona
 
So you do agree in thinking Fiona that the guy has got it slightly wrong?

Here is some pics of a RC course near me, it isnt me in the pics I just copied them, 1st is the Novice, then an Open fence.

Novice.jpg

Open2.jpg
 
I agree RC ODE can be tough!! I know of several around our way that are NOT simple and straight forward, in fact i'd say a riding club Novice/intermediate would prob not be upto height, but be just as technical as an intro/pre novice. I'm doing a ODE next week, that i'm questioning whether to run my baby over XC, and i'd quite happily give a majority of Intros ive walked (and thats a fair few!) a go. The ODE is senior PC novice standard too...
shocked.gif


I'm not having a go though hon, I know where your coming from, but RC events have certainly raised the standard, and certainly shock me, as someone who has more experience BE than unaff ODE's.
 
The guy who wrote is from Devon, and he said "I think the riding clubs' novice is just as challenging as a BE intro and its intermediate is tougher than BE pre-novice. It also runs open and special open sections, which I believe are the equivalent to BE novice and intermediate level." He seems to have exagerated ever so slightly, probably to get his point across, but what everyone else has said seems to agree to be honest!

And the point the man is trying to get across is that BRC are getting it wrong as it should be for the rider who doesn't want to do BE. I certainly agree with that!
 
For the record, riding club novice (at area & champs) is 85cm / 2'9" with SOME fences allowed up to 90cm/2'11" - ie B.E. intro height to allow areas flexibilty when using courses built to B. E. standards. Ridning Club Intermediate (area & champs) is 1m / 3' 3" (B. E. pre- novice). Ridng Club Open (area & champs) 1.10m /3' 7" (B. E. Novice). Special Open 2006 1.10m XC & B. E. intermediate SJ /D.sage.
Standards at area & champs generally quite high but BRC affiliated clubs DO cater for all levels.

NB. Can't comment on OP remarks re letter in H & H, but will point out that the majority of RC qualifiers are held over B.E. courses!!
 
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