Further to my farrier post below - photos of flat feet...

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Jericho

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Someone suggested that it might be useful to post some photos of my horses feet to get opinions on how he is shod. I am having some issues with his feet as he is terribly flat footed with under run and collapsed heels but my farrier doesnt think much can be done to improve his feet and recently 2 different people have said his feet/shoes look terrible.

Overall I am not happy with his way of going - he is uncomfortable and think his flat footedness is contributing to this and this has become worse hence he is going in for a full lameness workup tomorrow and I will request xrays of his feet as well. I also think that in the 7 months that I have had him his feet are getting worse (unfortunately I dont have any photos of 7 months ago)

so any opinions please....if anyone is clever with photoshop can lines be added to show what dimensions his heels should be?? What can be done to improve them? How bad is the shoeing?

NB the current shoes are 5 1/2 weeks old and we have had very little rain here which I think is contributing to his cracks. I was quite shocked really at the photos as you can see in close up how bad his feet are. He has been on TopSpec Comp balancer for last 4 months so should be getting good levels of biotin. He is out 24/7, very little road work, hacked once a week, schooled once a week. Oh and he is 12 years old.

front feet
P1050230.jpg


P1050232.jpg


P1050238.jpg


hind feet
P1050235.jpg


P1050236.jpg
 
The cracks arent that bad I dont think - certainly not for a TB in summer, but then I try to scrub mine with water a couple of times a week and use NAF hoof moist.

His heels are terribly collapsed though in my opinion - his toes should be cut right back. In the second pic, he almost looks pigeon toed.

It takes 9 months or so for the horn to grow, so the new horn which has had 4 months of biotin will be the top half of the hoof. You can tell from the rings that he has had quite a few changes in grazing/feed.
 
His toes are far to long even though he has been shod 5ish weeks long toes/collapsed heels=tendon problems. First start by getting his toes knocked right back, also to help his collapsed heels egg bar shoes will give him the extra support he needs, am I correct in thinking he is not that sound? Also some pads will help cos everything will be so close to the ground making him footy, they do a concusion pad that the blacksmith puts a mesh out the foot and squirts some Easi- Pak over it which sets like rubber and they dont lose them like old fashioned concusion pads. Looks like you need a remidial farrier.
 
HIs hind heels look a lot better than his fronts heels, which are terribly underun. His heels ought to be brought back, and toes brought back, and all flaring removed.

My mare's front feet used to get cracks in summer and the farrier used to declare she had awful feet and that was the way it was. He then retired for a year (whilst having surgery and time off) and I had to do her myself in between the new farrier visits (he wasn't reliable) and she went barefoot, and has been brilliant since. My old farrier came back and declared her feet are wonderful and she has good feet now, only because I worked at them.

I would get a different farrier, or go barefoot and use hoofboots. The reason I went barefoot, is that I wasn't happy with the standards of shoeing, and her feet were so flat and cracking and suchlike. No more lost shoes ever LOL.

Sometimes cracks tracking up along the nailholes can be white line disease, but you won't tell until the shoe is removed, and you can look at the white line and check for any black bits in the white line. Scrubbing feet and nailholes out with miltons 2 or 3 times a week will help kill any bacteria in the old nail holes and make the hoof a bit healthier.

I tried farrier formula and all sorts when shod, but it did nothing for my mare till I removed her shoes, and she's totally flourished now. Thats what worked for me, but again it's not everyone's cup of tea LOL
 
Has the farrier not suggested putting wedges in?

My TBxW had awfully flat feet and that was what Leahurst suggested after he had a full lameness workout there.
 
his shoes dont look the right size to me, my horses shoes go right back to the heel, yours dont, hence why his heels look like they are collapsing which will put aot of stress down the tendons and his toes do look long, pm TheFarrier and ask him to take a look and see what he thinks.
 
I have to say I'm shocked.
The foot has no support under the heel whatsoever and frankly I'd be surprised if your horse WAS sound!!
I find vets reluctant to critise farriers, even very very poor shoeing; if I were you I would sack your farrier at once!
If he can't see anything wrong with that, or bother to do a better job, he shouldn't be a bl@@dy farrier!!!!
 
When shod your horse needs at least double clipped fronts, with the shoe being much wider to support the heels. The toe needs to come right back! Possibly wedges or bar shoes... not egg bars as these will not stay on long enough to help if you go this route the horse would have to live in over reach boots the last thing you need is the horse ripping shoes off.

The cracks are not as bad as you think but you need to get moisture into those feet, i recommend hoof heal to all my clients.

The hind feet are ok.

I have ans your other question about changing farriers btw!
 
The front feet are dire. The hinds, which aren't shod, are respectable. If your horse can cope with the hinds unshod, you should consider the same for the fronts, which is the surest way to return correct structure to feet in that condition.

However urgent the need to correct the structure, you can only hope to achieve it incrementally as changing the foot balance too drastically in one go will make your horse very lame.

I use a KC LaPierre barefoot trimmer and one of the methods they have available for horses that are unlikely to cope well with barefoot in the initial stages (e.g. TB types with long flat feet and underrun heels) is the Perfect Wear System which is a flexible wrap that fits round the rim and lower part of the hoof wall and really accelerates growth. Each application lasts about 3 weeks, but once the hoof has enough growth to work with the horse can then follow a standard barefoot conditioning programme. The conditioning work helps return the correct structure of the hoof just as much as the trim.

If you would be interested in this I can ask my DAEP to recommend an accredited DAEP in your area if you want.
 
Just wanted to say thank you to everyone who took the time and effort to reply to both my posts. I shall see what happens at vet tomorrow and make a decision from there - but you have all given me confidence and courage in my own conviction to state my case ....
 
Your poor horse. I don't know where to start, get a new farrier! Like someone else says, the shoes don't fit the feet, they should have some heel support and the toes need to come off. But it's no wonder he is lame with feet like that. On a positive note the back feet don't look as bad as the front.

Keep us posted on what happens and I hope you mange to get it sorted.
 
He has collapsed at the heels in front and needs a shoe that will support the heels. The shoe will need to extend out behind the heel to achieve this. Hind feet are ok ish

I would definitely find yourself another farrier or at least talk to the one you have. You may find that once he has a decent set of shoes on he will probably go sound.
 
i had a very sim sit u to u a couple of years ago. my horses feet were actually much flater and more splayed than urs (although not as under run). she had been suffering intermittent lamness and farrier insited it wasn't her feet vet had said it was x rayed showed her poor balance (she does naturally have shocking feet, far to big for her!) farrier still said nothing more could be done. cut long story short after 10months and lots of xray and vet visits all confermed further detirioation to her feet then had remideal shoeing by vets farrier and then changed mine toa lovley farrier she hasn't had the same sorts of problems.
I would really change now as it may well save you the problems i had and it may prolng the soundness of your horse.
gd luck
 
Yes, your horse has collpased heels and the shoe does not offer enough support for the heels, they are too short. However i personally think that the hoof pastern axis isnt that bad and for a horse that needs shoeing there is not excessive growth. I personlly would shorten the shoeing interval. The horse needs shoeing now, another week is too long. So your shoeing interval should be 5 weeks not 61/2 weeks.

I suspect that although the heels are seriously collapsed there will be a limit to what can be done due to the horses conformation. In the second picture it looks like the pasterns arent underneath the rest of the limb, hence the feet arent and the heels have a tendency to collapse. If you look from the side then the foot should look like it is supporting the leg, it is hard to tell from just one picture of the lower leg but i very much doubt your horses foot is under its leg. You should be able to draw a line down the centre of the bones in the leg and the feet should be on the end of that line. it looks like your horse has feet in front of the line.

An x ray will tell you how much you can take the toe back but you are definately doing the right thing getting the vet to have a look.
Good luck
 
Oh [****].

I'd definately be getting a new farrier - make sure it's a bloody good one - & giving him x-rays to work from. Can your vet recommend anyone?
 
Sorry I am no expert but the shoes look too short and his heels look collapsed.
If he is TB then the cracks are minimal and I would not worry about them but overall I would be concerned that he is heading for problems especially if you think his feet look worse.
Collapsed heels and long toes (which I "think" he has - as I said I am no expert) will lead to ligament problems and joint problems.
I would be looking around for another farrier. What does your vet say?
ETS I have just read the rest of these posts - so definitely get another farrier and good luck.
 
He has defo got a collapsed heal, one of my girls had v flat feet + collapsed heals all the farriers ive had really dislike putting in heal lifters but her feet are pretty good now, get a new farrier as quick as poss. I know of a few v good ones in yur area
 
Agree with above - but I'd definately have the farrier shot!!!! Have not seen anything as bad as that for quite a while now! Your horse needs more support behind, which may involve wearing over reach boots to stop him/her treading on the bar that overlaps the heel and ultimately pulling off the shoe! Change your farrier!!!
 
my horse is flat footed so my farrier cuts him short on the toe to bring his heels up. I thought the sho looks small and my farrier puts backs shoes on my boys front coz there is to clips it hold the hoof with more surport!
 
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