Gastric Care of your horse, something you worry about? Help very much appreciated!

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KatB

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I've put it in here, as it's most relevant to competition horses I feel!

It's thought that upto 60% of competition horses have some sort of gastric problems due to a high grain diet/stress of travelling/competing/restricted forage due to weight management. Apparently SJers can suffer from ulcers just due to "splash" damage when jumping fences, without the stress of bein unde rthe same fitness regime/hard feed regime as some high level eventers... so, with this in mind...

Is this something you consciously make an effort to make sure is looked after?

If so, what do you do to keep your horse feeling as comfortable/healthy in this area as possible?

Do you feed any products in relation to this? If so what? And how much do you pay?

Would you consider feeding something to help with this if you don't already?

What are your main concerns in this area?

As many answers as possible would be HUGELY helpful! :D Thanks!
 
I'm lucky in that my horse has always been a poor doer and the one thing that kept his weight on was constant access to forage. A belly constantly full or grass and hay is also less likely to suffer with ulcers. He was behaving oddly once and we had him scoped for ulcers - vet said he'd never seen such a healthy stomach.
 
Precisely why my horse lives out. She used to show all the signs of problems and didnt eat well when in so got very skinny. At that time she was on probiotics and balancers etc and I tried to keep the diet fibre based. Since living out full time she's a completely different horse and this is the first year she's actually ever been fat :)
 
i do consider it, and feed a very low grain (or no grain) diet to most of my horses. they get Happy Hoof, plus Alfa A if more energy required. Only if they're 'flat' do they get any grain at all.
they also get as much turnout as possible for 2/3 of the year, and adlib forage unless they are fatties.
i have Coligone here if one shows any signs of discomfort.
ditto, Slippery Elm powder.
if i suspect anything major i get the horse 'scoped.
after SC's experiences, I will now give a small roughage, alfa-a ish, feed before xc (about an hour before iirc, i'll check first) to limit splashing.
i'd be interested in a product that was specifically for gastric health...
 
Possibly - suspect my ex-racehorse has them, but cant get her to the vets as my trailer has been off the road for a while.

Is out, has access to grass and company, but likes windsucking.
 
Im not sure if you read my mares story on here, she always had access to fibre, however started to not feel right jumping and kept getting really mild colic, so I decided to push for her to be scoped, and she had grade 3/4 ulcers, she had lost no condition and had no major signs of ulcers, So with that in mind

Is this something you consciously make an effort to make sure is looked after?
YES SHE FEELS SO DIFFERENT NOW

If so, what do you do to keep your horse feeling as comfortable/healthy in this area as possible?
CONSTANT ACCESS TO FIBRE. FEED 30 MINS BEFORE EXERCISE (HIGH FIBRE, SUGAR BEET USUALLY)


Do you feed any products in relation to this? If so what? And how much do you pay?
FEED RAPE SEED OIL, ULCER CALM, LETHICIN, MINT, and PINK POWDER X2 DAILY, PROBABLY COSTS ME ABOUT £40 a month ish, (in my opinion its the lethicin and calcium carbonate which do the trick so may scale down to this, and the research which has been done)

Would you consider feeding something to help with this if you don't already?

What are your main concerns in this area?
THAT MY MARE IS IN DISCOMFORT, AND DOES NOT PERFORM TO HER BEST
 
I've just changed the management of my youngster for this very reason. He is now out 24/7, and I am supplementing his feed with Gastro Care.
 
Its not something i really thought about and till recently Articfox on here did a talk on gastric ulcers and now i never leave my boys without anything to eat, they always have a haynet to graze on!! I also feed no grain.
 
Yes definitly!

Having had my last mare PTS due to digestive problems (actually caused my worm damage but anyway), I am pretty much paranoid about it.

Looking back I can see that my mares 'stressy' behaviour could have well been down to constant low grade pain. She couldn't jump oxers, she was a brave little thing but if a fence was too wide she had to stop as she couldn't stretch over it. She always had a pot bellied look, especially when on rich grass or feeds that were digested too fast. She was filthy in the stable.

I'm now paranoid about my gelding. He is not messy like my mare but he can get loose droppings if his feed/grass changes. I also get paranoid he has a pot bellie too!

I could drive myself mad worrying about old worm damage, ulcers, feed intolerances.

Instead I just try to feed him as naturally as possible. He only eats fibre based feeds. Mainly grass and haylage! Not the wet, smelly haylage either but the more fibrous haylage. Hay isn't enough to keep the weight on him in the winter.

I also feed feeds with a biotic or live yeast in it. I find this makes a big difference to sensitive tums. This is the main reason I'm feeding Allen and Page as the feed is fibre based but also has live yeast added to help digestibility.

At the moment he's having grass, fast fibre and a mineral lick. He's working twice a day and I'm trying to build up his fitness for his first ODE. He looks really good and his tummy doesn't look too bloated at the moment. He's not a stressy horse really so that's good.

I've already planned what I'm feeding for the winter. He loves the FF so I'll keep him on that but I'll add readigrass and omega 3 oils to give him a bit more protein and calories without starch or sugar.

I think I would always feed biotics now to a TB type horse, especially one that's been in racing or a horse that competes or is travelling a lot.

I also like soaking the FF, I make it sloppy so I feel good that he is being rehydrated. Especially in this warm weather where he is sweating a lot. In the winter I worried that he wasn't getting enough water with the snow and that can cause colic too!

I bet you wished you hadn't asked now lol.

Oh also if I want to ride in the am and he's been in all night and finished his hay (he usually has stuff left over). I let him munch on a haynet while I'm tacking up to line his stomach ready for work so the stomach acids don't splash around! Of course he gets his hard feed after, even though it's all fibre anyway :p.
 
Is this something you consciously make an effort to make sure is looked after?

Yes. I've previously had a cribber so am aware of ulcers.

If so, what do you do to keep your horse feeling as comfortable/healthy in this area as possible?

Feed a sugar free (ie no molassed chaffs, mixes or cubes), cereal free and high fibre diet as much as possible. Always have forage available and feed half a scoop of unmollassed chaff 1/2hr before exercise.Regular massages as there are ulcer "hot spots" over the lumber area.

Do you feed any products in relation to this? If so what? And how much do you pay?

Just going to try Nurtiscience Gastrocare. Would just pay what it costs but do google to look for the best price of a specific product. Cheapest I've found is £44 for 1.8kg but also seen it for £58.

Would you consider feeding something to help with this if you don't already?.

Just about to start feeding Gastrocare. My horse is an ex-racer but doesn't display any symptoms; he's in good condition, is a good doer and isn't stressy. He doesn't crib or windsuck but he is out of racing and he did react when massaged on Wednesday.

What are your main concerns in this area?

Not sure how to word this but I'll give it a bash! My concerns are that he has them and is umcomfortable. I would worry that anything lurking would get worse and affect his well being. If he responds to the Gastrocare I'll speak to my vet about how to proceed. To me it means that there was something and I'll look to my vet to advise whether he should be scoped or if he's improved to simply continue on a maintenance does. Ditto if he doesn't improve I guess as it may mean there wasn't anything there or that the supplement isn't effective in his case. As there are no symptoms other than the reactive spots I'll err on the side of caution.
 
I have to be hugely careful about this with my Intermediate gelding, as he has had many gastric problems over the years, including ulcers, and used to suffer frequent bouts of colic before I got him.

Firstly, he gets turned out on good grass from 6am until 6pm. He gets adlib, quality grass hay when he's in, and he gets 3 small feeds a day of readi grass (instead of chaff which is often coated in molasses) and speedi beet - all very sloppy. I try to fill him up mostly on the forage! I always take care to put warm water in his water bucket as he reacts badly to cold water - in the winter I have to make a lot of effort to keep his field troughs un-iced! I give him the supplement NAF Thrive, which my vet reccommended.

Luckily he's a high-energy ex-racer so I don't have to worry too much about feeding for energy, and can therefore cut out all the mix and sugars. He gets by on the speedi-beet only, which is 95% free of sugars.
 
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Well its never concerned me up till now because my horses have always been thoroughbreds, theyve had as much grass as they want, as much hay as they want, adlib, even if it means they need nearly a bale of hay a night, and they have always been fed high fibre diet I make a concious effort not to feed any starchy feeds.

However the recent acquisition is a right old fatty and it is a nightmare trying to manage him. If he's in at night I just know that he;s finished his haynet by 7pm and will be standing in all night with no hay which just gives me nightmares because my absolute pet hate is to see horses standing in their stables for hours on end with no food. But what do I do? He cant have more hay as he will expand like a house.
If I leave him out in bad weather he has a tantrum and starts kicking fences down and kicking water troughs and galloping about as he gets so bored if he has nothing to occupy him.

Also if I turn him out in starvation paddocks he quickly gets bored with no food, and again has tantrums and the whole paddock wrecking thing starts all over again.

He's really grumpy in the stable so I do strongly suspect theres some degree of gastric pain there but how would I ever manage it to make it better if he literally cant have 24 hour access to fibre?
 
Seabiscuit I'd reccommend double, triple, Quadruple haynetting if you have too!! I too hate seeing horses stood for hours without forage, and even if you make it that he can only get a few mouthfuls an hour then it's better than scoffing it and then having nothing.
 
Ooh Quadruple haynetting would be an idea!! He currently has a double haynet and devours that within a few hours. I could certainly try with 4 haynets...
 
My guy lives out 24/7 and gets heaps of hay if he's locked up for any reason.
His diet is mostly fibre, he gets half a scoop of grain to two scoops of chaff most feeds. If he's worked hard he gets more and I use sugarbeet if I'm worried he hasn't drunk enough. I feed a probiotic each feed.
He coughs if he has hay right before he is worked, but I might start giving a small sugarbeet/chaff feed before work after reading some of the posts here
 
I never thought about gastric health until my mare started displaying syptoms. She was scoped and had developed grade 2/3 ulcers. I completely changed her management to make her life less stressy by increasing her turnout, (though she still in at night). She has 3 smaller feeds a day consisting of Hi Fi, Pure Feed Balancer and Alfa Beet. Supplement wise, she gets Feedmark Steady Up Advance, also their Ulcer Calm and Protexin Digestive supplement. She has either hay or grass 24/7, I feed her a scoop of Hi Fi before I ride and has just finished a course of Gastro Gard. The difference in her has been vast and I'll keep her this way for the forseeable future. HTH. x
 
Ever since I went to a lecture several years ago about feeding the competition horse and ulcers I have been very conscious about what I feed and what regime I use. I'm obsessed about horses having enough hay to last the day/night to the extent that some friends call me a 'feeder' ;) I have a fatty that I have to watch weight wise and I've been stricter this year than others - so yes the ulcer issue is never far from my mind. I read a book several years ago that was written from the horses perspective - ok so it was a bit cheesy - but there was a bit where the horse described the constant burning in his stomach and nothing he did eased it - it really resonated with me.

As you know I feed a very high fibre feed which is low in starch but I would be interested in a product that I could use as a supplement - for peace of mind as much as anything and also so I could rule out ulcers when we have performance issues!
 
I am paranoid about it as I have a rescue horse. He is a bit girthy at the moment but I have stopped doing them as tight which has helped and he shows no other symptoms. He is out 24/7 and I will not feed any cereals. I fed a probiotic when I first had him but it made no difference. I now feed oil for energy to avoid cereals. In winter they are out all day and in at night with ad lib hay. I feed limestone flour in the winter as well.
When the horse can actually go faster than a mild canter on xc then I will feed chaff 30 mins before xc to stop splash ulcers.

I like the look of Pure Feed and think I might look at it in the winter as they are only down the road from me. Its hard to find chaff which is unmolassed but instead has oil. Even better would be an unmollased alfa A with just oil!!
 
My lad has a vice, and is hard to keep weight on at any rate in the stable. He fleshes well when on his holidays in the field. I am fairly sure his issues are down to ulcers. I now use Equine America U Guard in his feed, a little pink powder and let him in the field (weather permitting) if I can for a couple of hours. My Dad insists on sending bags of nice sweet hay to the yard for him to pick at. Since implementing the above, he seems more content and has filled out a bit.
 
I loved my Nutrition lectures at Uni, so feeding is something I am really interested in (myself as well as the horses ;)) However, whilst I am mindful of gastric care, it's not something I obsessed about. Mainly because I don't feel it's something I need to be obsessed about, both my horse are fed exclusively on forage, to the point they can't physically shovel anymore down their neck!
Mally may get some form of oil supplement during the winter if I feel she needs a bit of extra and Henry will get some type of conditioning/veteran feed, but both will still be on very low starch diets.
I have to say, I am bored senseless by 'supplements', I'd rather by a bag of balancer that does everything in one mugful. There is only one supplement I feed, because having tried just about every other option, that is the only one I feel works!
 
I know a lot of people have said about having horses out as much as possible and on "good" grazing but horses aren't really designed to eat rye grass. I know this is practically the only grass type available on livery yards but do you think that this has an effect on the digestive system?

I've also started reading and learning about "leaky gut syndrome" but still don't know that much about it.

Does anyone on here have any knowledge/experience/thoughts on the effects of grass on the digestive system and "leaky gut syndrome" (could this be mistaken for ulcers or is it a side effect of ulcers?)? Sorry if this is a hi-jack...hopefully its in the same vein.

Thank you in advance
 
No idea TPO but what I will say is my late mares poorly digestive system meant she really couldn't cope with rich spring grass. It was always during the flush in spring and autumn that she would get the colic.
I think that grass can be too good. That's why I continue to feed a fibre based feed throughout the summer even though my horse doesn't need the condition, my theory being that it helps to slow the passage of grass through the digestive system.
It's quite amusing looking in our corner of the feed room, myself and my mum have bags of fibre feed marketed at fat ponies and rest to light work for our busy TB's but that's all I dare feed and tbh they don't seem to need any more!
 
I feed a gastric supplement to my TB and she has fairly high fibre/oil based hard feeds. I did mention to my vet of my concern about Gastric Ulcers (as I am aware that she will finish her hay overnight by about midnight - it is double netted - and be left for approx 6 hours with nothing to eat), he however felt that as she displayed no obvious symptons of having discomfort from ulcers it was not necessary to scope her. He said that it was likely that many horses may have some form of ulcers, albeit small, but that it wouldn't necessary cause them any problems. I must admit, I don't want to look for problems and am happy to let sleeping dogs lie. (I will however triple net her hay from tomorrow!!)
 
Its something I am aware of but I wouldn't say it is a concern to me as my horses are not affected.

I wouldn't feed a supplement just for the sake of it so would only feed a product for ulcers if my horse was scoped and found to have an issue- imo, a lot of feed companies rely on scare-mongering to get people to buy products that are just not necessary for their horse.
 
Fairy sure CS suffered with them.
He was always VERY behind the leg and humpy/bucky for first 5 mins of work, no other symptoms, not girthy, no windsucking etc and for a TB is a good doer.
tried him on coligone and it made an instant differance, he had the full dose for a month, half a dose for a month and is now on 1/4 dose (and gettting the same relief/results), so i cant imagine they were VERY bad, but certainly did affect him.he is now forward from word go and happier with the leg.

am considering trying Bruce on it, as although not displaying any symptoms, he is a huge worrier, and i wonder if he might be suffering in silence.

would def be interested in a specific supplement,although i guess the coligone does the job.
 
All very interesting, thanks guys! Interesting to know how many people are concerned about it...

Re. pre/probiotics included in feeds, it will be interesting to see when the new feed regs come out later this year, how much the manufacterers put in, and whether it is really enough to have an impact.... Pre and Probiotics will also only help with digestion (which is a good thing!), but unless they have antacids in them, they won't help to repair or sooth damage already done, or neutralise a very acidic environment... :)

The other thing is peoples obsession with mollassed feeds. Most mollassed feed is still significantly lower in sugar than grass, and I would bet most horses are still out grazing...! Mollasses is used in feeds as a binder, so will be in most feeds in small amount, but in most cases wouldn't have much impact.

Obviously high fibre feed is the way forward, and making sure the horse always has something in it's stomach, especially before work to prevent acid splashes. It is worth remembering that haylage can be quite acidic, so that in cases feeding something with antacid properties can be very beneficial (hence NAF releasing a Haylage balancer ;) )
 
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