German Shepherds

orionstar

orionstar

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I know we have a knowledgable bunch on here, so someone please enlighten me as to why they are built/bred to look like that (Crufts) and how their way of going helps them do the job they were bred for. I am having a debate (well not really, dont like to comment before being informed of the why's and wherefores). Thanks in advance!
 
Also watching crufts and wondering same. I think they look deformed with a back end at least two sizes too small for their front ends.
 
As I said on the other thread just started in Club House. I don't find it aesthetically pleasing but each to their own.
 
I was just about to ask the same thing! It's just been pulled in third and I was wikipediaing the breed and apparently hip dysplasia is a fault... So why are they achieving such good results?
 
I can't believe that these dogs are being shown and being placed with such deformed back ends. I saw a clip of a GSD in the Crufts Final in the 1980s the other day and it looked like a completely different breed!
 
Wow,what a surprising thread!;) I'm not going to go into great details, just search the similar threads last year, but this dog does not have hd. He has a german A stamp for his hips, he also has the high working qualifications. I was there today and saw him win his class, from a purely biased view, I actually preferred the dog who was 3rd, my Freya's dad. The winning dog was a little heavy in condition imo, but no one who knows the breed can deny he is an excellent specimen. At one point he was standing unposed at the side of the ring and his backline was absolutely level. Due to a last minute change in judge there was a mixture of types of GSD being shown, and there were quite a few of the "old fashioned" type who were not only very unsound, but I saw more than one which was nervous, something I had hoped would no longer be seen in the ring.
 
MM I'm trying to understand your post, are you saying that when the dog is standing un posed he has a level backline, and they are just made to stand like this for the judge?
 
Orionstar....yes. Seen it many a time. Friend has done it with her gsd to prove a point before now. Show pose/walk and normal are two very different things.
 
The breed standard calls for the topline to fall away from wither to croup so when they stand posed that is what they are supposed to show. When I said he was standing with a level backline I meant without the slight lift which he can show in movement when he is being held back. Bear in mind when GSDs are being shown at proper shows for the breed they are sometimes trotted for up to an hour , and this includes movement running free off the lead alongside the handler. Compare this with Crufts, where in the breed ring the class did 2 laps of a ring probably a fifth the size of the ring they are used to, is it any wonder the true movement of the dog isn't reallys een.
 
That has gone some way to explain MM thank you, but OH has just brought up the puppy we met at the market last year, I went in for a cuddle and the owner spent 10 minutes chatting to us about the breeding, then he walked away, and it wobbled from side to side that much it took out a CD stand with it's back end, so I'm now back to square one with the "discussion".
 
Depends how old the pup was. If they have a lot of hind angulation then they can be quite wobbly and unsound as babies. My Evie was horrendously cow hocked as a pup, as a mature adult she is very sound and has an excellent hip score.
 
Elmo, the dog on the telly this evening, does NOT have hip dysplasia. He DOES have working qualifications and a breed survey, to get that the dog has to complete tracking, obedience and manwork exercises and do a 20k endurance test off a bike.
But don't let the facts get in the way of a good rant :)

The gait is supposed to be long an low, the breed was created to act as a 'mobile fence' to keep sheep on grass/off crops and wolves and thieves away, moving up and down all day so it has to be a long, low, ground covering, economical gait. The slope to the croup helps the dog power through from the rear.

If you really want I can post pics of Elmo doing bitework at the German Sieger show a few years ago.

I've never had a GSD with hip dysplasia. There are people on here with labs and spaniels with hip dysplasia, is it because of their backs which I assume are 'straight'? Their way of going?
 
hamper05 said:
I can't believe that these dogs are being shown and being placed with such deformed back ends. I saw a clip of a GSD in the Crufts Final in the 1980s the other day and it looked like a completely different breed!
Click to expand...

That bitch was from lines known to throw weak tempers and epilepsy.
But as long as she was aesthetically pleasing to you :)
 
As I understand it, the breed standards are suppose to define how a dog should be built to do the job it was originally created to do. So how come the show winners can't do it?

I don't know a lot about the history of GSDs but I understand that before they could do health checks by x-ray etc., they'd give a practical test, for example, take the dog on a 20 mile run and see how it coped.....:eek:
 
Could the GSD aficionados please step away from this thread, all posters with queries should be clearly directed to the 'forum search' button which will reveal the same conversation on at least an annual basis ;)

I just got blocked by someone on FB because I said I wanted the KC Spaniel to go BIS :rolleyes: Obviously not a popular choice there then :p
 
Dry Rot they still do the test you are talking about, gaiting a dog with a bicycle. However, it is not a guarantee of good hips, I had a bitch with atrocious hips who could have done that easily.
Picklenash, I too suggested people used the search button, daughter spotted tonights GSD threads and suggested I didn't come on here.:p
 
Dry Rot, Elmo has passed his AD (the endurance test).
But it is sensible to do the x-rays first, these days :p
It's 20k off a bike.

I was officiating at one in 2011 with ten dogs, with a 50/50 split of working and show bred dogs, all passed.
 
Picklenash said:
Could the GSD aficionados please step away from this thread, all posters with queries should be clearly directed to the 'forum search' button which will reveal the same conversation on at least an annual basis ;)

I just got blocked by someone on FB because I said I wanted the KC Spaniel to go BIS :rolleyes: Obviously not a popular choice there then :p
Click to expand...

SQUISHY BRAINS! SQUISHY BRAINS!!
 
CaveCanem said:
Elmo, the dog on the telly this evening, does NOT have hip dysplasia. He DOES have working qualifications and a breed survey, to get that the dog has to complete tracking, obedience and manwork exercises and do a 20k endurance test off a bike.
But don't let the facts get in the way of a good rant :)

The gait is supposed to be long an low, the breed was created to act as a 'mobile fence' to keep sheep on grass/off crops and wolves and thieves away, moving up and down all day so it has to be a long, low, ground covering, economical gait. The slope to the croup helps the dog power through from the rear.

If you really want I can post pics of Elmo doing bitework at the German Sieger show a few years ago.

I've never had a GSD with hip dysplasia. There are people on here with labs and spaniels with hip dysplasia, is it because of their backs which I assume are 'straight'? Their way of going?
Click to expand...

OOh yes please..I LOVE watching bitework..I get a sneaky free viewing when the police train every other week near my house..you see i always 'lose' my hands free when i see them & have to pull over (till they have finnished) so I'm legal..no one usually phones..but its better to be safe..:p:D

MM..I'll let you off..;)
 
And every year you must manage to be just as rude as this year, leaving people to wonder exactly the same questions, thanks for the informative insight into the breed.
 
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