Getting a backward thinking youngster thinking forward

[Mavis007]

Fun rides definitely helped mine think forwards together with some little cross country schooling. Make sure you use some pole work and variety in your schooling sessions and finish before he is tired. Does he enjoy jumping? If some popping a little fence every so often if he feels a bit jaded might keep his interest? I really like Carl Hester's approach of: if they don't go off a light leg aid, take both legs off and give a big kick with no rein contact to confuse them and then praise for going forwards! After a while you just have to take your leg off a bit and you're going forwards I find it really hard to be seriously disciplined to NOT keep kicking, and just ensure they respond to a light leg aid then keep your leg gently there until you want something else- but it is definitely worth being very strict about in the long term...

 

[Ferdinase514]

Bonjour Twiglet

All your work in the school has to be about going forwards. You do not even worry about what is happening in the front end until they are really sharp off your leg and know what forwards means. This has to be doing everything. Two schooling whips can be hugely beneficial as you can be quick with them if they ignore the leg. I ask with my legs and if I get no reaction, then the schooling whips come into action.
I never worry about how much canter they do but that it happens and I am not having to ride every inch to get it. As they get stronger and older I expect more.
With stuffy horses they will get galloped round the arena until they learn that go means go. It takes discipline from you but after a couple of weeks you will have a horse who is light off the leg and that will make all the difference in the long term.

Agree with LEC, this is what I have had to do with COB. I ride him with 2 whips in the school and works brilliantly. Have to ignore how unbalanced or giraffe like it all feels and just ride forwards all the time. Also, make sure not gripping with knees or thighs at all, as this will block all the energy created.

 

[Twiglet]

Agree with those who have said don't worry about the front end in the school just focus on getting him forwards and in front of the leg. do you have a trainer who can help? Also IDs are not always backwards thinking, mine is one of the sharpest most intelligent horses I have ever known (isn't always a good thing! Lol) what are his lines? Xx

Sorry didn't see this. Well he's ISH anyway - so a bit of everything. ID line is The Conquerer lines? Grandsire line is Dallas, so Selle Francais, and dam is pure TB, which I find so hard to believe - can't see an ounce of TB in this horse

I'm not worrying too much about the front end, although it does come quite easily once he's actually going forwards....it's just getting to that point!

 

[Twiglet]

When you say he is backwards thinking I assume you mean he evades and drops behind the tack so you can't ride him between hand and leg? I was interested in the fact he seemed to be worse with faster work. Try long reining and see if he works with a good strong contact.

We have a 5yr old 17.1 ISH who we bought for my husband and he is backwards thinking. When went back a few stages to long reining to fix some of his ground work we found he has been lunged/long reined to have no contact and be behind the tack. It is really no wonder he is stuffy and won't take a contact in canter due to the way he was broken. Most horses with this problem are at their worst in canter as the person who broke them got them to canter on the long reins by dropping the contact and sending them forwards rather than "supporting" into the canter. When you move to ridden work they drop behind the tack in canter and when you try to get them between hand and leg it is just not happening. He is already improving under saddle noticeably after 2 weeks of long reining and we have also changed his snaffle for a NS salex lozenge which seems to encourage him to take a contact and take you forwards.

Concentrate on lots of work getting him in front of your leg and less on anything else at the moment, you need to get him to understand that you want him forwards into your hands and that is good.

No, doesn't drop behind and evade....just puts minimum effort in and shuffles along, like it's all too much like hard work. I know he's been started really well, and he's happy to take a contact (when he's not staring at the trees/other horses/fairies), it's just a confidence thing I think.

I've not actually tried any lunging or long-reining with him yet - pure laziness on my part as haven't got round to sorting out a roller or finding my side reins. I will do it this weekend and see how he goes.

 

[Twiglet]

I think it's probably important to differentiate between 'forwards forwards forwards' and rushing? I know with my young horse I was advised to make sure he knew from a very early stage that go means go, but that doesn't mean we have to rush? I had def fallen into the trap of rushing him along a few months ago and my dressage instructor quickly stopped that - shouts of SLOW DOWN echoed across the yard! I was mistaking speed for impulsion and pushing him into the rhythm I need with my smaller horse. He's actually much better at a slower rhythm with plenty of connection between leg and hand to get him working over his back and using hindleg.
However if I ask, I expect him to respond, and have also been known to carry two schooling whips
Also echo those above re cantering out in company, initially following, then maybe side by side, then in front, then alone? And pairs HT and sponsored rides etc will help definately!

Yes, that's what we're aiming for at the moment, starting him off behind and then taking the lead. He is fantastic in company and has a really great forward canter, and brakes, which is a real novelty for me. I think pairs is the way forward for the time being at least....going to try some xc schooling in a few weeks with something speedy in front.

 

[Twiglet]

Fun rides definitely helped mine think forwards together with some little cross country schooling. Make sure you use some pole work and variety in your schooling sessions and finish before he is tired. Does he enjoy jumping? If some popping a little fence every so often if he feels a bit jaded might keep his interest? I really like Carl Hester's approach of: if they don't go off a light leg aid, take both legs off and give a big kick with no rein contact to confuse them and then praise for going forwards! After a while you just have to take your leg off a bit and you're going forwards I find it really hard to be seriously disciplined to NOT keep kicking, and just ensure they respond to a light leg aid then keep your leg gently there until you want something else- but it is definitely worth being very strict about in the long term...

He's not overly excited by jumping to be honest, he's happy enough but takes the approach he does to everything else in life....it's nice, just nothing to get out of bed for! I think he definitely needs a lot more impulsion in his flatwork to make jumping worthwhile.

 

[AmyMay]

How did you deal with youngsters who aren't as forward as others? He's not nappy or anything sinister, he's just quite backward at going forwards

New horse is a very chilled chap, albeit isn't enormously confident yet. Understandable as he's still quite a babyish 5, and has new owner, new yard etc.

You've given the reasons for his attitude in the second quote.

Therefore, time, getting to know and trust you, doing fun things in a group (hunting and fun rides) and allowing him time to mature without rushing him is the answer, I'd say.

 

[Twiglet]

Bonjour Twiglet



Agree with LEC, this is what I have had to do with COB. I ride him with 2 whips in the school and works brilliantly. Have to ignore how unbalanced or giraffe like it all feels and just ride forwards all the time. Also, make sure not gripping with knees or thighs at all, as this will block all the energy created.

I do think of him as a cob in a sports horse body! Have gone back to riding in spurs which seems to be helping a bit, especially in canter work.

 

[Twiglet]

You've given the reasons for his attitude in the second quote.

Therefore, time, getting to know and trust you, doing fun things in a group (hunting and fun rides) and allowing him time to mature without rushing him is the answer, I'd say.

Agreed, it is mainly a confidence thing, hence lots of hacking in company at the moment, and keeping the lone hacks (which I think are important for him not to rely on others) a bit shorter and more relaxed. Ironically, he's in demand at the yard as a babysitter for the more stressy horses, as he's so generally well behaved.