Getting a horse to work IN an outline..

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EquestrianFairy

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I have an 8yo who happily works in an outline when in walk.. However I cannot get him to do this in any other gait. He is like a giraffe when not in walk and I don't know how to help him?

I do not want to use anything to strap him down, I just need a helping hand on what I can do to help him?

Thanks
 
my instructor teaches riders to keep the leg on to ask them to move forward but keep your elbows by your side, dont allow forward movement from the elbow. When the horse accepts the bit and drops into an outline give a little double give on the bit to reward the horse.

Hope that makes sense :)
 
Have you had him checked over thoroughly? How are you getting him to work in an outline in walk? It will be very easy to fall in the trap of pulling the head in, rather than pushing him in to it with impulsion...you won't get away with it in any of the other gaits. I would get some lessons. If I may be candid and without causing offence I would suggest that if you are unsure what working in an outline really is and how it is achieved then you are not going to be best placed to achieve it without experienced help. For the long term health of your horse working in an outline is pivotal, but it must be achieved in the right way and I'm not overly sure you'll be able to do that just with some advice off an online forum.
 
*sucks air through teeth. bit like a builder does when you ask him for a quote*

Oh no, not a horse that can't work in an outline. Bin it. Get another one. It IS the end of the world.

Noooo not really :)

This is an easy, don't get worked up. Just remember to be as relaxed in trot as you are in walk. Pick up a tiny bit more contact and keep asking for acceptance of the bit - no need to keep arms by side just ask him to relax at first. he probably finds it hard and is anticipating a short rein... give a long rein a go, without giving up contact.

Just my opinion :D
 
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tallyho! said:
This is an easy, don't get worked up. Just remember to be as relaxed in trot as you are in walk. Pick up a tiny bit more contact and keep asking for acceptance of the bit - no need to keep arms by side just ask him to relax at first. he probably finds it hard and is anticipating a short rein... give a long rein a go, without giving up contact.

Just my opinion :D
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Yeah that! Works for my lad who is a serial nose poker outer! :o:p
 
tallyho! said:
*sucks air through teeth. bit like a builder does when you ask him for a quote*

Oh no, not a horse that can't work in an outline. Bin it. Get another one. It IS the end of the world.

Noooo not really :)

This is an easy, don't get worked up. Just remember to be as relaxed in trot as you are in walk. Pick up a tiny bit more contact and keep asking for acceptance of the bit - no need to keep arms by side just ask him to relax at first. he probably finds it hard and is anticipating a short rein... give a long rein a go, without giving up contact.

Just my opinion :D
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I agree with this. Forget where the head is - it will eventually relax. First you need to ensure the horse is going forwards - not rushing - just moving forwards in a relaxed, rhythmical pace. Then do lots of circles, spiralling in and out, but forget where the head is. Eventually your horse will begin to relax and carry himself properly. Also make sure that when you do the walk to trot transition you don't pull on the reins - allow the rein forwards while you go into trot, otherwise the horse gets mixed signals.
 
Holly Hocks said:
I agree with this. Forget where the head is - it will eventually relax. First you need to ensure the horse is going forwards - not rushing - just moving forwards in a relaxed, rhythmical pace. Then do lots of circles, spiralling in and out, but forget where the head is. Eventually your horse will begin to relax and carry himself properly. Also make sure that when you do the walk to trot transition you don't pull on the reins - allow the rein forwards while you go into trot, otherwise the horse gets mixed signals.
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:) like that... keep up the "support" though, don't just let him lollop around like a wet spaniel.

OP, find yourself a good old classical instructor in your area. You'll do well.
 
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tallyho! said:
*sucks air through teeth. bit like a builder does when you ask him for a quote*

Oh no, not a horse that can't work in an outline. Bin it. Get another one. It IS the end of the world.

Noooo not really :)

This is an easy, don't get worked up. Just remember to be as relaxed in trot as you are in walk. Pick up a tiny bit more contact and keep asking for acceptance of the bit - no need to keep arms by side just ask him to relax at first. he probably finds it hard and is anticipating a short rein... give a long rein a go, without giving up contact.

Just my opinion :D
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Hits the like button :D
 
Thanks all, Tallyho- I'll give it a go :D

We've had lessons before, the instructors seem to find it difficult also, one of them said he's just too nosy at his surroundings.
He will do small parts in trot- but it's almost like he gives up!

He's in good health, I'm meticulous about his back so he has a saddle/back check every 6 months and the usual teeth etc.
 
my ex racer is a bit like this he ccan walk in a lovely long and low outline which is great as he is starting to build the correct muscles which now helps him in trot.
I tend to keep my hands low and slightly wider than normal (but thats a little bit due to him getting very tense if hands are raised!) I just work on having him relax trot round on a 20m circle using b and e as track points. keep a contact on the bit as they tend to seek it out then as soon as he gives give with the inside hand slightly.
However the other thing to consider which my instructor found when she rode him is if you dont keep his shoulders striaght and allow him to bend too much through his neck he will fall out through outside shoulder and then the head comes up. if his shoulders are kept straight he works very long and low and relaxed. I can ride him like this now basically on the buckle and he still goes. It is a case of keeping him just out of walk so nice and slow trot but using the leg to prevent shoulder falling out and keeping some contact.
Good luck- also agree have a lesson with someone who doesnt like gadgets. Where are you based?? My instructor has been great my ex racer now works long and low 99% of the time after only being in work 4months (inc 3weeks off) and he has never been in any gadget except very loose side reins on lunge to balance him when first started out.
 
Im not suggesting otherwise - just asking but are you being light enough on his back??

If you are landing heavily on his back or are a bit behind the movement he wont lift his back well to support you, make sure you are using your calves to lift and support you, maybe even stay out of the saddle to make it easier for him to lift his back and really ride inside leg to outside hand.

Then rise very lightly (I am sure you do this but just a suggestion)
Keep the outside hand steady and consistent and keep your leg on and think push sidewards, this will get the inside hind moving underneath and the back lifting up, the head coming down will be a natural by product of this, then when feeling comfortable you can ask quietly for a little inside bend.

Sometimes it just takes them a while to understand but being quick with your release of pressure is what will soften him.

Hope you get on ok and sorry if i have repeated what you already know and do!


xxxx
 
EquestrianFairy said:
I have an 8yo who happily works in an outline when in walk.. However I cannot get him to do this in any other gait. He is like a giraffe when not in walk and I don't know how to help him?

I do not want to use anything to strap him down, I just need a helping hand on what I can do to help him?

Thanks
Click to expand...

If your horse cannot work in an outline in a higher gait I am sorry to say that he is very likely NOT working correctly from behind even in walk. He is probably just bending his neck - very different from using his backend properly. I suggest if you have checked teeth and back (my mare went like a giraffe due to sharp hooks on teeth missed twice by dentist!) then get a good instructor. Get it right at walk every other gait will follow. It is hard for a horse initially to use it's backend, however once ingrained the muscles are there and it will become second nature. :)
 
Ditto those that have said find an instructor, and also those that have said lots of circles, serpentines, inside and outside flection etc. and I would also suggest lots of transitions up and down to really get him moving off your leg, ideally you'd want to be aiming for long and low to begin with, get him stretching over his back and slowly bring him back up into an outline.

Good luck!
 
Asking for some lateral movement on a circle, stepping under with the hind leg helps to develop muscle on the horses back and will bring its head down. Follow this up with combing the reins to encourage the horse to stretch forwards and down.
I googled "rein combing", to find a good way of describing it and came up with the following which describes both techniques far better than I could.

http://www.dharmahorse.com/Articles/Chron of the Horse Sept 88.pdf

I have been advocating combing the reins for years now and have never seen if fail to bring the horses head down - no force involved! You can do it throughout a horses training at the beginning and end of a schooling session to encourage stretching along the back and to build muscle.
 
Digger66 said:
Asking for some lateral movement on a circle, stepping under with the hind leg helps to develop muscle on the horses back and will bring its head down. Follow this up with combing the reins to encourage the horse to stretch forwards and down.
I googled "rein combing", to find a good way of describing it and came up with the following which describes both techniques far better than I could.

http://www.dharmahorse.com/Articles/Chron of the Horse Sept 88.pdf

I have been advocating combing the reins for years now and have never seen if fail to bring the horses head down - no force involved! You can do it throughout a horses training at the beginning and end of a schooling session to encourage stretching along the back and to build muscle.
Click to expand...

Very interesting - thanks for sharing :)
 
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