Getting weight on a Cushings Horse…Help/Advise from those in the Know

Eaglestone

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I have a 26 14.3h Welsh D x Hackney Cushings horse, that was diagnosed with this condition over 2 years ago and has been on Pergolide, ever since the diagnosis, and has been doing very well. In July his Pergolide was increased due to the Vet being concerned that he was now looking more like a ‘Cushings Pony’.
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I have been monitoring his weight and I have seen him drop off gradually, however this last week I can see his ribs more then ever, even through his extremely hairy coat and am now at my wits end.
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He has been in a 360g rug night and day throughout this cold spell and is always well rugged up.

He has never been a greedy horse and if he does not like the feed he would starve himself rather that eat, which has always been a concern.

He is turned out without grass, in his own little paddock with a Field Shelter, with his stable mate in the grass paddock next to him, for 10 hours a day, where he can nuzzle him over the fence, and has a constant supply of hay, but never eats it all up

For the first time, in the 17 years I have had him, he is on full rations of hard feed which is Spillers High Fibre Nuts and recently has started to be fussy over his High Fibre Nuts. He will only eat a little bit of Spillers Happy Hoof, which I use to mix his evening meal with supplements galore … Equisup, Newmarket Joint Supplement, CopperTritian and Cush X. The only additive that I have not tried is Oil, my Vet recommended this, however, for some reason I have not got round to this, which is not like me …. I think it’s because I know he will turn his nose up at it!

He will only eat a ‘nut’ type food so a nice mix to all of us, is cr*p to him!

He is hacked out quietly in walk, with a little tiny bit of trot, at the weekend so that he gets some exercise and he is very willing to go. This is for about 1 ½ hours on both days…. But I am now thinking that I should cut that out, but really want him to get a little bit of interest in his life. The problem here is that his stable mate needs exercise and normally the best solution is that they both go out together ….. to keep the peace all round!

Up until last week he was on 2005 hay which is soaked for 8 – 12 hours and therefore all the goodness has been sucked out of it. I have now only got 2007 hay, so I am hoping that will help, but am paranoid that it will set of Laminitis. He manages to eat up to approx 16lbs, of hay day (it I am lucky!), although he is loving the 2007 hay so much that this is increasing each day…..

I know that inevitable he will drop off as most horses do with age, however at this stage I think he is just not getting enough, although saying that he is a hard boy to get any extras down, as he knows when he has had enough.

The Vet is coming to see him on Wednesday and I will ask her to take some bloods, as the last lot was taken in July and I would like to see if the Copper Supplement has made any difference and how his Insulin and Glucose levels are.

I will try and contact Spillers for their recommendations.

I have spoken with the Laminitis Trust a long time ago, and may have another chat with them.

But I would be very interested to know how you peeps out there in the thick of it cope. I am interested to know what other owners, in this position do, feed wise, turnout wise and exercise wise and any other help and advise you can get me?
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Thank you for getting this far ……… from the owner of a very much loved old boy!
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I used to have a skinny Cushings pony and found that Happy Hoof was the best thing for her, but obviously that doesn't help you if he doesn't like it! I do know that Pergolide sometimes has the side effect of reduced appetite, although that is only meant to be temporary.

Have you tried soaking his High Fibre Cubes? Some horses find them more appetising like that. Another feed you can try is Dengie Alfa Beet which has plenty of calories and is still lami safe. You can try adding oil, but you are right that some horses will turn their noses up at it. An alternative would be a high fat feed like Bailey's Outshine - it's worth giving them a ring to see if it would be safe to feed to your horse.

ETA: The routine that worked for my pony was stabled most of the time (which she didn't mind) but with two hours turnout in the morning and another two hours in the afternoon.
 
My pony who is 20 odd now has cushings and had a bout of mild laminitis for the first time in 16 Years, caused by the Cushings. She unfortunately cant be ridden now however she is turned out as much as poss now the grass is better at this time of year, she is rugged up well and fed on Hifi Light, Spillers Hi-Fibre cubes and Linseed oil and loads of soaked hay. She has always been a real good doer however she lost a bit of weight a couple of months ago, however with upping the fibre and reintroducing the oil she is starting to look better again. I completely understand how difficult it is to work out what to feed them/exercise etc. Cushings is a horrible horrible disease and its a shame that theres no cure.
I saw the Cush-x on the internet the other day and wondered what it was like? .

I take it your horses teeth have been rasped/checked?

Sounds like you are doing all that you can! Good luck though.
 
We have a cusings and laminetic horse at my yard he has recently had some weight loss, he is now fed soaked fibre nuts sometimes with some carrots near the bottom to encourage him to eat it, he is gaining weight
 
Thank you TGM, K27 & Jessfulesdaworld for your advise which is so much appreciated
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Sounds like mashed up High Fibre nuts is good, however he is a stickler for crunchy nuts
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.... he used to love Acorns which are not good for him, and I still recall him chasing me around trying to pick them up before he got to them .... and then bang he went down with Laminitis 2 years ago
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It looks like I will need to introduce the Oil and I bet the Vet on Wednesday suggests this as well
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He is having his teeth looked at again on Weds ... he had power tool treatment earlier this year due to him not being able to chew left to right (or something like that!) and he was so much better ... he is a little parrot mouthed as well
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The Cush X was the first supplement I started him on as I believe that Angus Cactus alone is supposed to help Cushings ponies, so I dare not take him off it ... I know I am silly, but thats how some of us get, when we are worried mummies, isn't it!
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He does get some carrot and apples as his whole purpose of life is trying to find them mixed up in his tea and without that he would not have a life (in his mind, and I can read it
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) ... and I know there are lots of peeps out there, including my Vet now although originally she said they were ok, that say NO carrots or apples
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I am going to look up the Bailey Outshine and the Dengie Alpha Beet ..... not sure if this is like Speedybeet, which in his opinion is cr*p as it is not molassed!!!
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So I am now going to toddle off to have a look ..... and feeling much better that I am not alone in my quest thank you thank you
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I have an Icelandic - he was diagnosed with Cushings nearly two years ago after a bad bout of laminitis. Since being on Pergolide, he has not had laminitis (firmly touches wood). He cannot be ridden as he has slightly rotated pedal bones. Like your boy, he will not eat anything that resembles a mix! He is turned out on the grass in the day with his friends and is in at night. He has hi fibre nuts and dengie hi-fi, then he has 2007 hay as well as hi fibre haylage. As he has the classic Cushings coat, he is clipped and is well rugged. He goes out every day unless there is a frost - this was the cause of his last bout of laminitis, so he stays in when the grass is frosty.
 
Hi JinlgeJangle
Thank you for your advise following your experience, and I am sorry that you have not been able to ride your horse since, I now think myself so very lucky that I have had the chance to ride him again, as he also had 10 degrees rotation of the pedal bone, but with good farriery we got him through it, even though I knew it was touch and go!
Looks like I am the only one toooooooo frightened to turn out on grass. He gets 1/2 hour to hour a day, unless there has been a frost, followed by sunshine. He gets so excited about the grass and bounces up and down and squeals and gallops off, and I am sure if he had more time at grass he would improve 100%. However following a scare in July when he had another suspected bout of Laminitis, I took him off the grass, until later in the year as my Vet said unless I muzzled him then I should not turn him out on it. And as I did not want to go against her advise when he did not like the muzzle ... he just stood still or mooched around trying to make it work for him, I gave up, as I knew he would starve himself rather than struggle with it!

The same Vet is coming on Wednesday so I will see what she has to say as well as hearing all HHO friendly replies and support.
Thank you all again.
 
Do get his teeth checked. I had a cushings pony, but was lucky with his weight. My friends pony though also had cushings and looked like a toast rack, when I first knew him. It turned out he had a rotten tooth which was removed and had also lost a few other teeth. My friend started soaking the nuts as others have suggested and instead of feeding hay, she feed happy hoof. You may have to switch chaff from time to time if he gets a bit finicky and bored of it. The change in her pony was quite incredible.
Watch out with the frosts that we are having as this can often bring on Laminitis I always found this time of year the worst for my pony and laminitis.
 
I have an ex lami pony and he's on a low starch diet, the woman at my feedshop who also has an ex-lami and cushings horse advised me to start feeding copra meal as thats what hers get. You have to soak it for an hour before feeding (I do mine the night before) its a kind of powder, a bit like bran and once soaked becomes a mash type substance. Its economical because 3/4 of powder feeds mine for 2 days (1/2 scoop twice a day) and he's putting some weight back on. It also has absolute minimal starch levels.
 
My friend has a 30yo pony with cushing and she had a bad colic attack/op a few years ago so is on a high fibre diet. She is fed Green Valley (I think) golden nuggets that are soaked for a few hours, high fibre cubes and I think possible Suregrow as a balancer. She is out during the day and in at night. She is fed haylage but had to have a tooth out earlier this year so I think it is balling up in her mouth so she is getting a bucket/tub of readi-grass in with her. This mare got very "down" on pergolide...

I also know of someone else on a different forum who fed their cushing's pony Monk's Pepper. I think it is available from most health stores and it made a big difference.

Just noticed someone mentioned Copra. I'd never heard of it before but it was fed to the horses on the station I worked on in Australia and it works wonder. It was in the northern territory so no grazing and just red dust and the horses done really well on just a tiny bit of it as it expands so much when soaked.

Good Luck
 
Once again thank you all for your help and advice
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My Vet has once again suggested that I start him on Oil, either Corn Oil or Linseed Oil .... so I will ensure that I get him on that .... she was also not concerned about his weight, and thought he was ok, but alas I do worry about him, as in my minds eye he is as he was as a 10 year old
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His teeth were fine, so I will continue to molly coddly him and hope that he continues to thrive
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We have a cushings pony on the yard. She was only disagnosed this autumn (although I had been saying it all year) and she is in foal. She has been put on pergolide and luckily loves her food so no problem with her weight. She has had quite a period of box rest after the laminitus and is full of beans and loving going out each day in the fatties paddock.
She is only 17 but looks older. She still gets cold sweats quite often - is that a usual sympthom of Cushings?
 
Volatis
I had never thought of a Cushings horse being in foal, it's something that never crossed my mind
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My old boy was on box rest for 5 months with the Laminitis and continued for months to have sweats, but just between his hind legs ... Vet said it was due to the Cushings .... the horse not being able to control temperatures I suppose. However I feel that it was due to him being in pain (sorry
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) as once I felt he was not 'feeling' his feet so much and he was off the Danilon (Bute equivalent) he has not (touch big trees!!!) sweated any more, even when unclipped
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I am no expert, however I would be rather concerned about hormone levels etc all up and down (even when taking Pergolide to try and sort everything out) and causing problems controlling the Laminitis and also the risk that horses have when they foal, as I think the problem with not getting rid of the afterbirth straight away can bring on Laminitis, so hope she does not have this added problem .... hopefully someone else knowledgeable (sp)on HHO can correct me
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I wish your friend so much luck and please let us know how it goes, as this must be quite an unusual scererio
 
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