Goodbye to beaglers[BD]

[TheoryX1]

Oh FGS! It's all about personal choice. Health and Safety is the ugly child of the insurance companies and doesn't actually make you healthy or safe, probably less so as people rely on their equipment rather than their riding. Does anybody know what the riding-related accident statistics are for somewhere like Germany where most people ride without a hat? Bet they're no worse!

Oh FGS how would your family or children (if you have any feel) if you exercised your 'personal choice', rode in a totally ineffective piece of riding kit, ie a beagler, had an accident, injured yourself, which included brain damage, which left you disabled or even worse, in a vegetative stage? If you had been wearing a properly fitting riding hat at the time, and this could have been avoided if you had been wearing it - how would that make them feel? Cortez, I dont know you, dont have any issues with you but this is totally crass and idiotic. Just because most people in Germany ride without a hat, does it make it right?

As I stated earlier in this thread, my daughter would have been killed earlier on ths year if she had not been wearing one of the best protective hats on the market (a HS1), granted she was riding xc on a BE Novice course, but she could so easily have fallen in our arena. Who knows?

I really dont subscribe to the 'Personal choice' theory. If you dont look after your own heads by wearing proper headgear then I think you are being selfish to your families. After all, its them who have to care for you if you have an avoidable accident which causes brain damage, its up to the NHS to care for you and our benefits system to pay for you as you wont be able to pay for yourself. I have to stop now, I am getting very angry.

 

[shokkyy]

It's my head, I'm a grown up person and I object to being told what I have to wear when I'm riding my own horse in my own time at my own expense. I don't prefer to wear a beagler because of looks, I prefer it because it's considerably more light and comfortable than any of the bulky and heavy safety helmets on the market, particularly in hot weather. It's my head and it should be my choice.

Only a matter of time before the nannies start trying to force everybody to wear body protectors every time they so much as sit on a horse.

 

[kit279]

Out of curiosity, do the people on here who feel very strongly that what hat they wear should be their choice - do they feel that wearing seat-belts should be their choice also? Incidentally, the cost of ITU is £2000 a day. If the NHS didn't exist, I guarantee most folks would wear a crash hat

 

[georgiegirl]

It's my head, I'm a grown up person and I object to being told what I have to wear when I'm riding my own horse in my own time at my own expense. I don't prefer to wear a beagler because of looks, I prefer it because it's considerably more light and comfortable than any of the bulky and heavy safety helmets on the market, particularly in hot weather. It's my head and it should be my choice.

Only a matter of time before the nannies start trying to force everybody to wear body protectors every time they so much as sit on a horse.

Oh for gods sake I have never heard anything so silly in my life!

Yes it is your choice, do what you want at home, no one cares.

But when competing there are RULES to abide by so you have no choice but to follow them. It might be some peoples choice to go out competing in a gimp mask and a tutu....doesnt mean they can.

It has come full circle from back in the 60's when people went eventing hatless and the upset that skull caps caused. No one gives it a second thought now.......

(apologies for my rant but it really gets my goat when people moan about things like this because 'their hair might get sweaty...' plus my large glass of pimms has fueled it tee hee!)

 

[Mavis007]

Thank goodness for that. I have less chance of having to help scrape someone else's brains off a fence when I compete BD. I have always worn a hat with harness for BD and have managed to win several novices and even a few elementary tests against those wearing beaglers- so I am sure the judges don't take any notice As many have said, it is not the person wearing the hat who necessarily has to face the consequences, it is those who have to scrape them from the floor, and most importantly their family and friends who may have to face the consequences of cleaning their arses for years to come And all horses can spook and slip, as we all know they are not machines...

 

[Dizzydusty]

It might be some peoples choice to go out competing in a gimp mask and a tutu....doesnt mean they can.

Now that did make me have a quiet giggle to myself!

I bought a beagler this year as we were showing at Hickstead and didn't to look 'different' from everyone else. Now personally I don't see what all the fuss is about and why the hell they cost so much money for something that is so flimsy! Mine is a charles owen. While I agree I did like the look it gave, I was really uncomfortable wearing it as I was so aware that this bit of velvet and fiberglass shell would no more offer me protection than get me to fly in the air if I decided to part company from my very on his toes cob.

I bought it also thinking I could wear it to dressage but typical, BD change the rules. And its highly unlikely we will ever do the commute down to Hickstead again!

Anyone want to buy a lovely, worn once, navy blue beagler, size 7 3/8??

Dizzy

 

[WoodfordFox]

I have noticed on the H&H feed from Burghley that Anna comments whenever someone enters the arena wearing a 'helmet' as she puts it. Don't know whether she means it in a positive or negative way...

 

[Wolfie]

Not being able to wear a beagler is not going to affect your performance or enjoyment and it is a sensible precaution to wear a hat. I wouldnt ride a motorbike withouth leathers/helmet same as i wouldnt ride a horse without a proper hat.

^^This.

 

[TheoryX1]

It's my head, I'm a grown up person and I object to being told what I have to wear when I'm riding my own horse in my own time at my own expense. I don't prefer to wear a beagler because of looks, I prefer it because it's considerably more light and comfortable than any of the bulky and heavy safety helmets on the market, particularly in hot weather. It's my head and it should be my choice.

Only a matter of time before the nannies start trying to force everybody to wear body protectors every time they so much as sit on a horse.

Another raving nutter who doesnt give a dam for their own personal safety, and does not care about their loved ones as well. Obviously doesnt give a dam about the burden they will place on the NHS and welfare benefits system (no I dont work for either of these bodies) if they have an accident while wearing their beagler.

 

[rhino]

I know this has been posted before but, for me at least, this explains exactly the importance of wearing a hat and the possible consequences of not... Even on a safe horse (I haven't fallen off mine in 11 years) and doing dressage. I applaud BD for their sensible and measured decision.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awJDYBhBPzk
(Courtney King Dye video)

 

[luce1]

Beaglers = UGLY

 

[NinjaPony]

About time too! I don't really like the look, and I am astounded (well actually, sadly not) that some people really care more about looking "nice" than their own head

 

[Dizzydusty]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awJDYBhBPzk
(Courtney King Dye video)[/QUOTE]

Does this not go to show how easily and accident can happen with devastating effect....even at the highest level...bet she thought 'this will never happen to me' ...hindsight is a truly wonderful thing.

I've never seen this video before or even heard of this rider...won't be forgetting her in a hurry though.

Is vanity worth the risk of never being able to ride again, or in Courtney's case not being able to walk unaided, or as she says do pretty much anything unaided...it's not a nanny state issue its just plain common sense!

 

[stencilface]

Have to say, I've never been a fan of the melon head look

(disclaimer: but then I am a bling sjer, so what would I know, right?! )

I think the though of permanent brain damage and the thought of my OH wiping my Ar*e for the rest of my life is enough to make me always wear a hat (ok, ok, apart from on my wedding day! )

 

[snopuma]

Damn it!

I have always dreamt of 'top hat and tails' but by the time (if ever) it will be 'crash hat and tails' not quite the same ring to it!


Perhaps in the future someone will invent airbags for horses so they never actually fall over before the airbag deploys and rights them again!

I put my beagler in its bag 5 years ago, it was worn for 2 seasons competitions, since then I have yearned for a day to wear it again, but since my horse had navicular and my next horse was lost tragically in March this year, my new horse is a very long way off a competition, there may never be a chance to wear it again, I knew when I wanted a beagler I had reached a stage with my young horse to not want to wear my Charles Owen H2000 for competition, then I knew we had moved to a new stage of trust and training.

I have never worn a hat so comfortable and elegant as a Beagler, all other hats give me a major headache, so I look on with interest as to whether the manufacturers will design something very similar but safe!

 

[NeverSayNever]

As a Medic at some of these events I obviously agree with the new rule BUT it should be across the board!!
It is not just yourself you put at risk, its the NHS and your family.

As we know it is already a dangerous sport (even dressage) and it is up to each of us to do as much as we can to protect ourselves

I had similar dilemma this last week I wanted a new hat to replace my ventair. I really like the posh ones with all the vents. (as I get off looking like I just washed my hair)

However the medic in me was screaming it wasn't the safest hat, and as much as I wanted it, I just could not buy it.
COLOR]

do you actuallly mean the champion ventair? or just a vented hat. The champion ventair is one of the best skull caps according to the safety ratings, only superceeded by the HS1

 

[Zebedee]

Can I just point out that there is a strong clue for the appropriate use for a 'beagler' in the name? They were designed to be worn whilst Beagling - an activity where a horse is distinctly surplus to requirements !!

Quite a lot of beaglers that I have to ask people to remove at RC comps in favour of a ''proper' hat do actually say inside 'Suitable for foot beagling only'......

 

[MrsMozart]

I am all for freedom of choice, but that includes the choice not to compete under an organisation whose rules you do not agree with! Freedom of choice extends to personal matters, not to what you do under the care of others. BD and similar organisations have a duty of care towards their members and have to make rules with that in mind. Imagine if BD imposed a rule that resulted in many accidents, shouldn't they be held responsible? Furthermore BD, as a public body representing the sport, has a responsibility for how it presents the sport and the kind of example it sets to others, especially children.

As for hats across the board, I think this is just a practical issue and will come in time. It is easier to introduce change on a contentious subject one step at a time, rather than all at once, even if it is not as rationally consistent.

This ^^^

Plus, my view on hats is well known on here(!). Motor sports all require a helmet and the participants don't object, so why are so many horse riders so against them?

Anyone want to see what brain damage looks like, feel free to ask and I'll post an image of my brain (and that was a silly fall, wearing a hat). What the picture can't show you is the emotive damage to self, family and friends.

 

[MrsMozart]

Just hopping back to make a final point.

To those who say it's their head, their choice:

You obviously have no family or friends.

No-one to sit waiting to get the call to say if a surgeon is going to drill a hole in their best mate's head.

No husband/boyfriend/girlfriend to deal with your mood swings, your tears, your suddenly irrational fears and character changes.

No-one to help you get across a road because you've got half way and cant figure out what the cars and lights are doing and when you can or can't go, and all you want to do is sit down in the central reservation and cry.

You don't have children, so you'll never lie on the ground, too sick to move, listening to one daughter calling 999. You won't have a friend (thankfully a neurology specialist nurse) monitoring your status as she waits for the paramedics. You won't lie in an ambulance, not able to see (because you can't lift your head - just moving your eyeballs makes you feel sicker than you've ever felt in your ife), but can hear your younger daughter fighting to get into the ambulance to be with you.

You don't have a job; or if you do, your family/horse don't depend on your income.

It's your personal choice isn't it.



I've always done 'dangerous' sports - I've rock climbed to a serious level, winter mountaineered, white water canoeing, off-road biking, sub-aqua dived (a bit, too scary), and I've had some very scary moments, but I've survived them because I've always had the best protection and I've worn it, even when I'd really rather not. Out of everything I've done, the worst two accidents have been horse related: if I hadn't been wearing a hat the first time, I'd be dead, if I hadn't been wearing a body protector the second time, I'd be paralysed. Neither fall was 'serious', just happened.

 

[CrazyMare]

One of the Euro young riders at Blair 08 had one on. Looked like a motorbike helmet. Can't remember what country she was but the helmet was pink.

Also I think someone was given permission by BE/FEI to ride in one after facial surgery. But I may have dreamed that, or it may have been the above Young Rider.

A Pony rider at the 2010 Euros had one on... Danish I think.

 

[kick_On]

Well I do think it's a shame.

I do think there is strong culture of dumbing down your own responsabilty as a person about your own safety.

Things that bug me:
- Why do some mother with prams, push their prams out first into roads when the want to cross a road - drrrrrrr
- People driving on roads with faulty or completing not working brake lights etc...
- Cyclist who believe the highcode rules simply just don't apply to them? whizzing through red lights etc....
- People who drink and the drive-total FW........

And what gets me is i could be minding my own business and some dumbwit could totally change my life..................................

 

[Weatherford]

The problem is quite simply, insurance. If the insurance companies want you to wear them, then you have to.

Unfortunately, the world is too sue happy these days and a horse show/event that doesn't require protective headgear (and body protectors for XC) could be made liable in the event of an accident. Hence, the insurance companies getting involved.

At least you still have to choice NOT to compete. Or compete somewhere - unaffiliated/ unrecognized - that doesn't require helmets.

And, yes, they will be requiring them in Dressage at all levels sooner than later.

If you haven't seen this video by one of the US's former Olympic Dressage riders, then watch it and weep.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awJDYBhBPzk

 

[Kokopelli]

I quite like the full frontal helmet for xc. It seems to go somehow.

It would look really silly SJ and dressage though.

 

[dominobrown]

I quite like the full frontal helmet for xc. It seems to go somehow.

It would look really silly SJ and dressage though.

I think its awful, and looks uncomfortable. I think it could also effect your vision. Hopefully I be deep in the cold cold ground before I have to wear one of them XC!!

 

[Kokopelli]

I think its awful, and looks uncomfortable. I think it could also effect your vision. Hopefully I be deep in the cold cold ground before I have to wear one of them XC!!

Haha- not saying I'd wear one but I don't think they look awfully stupid.

 

[Cortez]

Well i have to admit it really doesnt bother me as i wear a hat with a harness every time i get on a horse. I know people say dressage isnt as dangerous as jumping therefore the chances of coming off are less, but i have three friends who have all broken their backs whilst schooling in an arena! One of these friends still rides without a hat whilst schooling even after such a bad fall! Have to admit i did voice my opinion when i saw her doing this one day, reminding her that she has a 14yr old daughter who needs a mother and that she was being very selfish!
Each to their own is suppose

Um, how would wearing a hat have prevented them from breaking their backs?

 

[BronsonNutter]

Um, how would wearing a hat have prevented them from breaking their backs?

She never said it would - I think the point she was trying to make was that they had all had nasty falls whilst doing flatwork, and therefore flatwork can also cause accidents... Therefore them still riding without hats when they can fall off is a pretty stupid thing to do...

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

Haha- not saying I'd wear one but I don't think they look awfully stupid.

yeah, but...... when the 4472 crash hat 1st came out in the early 80's we all said how stupid it looked....
About a year later, anyone not competing in one over fences looked daft.....

TFF showing her age

 

[viola]

I do wonder whether the progressively ridiculous nature of many H&S rules is in fact caused by stubborn, short-sighted and selfish views many riders have on their own safety...like many mentioned above: brain injury is certainly not a "freedom of choice" for those close to the rider.
Perhaps if the riders treated themselves more professionally and looked after themselves as they do after their horses riding would have an opinion of a proper sport and receive financial support it needs.

I'm glad to see this rule being introduced and hope one day it will be hats-for-all and at all levels of competitions.

 

[sarahhelen1977]

In response to an earlier question as to why no hats for vaulting - you often have 2 or 3 vaulters up on a horse, moving around into different positions - wearing a hat can affect balance and can be an added risk to the other vaulters. Also, a lot of the time the vaulter is on top of the horse, rather than sitting astride, and so if they do fall off, they will normally land on their feet. I used to work at a RS where we taught vaulting - beginners would start off in hats, but once they got their BEV membership (and so relevant insurance) and had enough balance, they could vault without hats, and start to do pairs/group work. The movements are always taught and practiced on the barrel first, then perfected at walk before moving on to canter. The main point is, vaulting is really gymnastics on horseback rather than riding - a large percentage of vaulters don't ride!
Going back to the original thread though - I think it's a shame that beaglers are being done away with. Serious brain injury through riding is a terrible thing to happen to anybody, but I don't think it is as commonplace as many would have us believe - I would like to know statistics, what discipline was involved, what the rider experience was etc. In all the years I have ridden, and all the riders I know, I haven't personally known anyone suffer brain injury as a result of a fall from a horse, but I have known 4 people break their backs - doesn't mean I'm going to start wearing a back protector to ride though!