Goresbridge Go for Gold Sale - Advice

[justine1559]

So I’m finally about to start looking for my new horse and I’m considering going to the Go for Gold sale at Goresbridge but having never bought from a sale before, I was wondering if anyone who’s been to Goresbridge and in particular the Go for Gold sale can give me any advice. In particular how easy is it to try the horses, what is the actual auction like (I’ve only ever bid on paintings before!)? If I’m lucky and am successful (I have my eye on 2 in particular) how quickly do the horses have to be transported from the sale: do they go back to the vendor and then you arrange transport from there as if a private sale or do they have to be collected from the sale asap. I’ve read up on the vetting process which seems pretty rigorous but saw on an older H&H post a comment about dodgy x rays, which did worry me – does anyone have any views? Finally my budget is up to 12k, looking for a 3-5 year old, around 16.0hh to 16.2hh, mare or gelding and at least 7/8 TB – is my budget unrealistic for the sale?

 

[showpony]

I can ask tomorrow for you. Know someone with two horses in it, will see them at yard then.

 

[justine1559]

That would be super, thanks so much.

 

[jessamess]

I haven't been to any irish sales but I went to the Eilte Auction at Addington a couple of months back and with your budget you could get something REALLY REALLY nice there were some outstanding horses there!!!

There is another Eilte Auction at addington again in December and we hope to go again this time with some spending money!!! We were seriously impressed at the quality of horses and you could get something really special! + it's not a million miles away so you can go in the lorry!!!! much cheaper haha!!!

I do want to go to the irish sales though, but I am put off by like you said the transport and all those sort of things!

defiantly recommend the Eilte one though!!!! have a google, there were some extremely smart youngsters!!!!

xxx

 

[HammieHamlet]

I went to one a few years back and had an amazing time! It's fairly easy to arrange a ride on the horses - we went in to the stable block to see them relaxing and speak to the riders/sellers. Lots of activity going on outside the main arenas with trot ups etc, plus useful to watch others riding/warming up.

The auction night is great, lots of wine flowing and a fantastic atmosphere! We found that a lot of transactions happened in the bar afterwards too - in fact I was there until 4/5am as everyone was very friendly

However, although the horses were lovely, there were a lot of rich overseas buyers there (especially the US) who weren't planning to go home empty handed.... It did make me think therefore that some had gone for hefty price tags that you may not have to pay in the uk. I quickly decided that my budget (similar to yours) wouldn't necessarily be wisely spent there and ended buying an Irish one from the uk I probably wouldn't have been brave enough either to bid!

You'll have an amazing time, especially if you're staying in the main hotel - enjoy it!!

 

[justine1559]

Thanks so much for the replies and advice – I love the H&H forum . Jessamess thanks so much for the info re the elite sale at Addington which for some reason wasn't on my radar but it looks very interesting, particularly with the Champion and Reserve Champion in the Dubarry Burghley Young Event Horse 4 yo final this year both having been bought at the December sale last year.

HammieHamlet thanks for the great info and interesting to hear about the overseas buyers as I don’t want to overpay and want to get as much quality for my money but it sounds like it was a super trip and even if I come back empty handed I’m guessing I’ll gain a lot of experience from seeing so many horses in one place.

 

[Bantry]

In particular how easy is it to try the horses

Very easy, just go to the horses stable, vendor should be handing around. There are 3 all weather arenas one with a full set of jumps and the other 2 are used as warm up arenas and have a couple of showjumps in them. Just be aware that its draining on the younger horses and by the 3rd day they can feel quite flat especially if theres been a lot of interest in them.

what is the actual auction like (I’ve only ever bid on paintings before!)? If I’m lucky and am successful (I have my eye on 2 in particular)

Its exciting! Its held in a function room in a nearby hotel during dinner.

how quickly do the horses have to be transported from the sale: do they go back to the vendor and then you arrange transport from there as if a private sale or do they have to be collected from the sale asap.

They're pretty reasonable, there's lots of stables there. Any sold horese will start shipping out from Thursday. There's lots of UK buyers there so should be no problem getting a space on a lorry.

I’ve read up on the vetting process which seems pretty rigorous but saw on an older H&H post a comment about dodgy x rays, which did worry me – does anyone have any views?

All horse have a full 5 stage vetting cert and a full set of xrays. These are available during the 3 days for anyone to see. There is an independent vet there who will interpret the xrays for interested buyers.

Finally my budget is up to 12k, looking for a 3-5 year old, around 16.0hh to 16.2hh, mare or gelding and at least 7/8 TB – is my budget unrealistic for the sale?

12k sterling = 14k Euros approx so yes there will be something there at that price. Last year the clearance rate on the 3yr olds was high, top price 18k average about 10k.
For the 4-6 yr olds the top price was 48k and the average was about 16.5k.

There's deals to be done afterwards and most of the vendors are serious producers so you might get chatting and maybe they'd have something at home that could suit. There's a few graduates of the Go for Gold sale in Osberton this weekend

 

[justine1559]

Thanks Bantry, really great advice and has put my mind at rest re trying the horses, vetting, transport etc. Also a good point about the horses becoming a little flat, I can imagine it can be quite stressful for them. Still a little worried that my budget may not be quite enough but all the feedback is that it's a great few days and even if I come back without a horse, I'll have had a great time and gained a lot from it.

 

[christine48]

There is also an auction of 4 & 5 yr olds at Boekelo this week. There is a link to videos on their web site.

 

[justine1559]

christine48 many thanks for the heads up re the Boekelo sale. I can see that other than the Go for Gold sale I haven't really looked at the other elite sales which I should do as it'll be good to see what the horses are selling for, what the quality is like etc.

 

[maccachic]

I accidently brought a horse from Gorebridge went for a nosey while on my OE Sold him thru there as well had my employer ride him as he is a better rider than me for the sale. I warmed him up in the bigger arena and boss jumped on and put him over some fences just before the auction.

When I brought him he was passed in at auction never saw it but got to talking to the guy afterward and he free jumped the horse for me (unbroken) in the indoor arena. He had a clean vet check when I purchased but had a low grade wind issues when I had him vet checked to sell, so not sure if there is a difference between vets doing vet checks or not.

This was 2007

 

[ArcticFox]

you must be able to get something nice for £12k!

I've never spent more than £5k and have had some cracking horses (competed to a high level) . give my mum credit, she has a great eye for a horse.

I should add than none were bought at an auction. but I still think you shoudl be able to buy something good for £12k.

 

[justine1559]

Thanks ArcticFox for the reply and confidence boost. I've been out of eventing for over 10 years and now having decided to return (I've been working in London for the last 10 years) I'm putting a reasonable amount of pressure on myself to try and find something pretty special (3 star potential). I've been going through the ads online and nothing really grabs me, and there don't seem to be many 7/8 to full TB around other than ex racers. That said, someone on the forum kindly PM'd me and suggested using an agent in Ireland who will have the contacts over there and should be able to find a number of horses that fit my brief. If you have any suggestions I'd be really grateful to hear them. Maybe I can borrow your mum

 

[Dusty85]

Oooooo please can you let me know if you go? I am very very interested in a 4 year old in the Go for gold sale, but I can't go. I really want to know how much he goes for.

I've heard they go for a varies amount, anything from 8k to 45k! You should be able to get something, but I guess it depends how much interest there is in the ones you want.

I will more than likely be going next year though, as hopefully ill be looking for a serious horse then!

 

[TBB]

If you are interested in a mare, I know someone who has a 5 year old Master Imp schooled showjumping and cross country out of a mare who show jumped, evented ,hunted etc., the dam is a sister to a few eventers in the UK who's names escape me and from a family which has produced at least a couple of 4* eventers. Pm me if you are interested and I'll give you their contact details, they also have a 4 year old mare out of the same dam which is broken and riding but I'm not sure how much jumping shes done. They're based not too far from the Going for Gold sale. In case any one is wondering they are not mine.

 

[justine1559]

Hi Dusty85, I'll let you know if I go (it's looking likely) so feel free to PM me if you'd like some information on the 4 year old you like, I wonder if it's the same one I'm very interested in. Also if I do go, I thought I'd put some feedback on the H&H forum just describing the trip, prices of the horses, anything that I think may be useful for anyone going in the future.

 

[maccachic]

I used to work for Warrington Equestrian centre - 3 sons show jump and the two daughters teach and compete between I am sure they could source you a decent horse. They also do buying trips to Europe for their clients. http://warringtonec.ie/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&page=shop.browse&category_id=4&Itemid=54

 

[justine1559]

Thanks maccachic, they're not far from the sale so it's a really helpful suggestion.

 

[maccachic]

Or you could come to NZ for a shopping trip: http://www.trademe.co.nz/sports/equestrian/horses-ponies/horses

 

[Zorro123]

To anybody going to Going for Gold Sale- BEWARE.
I have bought horses in Ireland for 20 years, but would be very wary of buying at this sale.
I bought a horse which subsequently failed the vet on x-rays. It was subsequently sold at this sale. If you manage to openly speak to the locals about the sale they will tell you that the prices are very very inflated to the foreign buyers. They see you coming and they are masters at wheeling the price. Of course there are some good horses and straight deals, but ask yourself why this sale is so much more expensive than other elite sales. Many deals are far from straight and you won't even know it. I would never buy there. There is a dealer cartel that operates in Ireland with the biggest names in Ireland (yes the ones we all know) involved in the controlling prices. If we open our eyes its there in front of us. Look at the prices of proven horses in the UK and compare them to the horses with little or no record at this sale. Let the buyer beware!

 

[maccachic]

Interesting Zorro but when I was over there Cavan Sales got much better prices than Gorsesbridge. You hold a purse strings no one holds a gun to your head too expensive you don't stick up your hand?

 

[Zorro123]

Hi Maccachic, thanks for your comments. Obviously we must all decide what any potential purchase is worth to us and leave our "hands down" when we reach that point. However that is not what I'm banging on about. If I set a high reserve price then have you wheeled towards it and the last bid is not yours but my associates, I will make sure that the bid will be less than the reserve and no sale. You will then be approached after the final failed bid and try to get you to beat that final bid with an excuse why the higher bid is not acceptable. You match or beat the bid, or even stick to your final bid and the horse will usually be yours. You may have paid your top valuation of the horse but you've not been bidding against anyone and the true auction value of the horse has been far exceeded.
Dealers even have the price of their own horses bid intentionally to a high no sale, they will be the talk of the sale having said no to the 70,000€ bid. Then they can claim that they turned down mega money when their next victim visits their yard and therefore pushing the client to a very high false price. Ireland is run by 4 big dealers. The prices are completely manipulated. Find the horse in the breeders yard and the horse will be at a fraction of the big 4's price. But that is difficult as they'll get there before you nearly every time. These guys are not adding on a 5000€ margin to a 20000€ horse, they're adding 20000€ to a 5000€ horse!

 

[popsdosh]

Totally agree with Zorro inexperienced buyers(at auction) going to these sales will get well and truely stitched up. However it happens at any auction sale the world over.
Auctions are used very successfully by many breeders to generally increase the value of all stock.
For example within the welsh cob breeders at auction some make incredible prices in what on the face of it is a legitimate sale however it is common practice for these prices to be achieved between breeders in the ring as maybe 50% of the headline price is then reimbursed to the purchaser by the seller. What this achieves is it drives up the overall perception of prices and it relies on the mug coming in from outside the' Ring ' and paying full whack which then benfits all of the sellers. The whole system relies on naive,inexperienced purchasers who think they will pick up a bargain at an auction!
As they say buyer beware ,I would also suggest if you get sucked into the whole sale environment with the alcohol flowing freely you are very likely to end up buying something unsuitable.I would always suggest any person going to these sales for the first time to take along somebody who knows what they are doing.
By the way this applies to auctions throughout the world not just Ireland! however they do have the charm to be more persuasive

 

[maccachic]

New Zealand doesn't really have auctions for horses aside racing, Ireland was the first I went to was interesting. Majority is done thru online sales sites like www.trademe.co.nz (ebay equivalent) but as classifieds as you cannot auction animals on there.

You know what they say a fool and his money - personally I don't care what horses are selling for I work out what I want what I have to spend and what the horse is worth to me.

 

[Zorro123]

Popsdosh- interesting.
The problem with the Going for Gold sale is that manipulation of price is so commonplace. Monart sale took place yesterday and the top price was a fraction of last years Going for Golds top price. Why? Monarts organiser has banned certain people from the sale. He knows what normally happens and he simply won't allow the wheelers to attend.

Why is no Cooley horse for sale?

Cavan and the other sales at Goresbridge are typical auction sales with some manipulation of prices, but this sale is Goresbridges "Elite" sale of event horses and the wheelers know the foreign buyers are coming and are now conditioned from the previous sales to the inflated prices.

3 months ago a 7 year old grey gelding was sold to the USA through one of the big 4. The horse failed the vetting. It is now entered in this years sale under the owners name. BEWARE.

 

[Sb2]

Interesting-I have also heard similar about one of those big Irish dealers mentioned. They are famous for it. I think the biggest problem is X ray switching, that's their favourite thing to do!

But Regarding just basic 5 stage vettings, any horse can fail and be deemed useless by one vet & then be gotten sound again with work/ physio / reconditioning & pass the vet again, doesn't necessarily mean they are useless and lame forever with one failed vetting

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

Can anyone tell me the top price at Monart yesterday? A 4yo I bred made 16k. Delighted for his producers. They did an amazing job with him.

 

[Zorro123]

I think it was 17,500€ for the last lot of the day, lot 60. 5yr old 16hh nearly pure TB. I gather bought for their 15 year old daughter. Reserve was 15000€.

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

I saw lot 60 on preview day. Well worth the money. Mine was lot 8.

 

[Zorro123]

Equilibrium Ireland: I note your horse is by Iroko and I have been keeping an eye on a 3yr old by Iroko but can't make up my mind on him. Moves and jumps very well but I'm unsure if he's an event horse as he seems to lack a bit going through the air over a fence. Always very careful but maybe a bit short on character/confidence to make a top class event horse. I've only seen a couple of Iroko's and I'm starting to think they maybe lack that bit to be top class event horses. I know that's a generalisation, and not a comment on your horse (I didn't see him) but I would be interested to hear what you think.

Lot 60 for me was a nice horse, careful, reasonably good mover but lacked jump. Think he'll do the job he's been bought for as he's so honest but for me there were several better at the sale, but not many smaller horses with experience so that probably boosted the price. The horses producer really know their stuff and he'll be showing all of what he's got at the sale, so not much more to come from him I expect.