GWH Pointer x Lab wanted please!

Faye625

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I know a few people who own them and they are lovely dogs. Thanks for your constructive and helpful comment!
 

s4sugar

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I know a few people who own them and they are lovely dogs. Thanks for your constructive and helpful comment!

The two breeds have different working styles and if you had a good bitch of either why would you breed crosses from her?

They may well be lovely dogs, few dogs are not lovely, but no reason to do this cross. What is wrong with either breed?
 

Faye625

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I'm not debating with you about why I like them. I didn't personally decide to mix the two breeds, in fact I wouldn't of thought to put them together if I hadn't of seen one, but I just happened to take a liking the few that I have been introduced to so I would like one myself.
 

lexiedhb

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I think WHY is a totally fair question. Breeding mongrels is unpredictable. No two litters will be the same, so saying that you "have seen one/two etc and they are fabulous dogs" does nothing to guarantee the one you pick up will be of a similar nature.

I also assume you meant to add to your post "from fully health tested parents"- to the want for a litter :rolleyes:
 

Faye625

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And what makes you think that I won't look for these things once I have actually found a litter? I work at a vets full time so I am well aware of checks that need to be done and paperwork that should be present. Now if you wouldn't mind could you remove your opiniated self from my post and while your at it try dismounting your high horse too.
 

Faye625

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I posted something on here for peoples help/advice and instead get people like yourself barrage me and try to imply that I am doing wrong when I most definitely am not. So if you know of no litters then please stop replying as you'll be talking to yourself from now on. Muchos Gracias.
 

s4sugar

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I actually know a lot of people with both breeds. Show and working.

They would be horrified at the thought of crossing them. I'm sure you will find a puppy farmer to produce one for you - good luck with it & spare a thought for the rest of us that pick up the pieces after irresponsible breeding.
 

gunnergundog

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If you work at a vets and have done your homework you will know that there was a vWD carrier GWP dog imported into the UK last year which allegedly is being used for breeding. Noone with a pedigree bitch would use it so I can only imagine that it will be siring puppy farm/back yard breeder type litters, such as you are seeking.

OP,......I hope you have sufficient funds to cope with any emergencies relating to vWD and of course are prepared emotionally to potentially lose your dog in sad circumstances. Oh, and also remember that vWD goes hand in hand with hypothyroid in many circumstances. I doubt you would get insurance on these aspects, but maybe, working at a vets you can get a discount. :rolleyes:
 

CAYLA

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See some may see these posts as rude but i do think it educates alot of people looking in on the threads esp those wanting to avoid funding the indescriminate breeding market. but tgen there is spudlets post aswell highlightin u can save your money and get a x breed mongrel from.rescue as it should b perfect for y the op if ots the x you want.....i have to say a rescue is the only place i would take a x breed from, leave the purchase of pups to those doing their home work and the result of a health testing responsible breeder.
 

lexiedhb

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And what makes you think that I won't look for these things once I have actually found a litter? I work at a vets full time so I am well aware of checks that need to be done and paperwork that should be present. Now if you wouldn't mind could you remove your opiniated self from my post and while your at it try dismounting your high horse too.

Then you would know that all these tests should be done PRIOR to a litter being born- what health tests exactly would you be looking for?

No need for rudeness- noone has been rude to you- just questioning why you would want to fuel the mongrel breeding that is so very unnecessary when there are thousands of dogs in rescue needing homes.
 

Cinnamontoast

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Agree with Cayla.

Muchas gracias. Can you tell I need to go back to work?!

The trouble is, that crossing two breeds means you just do not know what you're going to get. Within a purebred litter, you're going to get very varied temperaments, I'm on my second pair of siblings and the pairs have been extremely different. Crossing breeds means potentially huge differences.

It's is a bit of a bugbear of mine in that it's only sensible to gauge a forum before you dive in. Many people on here work in rescue and have seen badly bred and unwanted pups with no health testing and huge issues. As a specialist dog section, it's to be expected that some of us get concerned at random crosses being requested.
 

Nikki J

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The two breeds have different working styles and if you had a good bitch of either why would you breed crosses from her?

They may well be lovely dogs, few dogs are not lovely, but no reason to do this cross. What is wrong with either breed?

As someone who has never experienced anything but poor health from her pedigree dogs, and nothing but good health from her crossbreeds, I am very much in favour of good crosses. My Jakey was an absolutely splendid dog and lived to an old age. We rescued her at 5 years old, and she was a house pet, not a working dog, although she became a very good retriever for my then husband.

I dislike intensely this snobbish attitude towards crossbreeds - the number of times I have suffered sneering remarks about my 2 gorgeous boys - "oh, what a shame they are mongrels not pedigrees" What!! Why!! wtf is THAT all about. Either you love them, think them gorgeous, healthy fit dogs or not. Yes, my boys are mongrels - and I am proud that they are such and not inbred pedigrees. ALL pedigree dogs - you only have to look in their pedigrees - are inbred and close bred. My pedigree GSP Lizzie was a Wittekind. Oooh, exclaimed all the GSP experts, that's good, She's a Wittekind - what excellent lines she has, you should breed from her. However, on looking at her pedigree her father - Wittekind Gregory - was also her mate's grandfather. This is just plain madness. It is illegal for humans to marry their cousins even, for extremely good and sound medical reasons, but this is an even closer relationship than cousins! I cannot quite work out what it is, but it is damned close. And this close relationship was featured going back on both maternal and paternal sides of Lizzie's pedigree AND her mate's as well! So they were very closely related. I am a believer in hybrid vigour, and whereas of course like everyone else I know of many extremely healthy pedigrees, I personally have never experienced owning one - all my pedigrees have been very UNhealthy - either mentally or physically.
 

CorvusCorax

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ALL pedigree dogs - you only have to look in their pedigrees - are inbred and close bred.

It is illegal for humans to marry their cousins even

Both these statements are bunkum, sorry. I look at a good deal of pedigrees :)
And it is legal to marry your first cousin in the UK if you so wish.
Even the Royal Family do it....

But don't let the fact get in the way of a good rant :)
 

lexiedhb

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My boy is a mongrel- does not mean I have to agree with breeding them willy nilly and giving them daft "designer" names, with no thought to health/temperament testing!! Just because someone wants to make a quick buck, or someone knows someone who has one and so they want one- just like that - especially when there are thousands upon thousands of mongrels from pup to old age in rescue requiring homes!
 

Nikki J

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Both these statements are bunkum, sorry. I look at a good deal of pedigrees :)
And it is legal to marry your first cousin in the UK if you so wish.
Even the Royal Family do it....

But don't let the fact get in the way of a good rant :)

Oops - OK, got that wrong - my apologies - but don't split hairs!! You have not explained to me why it is perfectly OK for my bitch to have Wittekind Gregory as her father, but on her maternal side, as her grandfather!! I am damned sure this would not be allowed in this country!!

Are you telling me that it is OK to interbreed - it's worse than inbreeding - our dogs in this way? Did you not see that programme about Crufts - Mark Evans - and hear his statement about a parade of mutants?

Are you telling me that I am lying about Lizzie's pedigree. I still have it at home, although she died almost 30 years ago. She was the last pedigree I had - never again, with the possible exception of an Alaskan Malamute but I would not pay good money for one, I would only ever have one as a rescue. Ditto Czech wolfdog or Saarloos.
 

Nikki J

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My boy is a mongrel- does not mean I have to agree with breeding them willy nilly and giving them daft "designer" names, with no thought to health/temperament testing!! Just because someone wants to make a quick buck, or someone knows someone who has one and so they want one- just like that - especially when there are thousands upon thousands of mongrels from pup to old age in rescue requiring homes!

I could not agree more. But whoever mentioned such dire practices. You are right, this goes on - particularly amongst my choice of type, wolfie types. But I have friends on northern breed crosses who adhere to the strictest programme of health testing - hips, elbows, eyes, Addisons, Von Willebrand - probably more, but I can't remember all the names.

Nothing wrong with breeding any type of dog - with or without daft designer names - one of my boys is a registered Utonagan, don't see anything wrong with that btw, it's a lovely name - as long as good breeding practice is observed. The aforementioned, PLUS NO INTER OR INBREEDING. That is a disgusting practice and frankly IMO should be made illegal.
 

CorvusCorax

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No I am not accusing you of lying and I thought the Pedigree Dogs programme was sensationalist toot which has done more harm than good and sent people running into the arms of puppy farmers and backyard breeders in their droves and has made every randomer an instant 'expert' on my breed and many others.

Linebreeding done knowledgeably and to improve on known traits is not a bad thing IMO.
You just have to know what you are doing. The same with outcrossing and wild card breedings.

I've had many, many pedigrees all who have lived to old age except two from the same litter who were linebred to two dogs known for skin allergies/ear issues.
All I have to do is avoid those lines, research more and choose more wisely in future. I couldn't do that unless I had pedigrees to look at.
My own young dog has no common anscestors in five generations.


There are plenty of people on here with unhealthy crossbreeds (hip and elbow problems, allergies etc).
 

lexiedhb

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I could not agree more. But whoever mentioned such dire practices. You are right, this goes on - particularly amongst my choice of type, wolfie types. But I have friends on northern breed crosses who adhere to the strictest programme of health testing - hips, elbows, eyes, Addisons, Von Willebrand - probably more, but I can't remember all the names.

Nothing wrong with breeding any type of dog - with or without daft designer names - one of my boys is a registered Utonagan, don't see anything wrong with that btw, it's a lovely name - as long as good breeding practice is observed. The aforementioned, PLUS NO INTER OR INBREEDING. That is a disgusting practice and frankly IMO should be made illegal.

Problem is- inter breeding IS happening now with the crosses. Ex family member decided to get a dog- decided the Labradoodle was the dog for her, told me it was going to be "third" generation- EH? says i . Meaning Labradoodles crossed with labradoodles- right i say. Yeah the breeder assured her that the genetics of his lines are far enough away that health should not be a problem- WHY? because there was inbreeding going on - tis not the curse of a few pedigree lines anymore Im afraid!
 

Nikki J

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No I am not accusing you of lying and I thought the Pedigree Dogs programme was sensationalist toot which has done more harm than good and sent people running into the arms of puppy farmers and backyard breeders in their droves and has made every randomer an instant 'expert' on my breed and many others.

Linebreeding done knowledgeably and to improve on known traits is not a bad thing IMO.
You just have to know what you are doing. The same with outcrossing and wild card breedings.

I've had many, many pedigrees all who have lived to old age except two from the same litter who were linebred to two dogs known for skin allergies/ear issues.
All I have to do is avoid those lines, research more and choose more wisely in future. I couldn't do that unless I had pedigrees to look at.
My own young dog has no common anscestors in five generations.


There are plenty of people on here with unhealthy crossbreeds (hip and elbow problems, allergies etc).

Great news that your young dog has no common ancestors in 5 generations. That's good - do I take it then that things are improving in the pedigree world? I freely admit that my Lizzie's pedigree - which I will attempt to scan in at home tonight and see if I can paste it on here - is 30 years old nearly.

I too know unhealthy crossbreeds, and I know of healthy pedigrees, one can never generalise, all one can do IMO is be sensible.

I thought that Mark Evans did an amazing job to bring to the attention of both doggie and non doggie people the appalling things that we have done to man's best friend in the interests of fashion. Look what we have done to the Cavalier? Look at many, if not the majority, of GSDs with their roach backs and fallen haunches. Our next door neighbour's GSD is a perfect example of this - he is only 6 or 7 and he can no longer jump into the back of the car, or get up or down the stairs!! AND they paid a fortune for him from a very reputable and well known breeder of supposedly healthy GSDs!!

Ben and Tai cost me nothing - well, Tai cost me £100 in that I made a donation to the lady who took him in to rehome him.

Let us hope that what you are telling me about your 5 generations of no close breeding is, or is becoming, the norm now. I think we have that programme by Mark Evans at least partially to thank for this, so don't knock it!
 

Nikki J

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Problem is- inter breeding IS happening now with the crosses. Ex family member decided to get a dog- decided the Labradoodle was the dog for her, told me it was going to be "third" generation- EH? says i . Meaning Labradoodles crossed with labradoodles- right i say. Yeah the breeder assured her that the genetics of his lines are far enough away that health should not be a problem- WHY? because there was inbreeding going on - tis not the curse of a few pedigree lines anymore Im afraid!

Absolutely agree, which is sad and tragic. But this has been going on in the pedigree world for almost a century, with no-one turning a hair ... until THAT PROGRAMME!!

In and interbreeding can only ever be bad - to my mind, there can NEVER be any justification to mating father with daughter, mother to son, sister to brother, and yet it goes on the whole time in virtually every breed. Or is it starting to wane now, I do hope so.
 
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