Hardest decision, think might have to have healthy pony PTS :(

This pony is dangerous,if his teeth and back are ok the PTS is the only safe option. Think how you would feel if someone was injured or killed.
 
PapaFrita said:
Quite. HOWEVER the OP does know the horse and if she thinks it will be necessary to PTS why should anyone question her judgment?
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Because the OP may not be qualified to make that kind of diagnosis/decision - (she could be any old person). I agree with the poster who said that the pony should be thoroughly investigated by experts before any decision is made.
 
Rueysmum said:
Because the OP may not be qualified to make that kind of diagnosis/decision - (she could be any old person). I agree with the poster who said that the pony should be thoroughly investigated by experts before any decision is made.
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Why?

The OP knows the pony has seen it "in action"..why does she need a "qualified person"?

i certainly wouldn't need any "qualified persons" if i wanted to put to sleep a dangerous pony
 
nativeponies said:
Why?

The OP knows the pony has seen it "in action"..why does she need a "qualified person"?

i certainly wouldn't need any "qualified persons" if i wanted to put to sleep a dangerous pony
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Because the OP's idea of "bolting" might not be the same as somebody else's. She also probably doesn't have the required knowledge to carry out back/saddle/physio/vet checks etc.
 
Rueysmum said:
Because the OP's idea of "bolting" might not be the same as somebody else's. She also probably doesn't have the required knowledge to carry out back/saddle/physio/vet checks etc.
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You assume a great deal Rueysmum and you also sound incredibly arrogant. Who are you to say they don't have the required knowledge or the expertise available to them?

Like NP, if I thought the pony needed putting down for bolting then I would, I wouldn't be asking permission; I know what is right and wrong and I like to sleep at night. It would be criminal to let this pony go anywhere there was a chance it would be ridden again by a small child; which mark my words, would happen because there'd be clever dicks saying they could solve the problem. Don't blame the OP for not wanting that to happen.
 
How do we know the OP is not over-dramatising? Her idea of "bolting" may just be somebody else's idea of just running off.

Have you seen the pony? Do you know the OP? How can you be so sure that things are so black and white?

There are a lot of arrogant people around, but I am not one of them (thanks very much!)
 
How do we know the OP is not over-dramatising? Her idea of "bolting" may just be somebody else's idea of just running off.
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OP has always come across as pretty sensible, practical and non hysterical when it comes to horses......
 
Rueysmum said:
How do we know the OP is not over-dramatising? Her idea of "bolting" may just be somebody else's idea of just running off.

Have you seen the pony? Do you know the OP? How can you be so sure that things are so black and white?

There are a lot of arrogant people around, but I am not one of them (thanks very much!)
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I'm sorry, you almost make me laugh although your concern for the pony is laudable. What about concern for the child who would ride it?

The sheer fact that a 12.2 pony is bolting with able children on is enough to ring alarm bells. Even if someone else sees this as merely running off, the fact that the pony does it at all, makes it very suspect as suitable for a child of whatever ability.
 
Rueysmum said:
How do we know the OP is not over-dramatising? Her idea of "bolting" may just be somebody else's idea of just running off.

Have you seen the pony? Do you know the OP? How can you be so sure that things are so black and white?

There are a lot of arrogant people around, but I am not one of them (thanks very much!)
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I KNOW the OP from way back on here..and believe me, she would CERTAINLY know.

as i said earlier, pony's life/childs life..no brainer
 
If you have met in real life then I take it all back.

My point was that it's all very well for people to jump on the "shoot it" bandwagon without really knowing the person/horse concerned, but if you have detailed knowledge of the OP's ability/integrity then fair play to their ultimate decision.
 
Jess1 said:
First off, I am very sorry to read of your problem :(

BUT - and I am not posting this to cause an argument and yes he's dangerous if he bolts - however, I just cannot believe that a "flight animal" should be PTS because it acts upon it's own and only known instinct. Horses aren't out to hurt people or their riders, but they are there to protect themselves and at the moment he obviously doesn't trust his rider enough to take confidence in them.

Perhaps there isn't anything obviously wrong, but have you looked in to the possibility of a trapped nerve - I read of a horse that would event absolutely fine but all of a sudden he turned in to a complete rodeo psycho horse and would dislodge his rider every single time - that was because of a trapped nerve!! Difficult to diagnose I suspect, but not an impossibility... and horses react differently to things so just because that horse bucked doesn't mean this one wouldn't bolt to get away from it. Just a thought.

Have you thought of re-braking him and completely starting again, getting his full trust on the ground through join-up? I know it's a lot of hard work, but it might help him.

If all else fails a companion would surely be the best option.

Before anyone says - I can't have ever been bolted with so I don't know what I’m on about - I have, it’s terrifying and I fully appreciate the dangers!

I just feel SO strongly, like I said above, for a horse to be put down because he reacts on his ONLY known instinct is not right. He perhaps just doesn't know any better at the moment!

You will undoubtedly do the right thing in your circumstances and I wish you the best of luck with him... I hope it's a happy ending!
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Agree completely. A very intelligent reply:)
 
Thanks Blazingsaddles :) - I just hope it get's considered.

All the posts saying put him to sleep etc... really saddened me. Like I said, horses are flight animals - he is only acting on what he naturally knows to do when he is terrified.

Until you start looking deeper you'll never ever get a reason for why the poor pony is doing it! There are plenty of options for him and a bullet wouldn't even be on my list - he's only acting on what he naturally knows and I just feel he deserves to be broken-in again, started over and given a second chance to prove what a talented pony he really is. :(

I wish the owner all the best and I hope he lives to have a happy ending!!
 
^^^^^ what a sweet idea. Scores virtually nothing in the practicality stakes though. The pony is 128cm - that means that effectively the test pilot, after all the groundwork etc, will be a child. Would you let your child get on that pony?

I own a true bolter, he's big enough for me to ride and we did manage to sort his issues - ie WHY he bolted - before my daughter rode him. They were a wonderful partnership and he is in a home with us where he trusts and is, mostly, trusted. I would, however, never part with him because he's not "cured", he's still a bolter and always will be, it's just that we now understand him and he understands that he will never be put in a position where he can do nothing but bolt. Different home? Different rider? The problems would start up again.

The little pony talked about here? Either stays with its owners so they can guarantee it is unridden, even though it's a little toad on the ground or, the most certain way of dealing with it, pts.
 
OP- I don't really see this as a hard decision. Assuming you have investigated all sources of pain which as AmyMay says, knowing you, you will have, and have given this pony its best shot, but it is still dangerous, as true bolter's are then i don't think you have much of a choice.

Well ok you do- field ornament, or PTS......
 
jemima_too, I am only 22 and have no children so I can't answer - but no I wouldn't - I'd address the situation properly!!

Natural Horsemanship associations would not shoot a horse becuas they're too small to do anything with - they deal with minatures to 18hh's. They're not fussy!

And you say it's a "little toad on the ground" - well there's half your problem! If he can not be controlled on the ground, put where you want him and told to stay there until he is asked to move then how on earth is he meant to be controlled when he is ridden. He is the boss in the current situation and clearly takes little respect/trust from his handler's/rider's.

Like I said, my opinion would be ground work (and lots of it) including join up and then re-brake him and if that fails then a companion!
 
So if you failed to sort his problems and sent him to a new home as a companion, what's to stop THAT person selling him on and the next person selling him on and so on and so on? What if in searching for the cause of his problem he hurt someone badly? And what is wrong exactly with deciding not to pass the responsibility on to someone else?
Question was for Jess1 btw
 
No need to be rude just because some one has a different opinion on something. If the OP was 100% sure that it was the right thing to do then why come on an open forum and state the story rather than just cracking on and getting it done, she has some doubt in her mind and wants feedback and suggestions which is what is being offered from different points of view.
 
Maybe so but others also think they have made a relevant point in a polite manner just to have their comments shunned.
In the past few months both on the forum and in real life I have come across many people in the equine world who seemed to be intent on putting other peoples ideas/opinions down. We might not all agree on a subject but it doesn't mean that one persons opinion is any better than anothers.
 
Maybe so but others also think they have made a relevant point in a polite manner just to have their comments shunned.
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Possibly because they suggested things that could potentially kill someone.........

And actually some opinions do matter more than others and do have more value than others.

People with many years of experience in horses - who are practical, intelligent and above all realistic have opinions that far outweight those that don't.

Thankfully no one has suggested palming it off on a charity yet.

But I'm sure that suggestion will come too.
 
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But no one should have such a definate decision on an animal that they have never seen before, know no history and can go by what is said on a forum. I often have people come into my work and ask for advise on what bit to use on a horse, without seeing the horse in question there is no way I would advise, what happens if I advised the wrong thing?
Quite aware that some one could be injured or worse but it can't be for someone who has not seen the situation in real life to advise either way or infact, how to go about curing it should there be a cure.
 
alesea said:
It sounds stupid, but have you tried any groundwork- it could be that the pony is just a bit confused about aids, especially if kids have been riding him. Just practice 'stop' and 'go' on the arena and make sure he's absolutely obedient- also teach him to 'park' i.e. stand stil on the end of a rope and not move until he's told to do so- push him back if he moves so that he learns not to. It's a fairly easy thing to do- start in the stable and move into scary environments.

It just helps to clarify if it's a communication problem- it really is amazing how many horses don't actually understand how to 'stop'- it tends to be because people have been too quick to teach them to stop from the seat, or never remninded them that they still have to be able to stop from the hand. Then when they encounter something that makes them bolt, and the natural reaction from the rider is to pull on their mouth, they simply don't understand why and get even more scared!
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This can actually work , it takes a lot of time and training but I can confirm it helps. It is not a perfect cure though.
The other one is to train in a dead stop to a voice command, so you yell "HALT" and horse stops dead. Sometimes the yell is whats needed to get into panicing ponies brain.

Add to that have you tried a calmer? People say they are no good for bolters but have to disagree with that.

A combination of finding the right calmer and the above style training is really working for me.

But then I am an adult , for kids? I'm not sure it's possible.
I certainly would back any decision you make in this case. It's a tough spot that I find only those who have been there can really understand. Everyone else thinks "but there must be a way".
 
charlie76 said:
Maybe so but others also think they have made a relevant point in a polite manner just to have their comments shunned.
In the past few months both on the forum and in real life I have come across many people in the equine world who seemed to be intent on putting other peoples ideas/opinions down. We might not all agree on a subject but it doesn't mean that one persons opinion is any better than anothers.
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But you are doing exactly that by suggesting that having it PTS should never be an option? :confused:
 
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