Has anyone a valid reason...................

Red-1 said:
I find that interesting. Which companies do not insure if not wearing high viz? I am surprised as it is not a legal requirement. My insurance is through Shearwater, don't think they have that exclusion. I also have insurance through the BHS, I have not seen that as being a reason not to pay out?
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Copmpanies decide what they will and won't insure for on the day the claim comes in. They ALL have nice little exclusion clauses that can be used to wriggle out of anything - if it's going to be too expensive, or be bad publicity, or if the Claim Manager has a bee in his bonnet!

BHS Insurance ONLY pays out if there is no other insurer involved - it's a last resort case. And I'm not sure they would endear themselves to BHS if they paid out on a rider, with no high vis, in darker, foggy conditions (maybe get away with it in bright sunlight - although that can be even WORSE for visibility!)
 
Pedantic said:
Weird, in here we get some posters defending blatant stupidity, and in the gas installers forum we get some installers defending dangerous practices, some being gas related, but one being using a mobile phone whilst driving driving an enormous van, amazing.
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No ,driving while using a mobile phone is unlawful there's no law that says you must wear hi vis .
Driving while drunk impairs you , not wearing hi vis does not impact on your ability.
It's a freedom of choice ATM.
On the horse type hi vis the quality is generally awful .
I searched and searched of nice stuff and there's just none I can find .
My winter coat is ok it's the best I could find but it's arms are way to bulky and the fabric to noisy ( not too much of an issue as I don't have baby horses any more ) the fastenings are cheap and nasty and the cut is well, horrible .
For summer wear cycling stuff is fine bit they often don't have two way zips but it's just no good for winter it's not warm enough .
 
The amount of idiots riding bikes with no lights/hi viz is astonishing, I really think it should be made compulsory for anyone on the road. Near our horses field, there is one woman who walks her dogs on the road in the dark, she is extremely difficult to see in the dark on an unlit lane.
 
Isn't it by law that you must have both forward and rear lights/reflectors for a bike at all times if going on the road?

Kezza I've honestly never seen those kind of high-vis covers on a horse barring police horses; also doesn't he get hot under there?
 
I do wear hi-viz when I ride on the roads, even though I hate the stuff. Sadly it doesn't automatically ensure that certain types of drivers slow down or take care when passing us :(
 
Overread said:
Like it or not people like to look good; they also like to be "free" from "the man" and wearing high-vis can sometimes feel like its more a chore than a life-saver (esp if the person has never had a risky situation before). If high-vis were made into more casual clothing or heck just functional affordable jackets/tops/trousers for work around a yard it would feel less like being told to put something on and more like just putting on your favourite top to go out for a ride -bonus that it could also save your life.
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Huge amounts of 'looking good' fitted/shaped running gear eg t-shirts, jumpers, half zips, full zips, no zips, tops, waterproof jackets etc come in bright colours, often with reflective strips to boot, so I'm not sure that's a valid enough reason these days.
 
Overread said:
Isn't it by law that you must have both forward and rear lights/reflectors for a bike at all times if going on the road?

Kezza I've honestly never seen those kind of high-vis covers on a horse barring police horses; also doesn't he get hot under there?
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hahah really? He didn't wear the exercise sheet today, as it was very mild, he only wears it when its cold or raining! a lady on my yard has a fly sheet type that she rides in! I tried to get one but Robinsons had sold out of them and haven't had them back in stock since! Quite a lot of people around my way wear hi viz exercise sheets! but we do have some busy roads and lots of trees growing over them, so you do need some extra visability
 
Riding on the roads is what's dangerous. The amount of smug posts on here from people who seem to think hi vis generates some magic forcefield... It doesn't. You're still putting yourself and your horse in the same danger of being hit by a car. Even if the risk was reduced 50% (which seems unlikely) and you like to play the numbers game, here's a tip if you care so much: not riding on the roads reduces the risk to zero.

Someone who doesn't ride on the roads could easily berate you all for needlessly endangering your horses so I'd suggest you all remember that just as you like to take calculated risks with your safety, so do others.

Be interesting to see what research there is into the benefit of wearing hi vis whilst riding.
 
Goldenstar said:
Yes , the way people go on on here any one would think drivers can only see lurid coloured things.
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In my experience, even hi-viz doesn't make a difference. I hack out round my village a lot, always wearing a hi-viz jacket and horse wears a light weight sheet in yellow that also has a flashing light on his bum.

I have had many drivers pretty much ignore the fact that I'm even there. I had one young woman try to squeeze her car between me and some bollards, how she didn't hit us I do not know and I'm thankful that I have such a sane and sensible 4 year old.

I don't know what the answer is, but in all honesty, I don't think hi-viz makes a difference at all, a driver who is an ass will drive like an ass regardless of how much hi-viz you're wearing :(
 
Freedom of choice does not explain why someone chooses something stupid, it just allows them to do so. You still need to account for the decision which is what the post is asking for.
 
Rambo, ultra hi viz, ultra high quality and ultra necessary because she's ultra worth it.

7E528F83-FEB8-41BC-983F-740C6E305D30_zpsxblfox40.jpg


Just out in daylight gear:

CA2F5E57-BD86-45EB-A44F-D65823D99FC4_zpsss4gagex.jpg
 
IMO I can"t see why a horse rider would not want to protect themselves and their horse as much as possible on the roads. So IMO I think they are irresponsible if they choose not to wear any Hi Viz
 
I don't think that its about the ass hole drivers! its more about people not being able to see you, there is a chance that someone would have slowed down had they have seen you but because you're not wearing hi viz they were not able to see you until the last minute

There will always be people who think horses shouldn't be on the road and will carry on acting like idiots!! but at least you've given yourself half a chance of being seen earlier by wearing hi viz!

I never used to wear it on my mare, didn't think I needed it as I had a pink jacket, she was light coloured but I have noticed a difference in the way people pass me since I've been wearing it on my bay gelding
 
minkymoo said:
I don't know what the answer is, but in all honesty, I don't think hi-viz makes a difference at all, a driver who is an ass will drive like an ass regardless of how much hi-viz you're wearing :(
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No one thinks hi-viz will magically make a reckless driver sensible, but it will allow many sensible drivers see you that bit sooner and hopefully avoid you.
 
No there isn't an excuse not to wear it. Granted, people might not slow down but they will see you earlier. Emergency services, especially helicopters, can locate you faster when you wear hi-viz, if you were to have a fall somewhere more remote.
 
Rapidash said:
Riding on the roads is what's dangerous. The amount of smug posts on here from people who seem to think hi vis generates some magic forcefield... It doesn't. You're still putting yourself and your horse in the same danger of being hit by a car. Even if the risk was reduced 50% (which seems unlikely) and you like to play the numbers game, here's a tip if you care so much: not riding on the roads reduces the risk to zero.

Someone who doesn't ride on the roads could easily berate you all for needlessly endangering your horses so I'd suggest you all remember that just as you like to take calculated risks with your safety, so do others.

Be interesting to see what research there is into the benefit of wearing hi vis whilst riding.
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Do you think horses should not go on the roads? An interesting idea.
I even wear hi viz when hacking to and from hunt meets, really would you rather look special or have a living horse? Even if it only helps a bit I don't understand why anyone would not wear it. Is vanity really an excuse!?
 
Clodagh said:
Do you think horses should not go on the roads? An interesting idea.
I even wear hi viz when hacking to and from hunt meets, really would you rather look special or have a living horse? Even if it only helps a bit I don't understand why anyone would not wear it. Is vanity really an excuse!?
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More people's lives would be saved each year if we all permanently wore helmets to guard against slips, traffic accidents etc. Certainly more lives than if all riders wore hi vis on the roads... If you're so safety conscious why don't you wear a helmet all the time, especially when walking to the shops/ driving to the supermarket? Is vanity an excuse?

Personally I've got nothing against hi vis at all. And if my pony was better on the roads I'd wear it if we went out. I'm just confused as to why people think you're "suicidal" and an "idiot" for not wearing something that's not proven to make a blind bit of difference.

My point is we all to some degree calculate what risk to run, and you're still running a risk being on the roads at all. People are hysterically claiming they don't want to be the cause of killing some innocent passenger so they wear hi vis. I mean that's an argument to not be on the roads at all...
 
Goldenstar said:
Yes , the way people go on on here any one would think drivers can only see lurid coloured things .
Some people don't wear hats their choice .
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personally I always use hi viz and agree with freedom of choice, given a choice I would rather not injure a horse that is almost invisible under tree lined roads, until I am on top of them, I use rural roads daily and am by no means a fast driver, but more than once I have driven round a bend and only just seen the( usually bay) in front
 
I cannot think of a valid reason not to wear it. I never go out without it if I'm riding/leading a horse on the road or walking the dogs. As a driver I can honestly say it has helped me see riders, dog walkers etc much sooner.
However I also agree that some drivers are going to be ********s regardless.
 
I don't HAVE to, as I don't ride on the road and therefore I do not have to consider road users, however, I ride in thousands of acres of forest, frequently alone, so I do tend to wear brighter colours so that I could be spotted if I had an accident. In the UK I wore either a yellow sailing jacket, or a waterproof highway jacket, and the horse (pure white) wore his Newmarket quarter sheet ... I could be seen from miles up on the mountain I am told. I always wore a hi-viz hat band as it is the first thing many motorists see over a hedge in country lanes.

In hunting season we are decked out in orange, and we all use bear bells.

I do actually think that wearing hi-viz should be as mandatory for horse riders (also cyclists) on the public roads as helmets/hats are for juniors.
 
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Buddy'sMum said:
Surprisingly, not much, according to this recent study:
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news...n-lights-hi-vis-duchy-college-research-500904
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All I've found was a road safety observatory report that looked into accidents in 2011. They were primarily caused by the horse spooking into traffic, or people passing too closely out of ignorance. Hi vis won't help you in either case. No mention of "smidsy" accidents ("sorry mate I i didn't see you "- that's what kills motorcyclists and cyclists and where hi vis actually can make a difference). It was also sniffy about the bhs' " hi vis gives drivers up to 3 seconds extra to react " claim noting this appeared to have no research behind it.

I appreciate and agree with the "you might as well wear it you have nothing to lose" argument but really dont think the evidence is strong enough to warrant accusations of idiocy... It's not like the wearing a helmet/ drink driving/ seatbelt debates where the evidence mounted up.
 
For anyone interested I found these tonight at Tesco, thought they would be brilliant on our carriage when we drive as they just clip on, and if you put a elastic band in the tail you could clip this on your horses tail. they were £ 1. 20 or something - so I thought I would share the tip

IMG_1998_zps62ul06z8.jpg
 
Buddy'sMum said:
Surprisingly, not much benefit, according to this recent study:
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news...n-lights-hi-vis-duchy-college-research-500904
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I'd be interested to know where they circulated it, 353 responses in 4 months is very little in comparison to the number of riders out there. Also using social media in itself would skew the results - many of the riders near me who ride without reflectives are much older and I know that many if not most of them do not use social media much if at all. I would also wonder if those who are bothered about taking part in these type of projects are keener on safety and therefore more likely to ear reflectives - those who are less bothered about their own safety are also less likely to bother responding.
Not a particularly valid piece of research to my mind, and I also think they should do the research with drivers as much as riders - I could report several near misses when I have been driving due to very poor visibility of riders in my area, and I drive carefully because I know where they are likely to be and are not likely to be visible.
 
I agree that hi viz won't protect you from the numpty drivers who either don't know or don't care that they should give horses room but if the fact that I wasn't hi vizzed up was used in their defence or allowed them to escape prosecution because they could say that they couldn't see me after they hit me I would be gutted.

As far as insurance goes, most policies have a clause somewhere saying something about reasonable precautions - it could be argued that no hi viz while you are on the road is unreasonable...

I say the above as somebody who grew up only ever wearing a hat at shows, PC rallies or hunting ( it was kept for best because you didn't want the velvet scuffed if you fell off!!!) and who regularly rode and led ponies on the road in headcollars and bareback but times have changed and our habits have to change with them IMO.
 
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