Has the "correct" jumping position changed?

[GrassChop]

I've seen a couple of pictures and videos recently of people jumping their horses on clinics/lessons etc and no one seems to be folding that much anymore. More staying upright even if the jump isn't particularly small.

I'm no jumper or professional by any means.

I remember when people started folding and stretching their arms out in front of them at one point!

I can't find any examples on Google of what I mean!

 

[Spotherisk]

This is what I think of as a near perfect jump position… very very slightly behind the movement perhaps, but better that than being in front…

Bill Steinkraus jumping, many years ago.

 

[GrassChop]

This is what I think of as a near perfect jump position… very very slightly behind the movement perhaps, but better that than being in front…

Bill Steinkraus jumping, many years ago.View attachment 137802

That's similar to what I always thought was the correct position too but with the hands not as far forwards.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

I've seen both extremes; over folding and being too upright. I'm not sure what's "trending" at the moment though. O


Also, what happened to a proper release or staying off of your horses back and not hitting the saddle before the horse lands? I would've been absolutely crucified for that with many of my previous jumping trainers. Rightly so, really.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

TBF I prefer to be nearly seated when the horse is landing but absorbing with my legs and not my seat if that makes sense, I’ve been chucked too many times but a horse stumble/trip etc on landing or deciding the second element was a big fat nope to take the risk of not being in the plate on touch down.

I also think over folding is a thing as is flinging yourself up the horses neck different strokes for different folks I suppose

 

[CanteringCarrot]

TBF I prefer to be nearly seated when the horse is landing but absorbing with my legs and not my seat if that makes sense, I’ve been chucked too many times but a horse stumble/trip etc on landing or deciding the second element was a big fat nope to take the risk of not being in the plate on touch down.

That makes sense and that's how I was taught. That's not what I meant in my post above though. Nearly seated and absorbing with your legs is different from what I'm referring to.

 

[Maxidoodle]

I seem to see a lot more images (and in real life) of overbending. The photo attached is a prime example (I know the person, not in the UK).

 

[Spotherisk]

@Maxidoodle that reminds me of jump lessons off the horse! You’d be asked to balance on a jump pole in your jump position, this rider would definitely topple forwards!

 

[TheMule]

I seem to see a lot more images (and in real life) of overbending. The photo attached is a prime example (I know the person, not in the UK).

That doesn’t bother me- the horse clearly has freedom and is making a beautiful shape. Far rather that than someone behind the movement and restricting the horse which is far more common to see in amateurs

 

[Maxidoodle]

@Maxidoodle that reminds me of jump lessons off the horse! You’d be asked to balance on a jump pole in your jump position, this rider would definitely topple forwards!

She used to get “pinged” off a lot and also broke fingers on landing but it was how they’re all taught to jump.

 

[Maxidoodle]

That doesn’t bother me- the horse clearly has freedom and is making a beautiful shape. Far rather that than someone behind the movement and restricting the horse which is far more common to see in amateurs

Absolutely regarding the horse but it’s a very unstable position for the rider, hence her being “pinged” off quite often.

 

[Rowreach]

The Evolution of the Lower-Leg Position

Jim Wofford explains how the classic lower-leg position and the way we ride over fences have evolved from something quite different.

practicalhorsemanmag.com

Explains it quite well.

Fwiw I always refused to teach the “jumping position” to riders - that thing the BHS likes to do in walk over a pole , which just makes people stiffer and more unbalanced. Getting riders to absorb through their hips knees and ankles and getting them securely off their backsides and off their hands allows them to have multiple “jumping positions” in the toolbox, not just one set one.

 

[Maxidoodle]

The Evolution of the Lower-Leg Position

Jim Wofford explains how the classic lower-leg position and the way we ride over fences have evolved from something quite different.

practicalhorsemanmag.com

Explains it quite well.

Fwiw I always refused to teach the “jumping position” to riders - that thing the BHS likes to do in walk over a pole , which just makes people stiffer and more unbalanced. Getting riders to absorb through their hips knees and ankles and getting them securely off their backsides and off their hands allows them to have multiple “jumping positions” in the toolbox, not just one set one.

Great article, thanks

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

That makes sense and that's how I was taught. That's not what I meant in my post above though. Nearly seated and absorbing with your legs is different from what I'm referring to.

That’s fair enough. I was always taught as well that the jump should only ever see the soles on your boots on approach and going over. Mind you that’s me going back to my pony club days

 

[IrishMilo]

I really think that anyone criticising someone's jumping technique should post a photo of themselves first

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I really think that anyone criticising someone's jumping technique should post a photo of themselves first

So what’s the difference between seen to critique and wondering why jumping positions have changed so much??

Just curious as I don’t think anyone is critiquing anyone in particular on this thread

 

[Maxidoodle]

.

 

[GrassChop]

So what’s the difference between seen to critique and wondering why jumping positions have changed so much??

Just curious as I don’t think anyone is critiquing anyone in particular on this thread

My thoughts too.

 

[Rowreach]

I think it was a joke ...

 

[CanteringCarrot]

For everything I criticize I will make sure to post pictures to establish my credentials. Whether it's dressage, jumping, or frying a fish.

 

[Rowreach]

Oh, maybe not

 

[IrishMilo]

I mean, it's one thing to say 'Yeah, things seemed to have changed a bit' vs, 'Here's a photo of someone I know that I'm going to post on a public forum as an example of what not to do'.

Fwiw, who is actually in the right position 100% all of the time? Every horse will give you a different feel, a different style and will make you adapt in different ways. To jump 1.15+ competitively is damn impressive.

 

[GrassChop]

I'm confused... this thread was only about if jumping positions had changed and if the more up right way was now correct.

 

[LEC]

In answer to your question, what has changed is educating riders with the basics.

It is easier and better to teach riders to stay upright when learning to jump to balance better through their legs and seat and maintain their shoulders into a fence especially at the heights you learn which will be under 80cm. They will be safer as an adult who will usually lack balance and as a child who are usually weaker. Also longer term it helps the development of not being in front of the movement into a jump and unbalancing the horse.

Basically at anything 80cm and below you barely need to move as should be able to absorb energy and be soft enough for the horse at that height.

I watched a US kid riding the other day in modern light seat on YouTube and she was clearly a nice rider but literally fell twice while trying horses when they did anything unexpected and both times it was a slight spook.

 

[Rowreach]

In answer to your question, what has changed is educating riders with the basics.

It is easier and better to teach riders to stay upright when learning to jump to balance better through their legs and seat and maintain their shoulders into a fence especially at the heights you learn which will be under 80cm. They will be safer as an adult who will usually lack balance and as a child who are usually weaker. Also longer term it helps the development of not being in front of the movement into a jump and unbalancing the horse.

Basically at anything 80cm and below you barely need to move as should be able to absorb energy and be soft enough for the horse at that height.

I watched a US kid riding the other day in modern light seat on YouTube and she was clearly a nice rider but literally fell twice while trying horses when they did anything unexpected and both times it was a slight spook.

Generally, if people were just taught to sit up all the time it would solve a lot of things. Seat, feet, hands and eyes sort those and then practise.

 

[GrassChop]

In answer to your question, what has changed is educating riders with the basics.

It is easier and better to teach riders to stay upright when learning to jump to balance better through their legs and seat and maintain their shoulders into a fence especially at the heights you learn which will be under 80cm. They will be safer as an adult who will usually lack balance and as a child who are usually weaker. Also longer term it helps the development of not being in front of the movement into a jump and unbalancing the horse.

Basically at anything 80cm and below you barely need to move as should be able to absorb energy and be soft enough for the horse at that height.

I watched a US kid riding the other day in modern light seat on YouTube and she was clearly a nice rider but literally fell twice while trying horses when they did anything unexpected and both times it was a slight spook.

Thank you.

This would make sense. I queried it though because I've seen these upright positions being used in SJ or XC clinics or lessons with experienced riders and not necessarily small jumps so I just wondered if the position had evolved.

 

[humblepie]

I see a lot less giving of the horse’s head so really keeping a hold over the fence which I do wonder if comes down to rider core strength and seat and not being able to pick the horse back up after the fence. Caveat I have not show jumped for years and was taught to jump in the day of heavy wooden poles and velvet hats …..

 

[HeresHoping]

I see an awful lot of socking the poor horse in the teeth; or failure to let the horse 'go' over the fence so no bascule can be achieved. Hands in the crotch seems to be the norm. And then they wonder why the horse starts stopping. Maintain contact over the fence, yes. But this means allowing your hands forward over the fence.