Head tossing help please.

[Dwyran_gold]

Ok so as some may know I’ve recently backed a driving horse for riding as they’ve been out of driven work for about a year due to owners work etc. He’s coming along great! However he is part of a pair and the owner has seen how well the one I’ve started is doing three months on and wondered if I’d do a little bit with his other driving buddy.
but the head shaking, ? he does this in the cart as well apparently, he fights with the bit, chomping constantly and that means he’s not paying attention to anything else and trips. I’ve tried:
1. Keeping an elastic light contact but firm in the position that if he shakes or pulls it creates more contact so perhaps persuade him to come off it (if that makes sense)
2. Distracting him with an ever so slight vibration every time he shakes and pulls (as suggested by an instructor) Which resulted in going backwards in to a ditch a few times so obviously not the way to go.
3. Giving a really light rein with hardly any contact with no joy if anything he was worse.
4. Nose band and no nose band, no difference.
Any advice?
Snaffle bit. 7yo Irish cob.

 

[Quigleyandme]

Have his teeth been seen to recently because it reads like he has discomfort in his mouth. Have you considered changing the bit? I had a give away horse that came with a jointed snaffle and was snatching the reins, yawing and evading the bit. I changed it to a ported snaffle with a lozenge and the behaviours stopped immediately.

 

[Micropony]

Once you have checked out the obvious re teeth etc. you could try him in a fly mask to see if that helps. I have one who's very sensitive to bright light, and with one of those UV filter fly masks, or any fly mask really, it's completely resolved. If that's what it is, Equilibrium do net attachments for the bridle. A bit off the wall, but pretty easy to eliminate.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

As above, teeth check and ask vet for cranial check too. Ask bit specialist for advice on bitting.
Then check browband isn't too tight, headpiece isn't pushing on ears.
Go back to basics on long reins - as you'll know headshaking in harness causes huge problems.

 

[Dwyran_gold]

Have his teeth been seen to recently because it reads like he has discomfort in his mouth. Have you considered changing the bit? I had a give away horse that came with a jointed snaffle and was snatching the reins, yawing and evading the bit. I changed it to a ported snaffle with a lozenge and the behaviours stopped immediately.

his teeth have been done not long ago, about 3 months. Thank you! I’ll try a change of bit x

 

[Dwyran_gold]

Once you have checked out the obvious re teeth etc. you could try him in a fly mask to see if that helps. I have one who's very sensitive to bright light, and with one of those UV filter fly masks, or any fly mask really, it's completely resolved. If that's what it is, Equilibrium do net attachments for the bridle. A bit off the wall, but pretty easy to eliminate.

teeth are all good, well they were done 3 months ago. Thank you! It’s worth a shot! x

 

[Dwyran_gold]

As above, teeth check and ask vet for cranial check too. Ask bit specialist for advice on bitting.
Then check browband isn't too tight, headpiece isn't pushing on ears.
Go back to basics on long reins - as you'll know headshaking in harness causes huge problems.

he’s had teeth done not long ago. What could be wrong with cranium? He’s had back done and a clean bill of health from vet before starting ridden work. apparently he’s always been a slight pain in the backside with head shaking but when in a pair spends the time looking at his driving buddy or nipping him! so the problem wasn’t as bad X

 

[Sossigpoker]

If back problems are ruled out then he could be an actual head shaker.

 

[Dwyran_gold]

If back problems are ruled out then he could be an actual head shaker.

hes had his back done. it’s the bit he’s playing with, he chops Constantly and throws it around So moves his head. He’s had teeth done as well. It’s just such a battle because he’s sensitive and any firmer contact on his mouth he either reverses or plants but as he’s just starting he’s not understanding commands 100% quite yet under saddle and In the cart he’s drove with hardly any contact at all but under saddle a softer rein makes things worse, if I could get it sorted it would make the process of teaching him much easier. Perhaps I’ll try a different bit as mentioned above.

 

[Dwyran_gold]

Have his teeth been seen to recently because it reads like he has discomfort in his mouth. Have you considered changing the bit? I had a give away horse that came with a jointed snaffle and was snatching the reins, yawing and evading the bit. I changed it to a ported snaffle with a lozenge and the behaviours stopped immediately.

could you send me a link to the one you have or similar please? X

 

[horsimous]

My friends pony would chomp terribly on his bitbut was great when it was changed to a different type of mouth, eg linked bit to straight bar

 

[brighteyes]

Head-shaking is quite a distinctive set of movements and behaviours which seem to increase in severity. Ours began with a weird 'tic' and progressed to sneezing and snorting, more violent tics and some larger movements. Stopped it completely with an Equilibrium nose net, which I purchased for peanuts off eBay. I was very skeptical so wasn't going to blow £30+ She tics if the wind blows it off her nose (so I loosely flash-strap it down) and is still a bit tossy with flies.

 

[SpotsandBays]

I’ve had an improvement with the pro tech masta poll guard. Doesn’t stop it entirely but it has reduced it massively. Mine only does it away from home when he’s in exciting/stressful situations

 

[Quigleyandme]

could you send me a link to the one you have or similar please? X

I use Neue Schule bits. They are rather expensive but they are beautifully engineered and I expect they spend rather a lot on R&D. They also retain their resale value well. Their website has a lot of useful information and you can email Heather for bespoke advice. They have a bit bank so you can experiment with different designs.

 

[Dasher66]

Three different horse dentists missed my horses wolf tooth. Including the highly qualified, highly recommended, very expensive one.
Stand in front of the horse and put your thumbs on the bars where the bit would rest and feel for any tiny lump.
It is usually cheap to have it removed.

 

[teddypops]

One of my connemaras was terrible with a snaffle or any other jointed bit. Constantly chomping on it and head tossing. I changed it to a straight flexi bit which was much better but still not great. Currently using a hackamore and she’s like a different horse. She had every check done possible by vets and she has no physical issues.

 

[ycbm]

If none of what's suggested above changes anything, I think I'd probably want to x ray his neck.
.

 

[Errin Paddywack]

What about trying a rubber snaffle?

 

[Nudibranch]

What bit is he in at the moment?
Before going down the very expensive brand route and deciding on something very specific, I would try at least a couple of different mouthpieces. So say he is in a single jointed snaffle, try a straight bar and something like a french link (but with a lozenge rather than the flat link). Absolutely no point in deciding he needs a "triple vorsprung bendy twirl" and splashing out £100 plus when you really need to just try some different types to see what suits him.

 

[scruffyponies]

Bitting: A driving horse may be used to a straight bar, so could object to jointed bits. Try cambridge or pelham with loose chain.
Some horses don't settle unless the cheek is fixed - try an egg-butt or boucher, as opposed to loose ring.
Oh, and check the bit is high enough in the mouth, as a low bit will make most horses head-shake.

Allergies and irritants: A quick test is to smear vasaline in his nostrils. If you see an improvement, something is irritating the little hairs in his nose - allergy, dust or even infection.

There are lots of other things it could be, of course, but these are where I would start.

 

[bubsqueaks]

Ive noticed this with our Connie who's been back in work for 5 months following a 2 year break with ulcers.
He never used to do it & doesnt do it all the time but does it when he's being asked to give more with his body or back.
Ridden in neue schuele
He is a sensitive chap & we believe its his way of dealing with anxiety/nerves due to when he does it & when he doesnt.
He's had full work up, scoped clear, teeth xrays, saddle checks, physio.
Its just his anxiety at present which isnt surprizing given the pain he was in with glandular ulcers
Maybe your pony just needs more time to adjust to going from driving to ridden.

 

[Dwyran_gold]

This is all great advice thank you so much! Lots to think about and try, to start I will try an unjointed bit and see if that makes any difference ?? Xx

 

[teddypops]

One of my connemaras was terrible with a snaffle or any other jointed bit. Constantly chomping on it and head tossing. I changed it to a straight flexi bit which was much better but still not great. Currently using a hackamore and she’s like a different horse. She had every check done possible by vets and she has no physical issues.

Meant to add that my girl was also used for driving previously.

 

[Sossigpoker]

hes had his back done. it’s the bit he’s playing with, he chops Constantly and throws it around So moves his head. He’s had teeth done as well. It’s just such a battle because he’s sensitive and any firmer contact on his mouth he either reverses or plants but as he’s just starting he’s not understanding commands 100% quite yet under saddle and In the cart he’s drove with hardly any contact at all but under saddle a softer rein makes things worse, if I could get it sorted it would make the process of teaching him much easier. Perhaps I’ll try a different bit as mentioned above.

Mine really chomps on the bit too, he's happier in a happy mouth than a metallic bit though. But his is down to anxiety, as soon as he doesn't understand or something happens he starts chewing.

Try magnesium and salt in his feed and removing alfalfa - if there is trigeminal nerve irritation, which is what head shaking is , this might provide some relief.
Doing a bute trial with the vet could also show if the behaviour is pain related - if it improves whilst on bute then it is caused by pain.

 

[Brownmare]

I have a horse that came to me with a market harborough for hacking as she threw her head up and down constantly. It stopped instantly when I took her shoes off and put her in boots and pads for ridden work. Another thing for you to consider ?

 

[Carrottom]

As a previous poster suggested, check for blind wolf teeth. If the vet or dentist isn't told there is a problem they may not look for them.