Head tossing to show impatience, horse not rider!

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oldie48

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Mr B has improved on hacks to the point that I thought we'd cracked it. Over the summer he's been pretty relaxed and has more or less stopped rushing to get home. If he does start to rush I've found it pretty easy to settle him again. However, he's just started to be in overnight again and this has coincided with him doing a lot of very rude head tossing, more towards the end of the ride but today he started within fifteen minutes of leaving home having set off in a lovely relaxed manner.He's a big strong horse and it's very uncomfortable although it doesn't bother me I'd like to find a way of nipping this in the bud. He also head tosses when he's waiting for his feed or anticipating going out. He's a bright horse and he now understands that he doesn't get fed until he moves away from the door and stops his tossing and he stops tossing as soon as I put his head collar on to take him out, so I'm pretty confident that it's nothing I'm doing that starts it on a hack. He hacks out in a turtle top, cavesson noseband and I like to use a running martingale when I hack out (correctly fitted). Any ideas gratefully received. He's a full up 16.2 mainly TB with a dash of ID, he's forward going and sensitive and generally is the sweetest horse and an absolute gentleman on the ground.
 
Do you think he might be in a bit of pain? my horse has done it in the past, and if he could he would also rear, and its always been just before he's gone lame. hes very good a letting me know when he's not right.
 
No, I'm pretty confident it's impatience but I will check everything. thanks for suggesting it. I do have a little question mark in my head about his GP saddle so I'll hack out in his dressage saddle next time as I know that fits and see if he's any better.
Kezzabell2 said:
Do you think he might be in a bit of pain? my horse has done it in the past, and if he could he would also rear, and its always been just before he's gone lame. hes very good a letting me know when he's not right.
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It's his day off so he was turned out first thing and he just exploded! He's done some great work in the school this week as he's been more energetic now he's in at night. So, i've decided to turn him out for an hour or so before I hack him to see if this helps him to be more settled but continue to school first thing so I've got the energy to work with. Looked at GP saddle and I think it's OK but will get it checked.
 
So much for my confidence!!! I had the saddler out this afternoon, the dressage saddle is fine as I thought but the GP which I use for hacking needed reflocking at the front. It sat on his back OK but when girthed dropped at the front and would have been pinching a bit. I hack out with a sheepskin seat saver so I hadn't noticed. so thanks Kezzbell for suggesting pain rather than impatience, doesn't it show that behaviour issues often stem from pain. I feel rather chastened!
oldie48 said:
No, I'm pretty confident it's impatience but I will check everything. thanks for suggesting it. I do have a little question mark in my head about his GP saddle so I'll hack out in his dressage saddle next time as I know that fits and see if he's any better.
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oldie48 said:
So much for my confidence!!! I had the saddler out this afternoon, the dressage saddle is fine as I thought but the GP which I use for hacking needed reflocking at the front. It sat on his back OK but when girthed dropped at the front and would have been pinching a bit. I hack out with a sheepskin seat saver so I hadn't noticed. so thanks Kezzbell for suggesting pain rather than impatience, doesn't it show that behaviour issues often stem from pain. I feel rather chastened!
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Hiya

I'm so pleased that you have got to the bottom of it!! so hacking in your dressage saddle until the GP is flocked then :)

I only suggested pain because I've had sooooo sooo sooo many problems with my young horse!! and he is so very good a letting me know when something isn't right!! last year it started with tossing his head about when I tried to get on!! then running off when I went to put his bridle on! to eventually rearing vertically with me!

now he did turn out to be lame, but it was only noticeable on a tight circle, and he basically has arthritic joints but each time he starts messing about now, I can guarantee a few days later he will be lame!! he came back into work 2 months after after having his hocks fused! he reared on the 3 hacks that I did, i decided he was napping, but the next day he was hoping lame! and has now had to have his shoes removed!!

So from now on, I will always rule out pain first! :)
 
I think I was confused because he uses "head tossing" in other situations but I did have a question mark in my head about the saddle as he usually stands very still to be tacked up but had starting to move a bit. Hopefully we've got to the problem now as the saddle was reflocked. I shall hack him out on thursday and hopefully we won't have any head tossing. Sorry to hear of your horse, so sad when they have arthritic changes when young, I hope you an sort him out.
 
I hacked him today and for the first part of the ride he was very relaxed, then the head tossing started again. It's been worse but it really is a bit of a pain. I'm thinking of using a standing martingale instead of the running martingale that I'm using a the moment. I have no experience with them at all, I don't think he's the sort to panic and rear. What do you think?
 
Hummm I'm the same, never used one either! but I'd rather not restrict a horse until I know for sure!

Have you tried hacking in the dressage saddle to see how he goes in that?
 
I expect you will think I'm terrible but I tapped my welsh on the head with a schooling whip when she did it (really, she tapped her own head I just held it in position) and she soon stopped doing it. She only did it on the last km home and it was one of many bad habits she came with. Prior to that I had her in a micklem bridle and various other "fixes" which made no difference. It's a rather welsh thing, to toss one's lovely hair around to get your point across.

She almost certainly was getting tired/fed up but I'm afraid I wasn't happy with her expression of that fact so that was the action I took.

She was a serious problem horse when I got her and she's turning into a rather lovely horse now so I'm not a complete demon. (Snaffle, micklem, no martingale and so on).
 
I don't carry a whip as he's a bit whip shy however, I think possibly I'm pussy footing around him a bit too much. He can be a bit of a prima donna. I think I may carry a short one and give him a tap and a growl. He's not a lazy horse at all but when he's been out at night he can be off the aids when we school. If I pick up a schooling whip and trot a 20 minute circle, I can drop it and suddenly he's listening! I don't need to touch him with it. I've tried giving him a good kick then pushing him into the bridle and it stops him for a few minutes then he starts up again.
 
Not sure a short one would work as he would know you did it where as you are aiming for them thinking there's something to hit their head on if they throw it about. I just held it up her neck so that if she threw her head up she connected with it herself. If that didn't get through her skull (she's not whip shy at all, quite the opposite someone has done a good job of deadening her to a whip - she was a napper, I've actually sensitised her to it!) I would give her a tap as her head came up, which she really did not like. Her other go to, was to stand on her hind legs, which she has not done with me, however at the slightest threat I've tapped her head. As I said she was a bit of a problem but it was all mouth and no trousers.

Best thing with a whip shy horse tho is to carry one and not use it. My coloured mare was absolutely a terrorised by whips or even if your reins flapped at her she would shoot forward (or if you patted her!) just wasn't used to it really. She's fine now with a whip.
 
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