hello! new here and in need of advice please

[APonyforPod]

Hello everyone, i'm new to horses and have little equestrian experience, so am needing friendly advice please. i have ridden a handful of times as a child and adult and My children enjoyed riding lessons at a local stables before lockdown, and of course one is always asking for her own pony! (I have no intention of getting her one yet). I'd like to get more of an idea of what we would be getting ourselves into. We are lucky enough to live backing onto fields, and the farmer has just offered us rental of 5 acres for a few years. We would be able to sublet, and our tenants could put in shelters etc. I have asked around locally to horsey friends to guage interest, but I feel really out of my depth regarding terms, contracts, all that sort of thing. I am concerned about advertising more widely - is it acceptable to ask for references etc? As you can tell I am completely clueless, but willing to learn! Thanks in advance!

 

[PurBee]

Is the 5 acre field boundary fenced properly with clear access and a water supply?
How exposed is the field to the weather? Hilly without many trees or hedging for protection or ‘inland’ and plently of natural protection for animals to get out of the prevailing wind direction?
Thats the basic considerations for keeping grazing animals without stabling, in a field 24/7.

Hopefully more people will answer about the legalities of field shelters - because its a temporary shelter it used to be fine to just erect them, but not sure now with planning rules in the uk..i presume?

Depending on soil type and drainage of field, horses mush up the ground pretty well , creating mud and ruining grazing grass. So i personally wouldn’t want more than 2 large horses on 5 acres for grazing 24/7.
It’s the winter weather we have to consider more, and the ground being mostly a lot wetter than summer and not allowing the land to become a mud-pit.
As there are no stables or dry turn-out area for the horses to be put in to relieve the land during the worst weather, you dont want to overstock the field.


Now is a good time to assess the land - walk the field and assess how sodden the soil is, does it slope to allow quick drainage?

Once the above is considered and answered to be suitable for grazing 24/7 - (i have some fields that couldnt take 24/7 grazing by horses the soil/drainage/high rainfall makes them so unsuitable) - then you can think about contracts.

Which hopefully someone else will answer more fully as ive never sub-let land.

If you’re thinking of hoping to save space for you to in the next couple of years get a pony for your kids?....then perhaps you’d be best to sublet initially to one person with a horse and pony, rather than have a couple of horse owners sublet, and you may have to kick one off if you then want to use the field for your pony to be added. I wouldnt be happy about managing land, erecting a field shelter, sorting boundaries, fencing etc only to do the work and then be kicked off 12 months later due to owner wanting to now use the field for themselves (now its all properly set up for horses by me).

Just like with a property, the high cost/maintenance jobs should be covered by the owner of the land. If the fencing is rotten and the horses escape, the owner , if they are letting the land for grazing are responsible for it to be fit for purpose. They should pay for the fencing to be fixed etc.

Is the farmer aware you’re thinking of sub-letting? Are they ok with that?

The idea seems simple on the face of it, field for grazing, but when you get into the nitty gritty there’s a lot to consider, mostly who’s responsible for the cost of replacement fencing, gates, re-seeding if needed, cost of shelter, water access/drinkers to be installed. You as the main rental of the field, can’t expect your subletters to fork out to make it suitable for grazing. It HAS to be set up for that....for you to charge a fee that makes it worth your while.

Otherwise the national nominal cost of grazing per acre can be searched on google - and if theres nothing but grass and everything else needs sorting, you cant in reality expect people to pay over the nominal fee if the facilities are needing to be put in by your sub-letters.

The cost per acre for rough mixed grass grazing in my area on medium quality land is no more than €100 per annum. That’s with a water supply, boundary fencing, and gated access. For land without any fencing, decent grass/mostly weeds, no water supply, it’s not worth more than 50 per annum due to work/costs of making it suitable.

 

[teddypops]

Is the 5 acre field boundary fenced properly with clear access and a water supply?
How exposed is the field to the weather? Hilly without many trees or hedging for protection or ‘inland’ and plently of natural protection for animals to get out of the prevailing wind direction?
Thats the basic considerations for keeping grazing animals without stabling, in a field 24/7.

Hopefully more people will answer about the legalities of field shelters - because its a temporary shelter it used to be fine to just erect them, but not sure now with planning rules in the uk..i presume?

Depending on soil type and drainage of field, horses mush up the ground pretty well , creating mud and ruining grazing grass. So i personally wouldn’t want more than 2 large horses on 5 acres for grazing 24/7.
It’s the winter weather we have to consider more, and the ground being mostly a lot wetter than summer and not allowing the land to become a mud-pit.
As there are no stables or dry turn-out area for the horses to be put in to relieve the land during the worst weather, you dont want to overstock the field.


Now is a good time to assess the land - walk the field and assess how sodden the soil is, does it slope to allow quick drainage?

Once the above is considered and answered to be suitable for grazing 24/7 - (i have some fields that couldnt take 24/7 grazing by horses the soil/drainage/high rainfall makes them so unsuitable) - then you can think about contracts.

Which hopefully someone else will answer more fully as ive never sub-let land.

If you’re thinking of hoping to save space for you to in the next couple of years get a pony for your kids?....then perhaps you’d be best to sublet initially to one person with a horse and pony, rather than have a couple of horse owners sublet, and you may have to kick one off if you then want to use the field for your pony to be added. I wouldnt be happy about managing land, erecting a field shelter, sorting boundaries, fencing etc only to do the work and then be kicked off 12 months later due to owner wanting to now use the field for themselves (now its all properly set up for horses by me).

Just like with a property, the high cost/maintenance jobs should be covered by the owner of the land. If the fencing is rotten and the horses escape, the owner , if they are letting the land for grazing are responsible for it to be fit for purpose. They should pay for the fencing to be fixed etc.

Is the farmer aware you’re thinking of sub-letting? Are they ok with that?

The idea seems simple on the face of it, field for grazing, but when you get into the nitty gritty there’s a lot to consider, mostly who’s responsible for the cost of replacement fencing, gates, re-seeding if needed, cost of shelter, water access/drinkers to be installed. You as the main rental of the field, can’t expect your subletters to fork out to make it suitable for grazing. It HAS to be set up for that....for you to charge a fee that makes it worth your while.

Otherwise the national nominal cost of grazing per acre can be searched on google - and if theres nothing but grass and everything else needs sorting, you cant in reality expect people to pay over the nominal fee if the facilities are needing to be out in by your sub-letters.

The cost per acre for rough mixed grass grazing in my area on medium quality land is no more than €100 per annum. That’s with a water supply, boundary fencing, and gated access. For land without any fencing, decent grass/mostly weeds, no water supply, it’s not worth more than 50 per annum due to work/costs of making it suitable.

A 5 acre field rented out for horses is worth a lot more than this. There would also be a queue of people after it.

 

[PurBee]

A 5 acre field rented out for horses is worth a lot more than this. There would also be a queue of people after it.

it depends on the field. Not all fields are equal. Theres 5 acre fields on clay that are complete mudpits right now and 5 acre field on loam that are stocking a good number of animals and providing grazing.

i quoted my area per acre/per soil type. It’s vastly different depending on land type and area - and of course in the UK the demand for grazing land is very high, so even a terrible field will attract customers, until the field gets completely trashed, and they move on.

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

A 5 acre field rented out for horses is worth a lot more than this. There would also be a queue of people after it.

Absolutely. Round here a 5 acre field of mixed but usable grazing is likely to be 100pcm per equine, or (as a friend is doing) paying 300pcm for her 4 from December to late April/early May on a 4.5 acre field which doesn't have water on tap.

 

[APonyforPod]

Is the 5 acre field boundary fenced properly with clear access and a water supply?
How exposed is the field to the weather? Hilly without many trees or hedging for protection or ‘inland’ and plently of natural protection for animals to get out of the prevailing wind direction?
Thats the basic considerations for keeping grazing animals without stabling, in a field 24/7.

Hopefully more people will answer about the legalities of field shelters - because its a temporary shelter it used to be fine to just erect them, but not sure now with planning rules in the uk..i presume?

Depending on soil type and drainage of field, horses mush up the ground pretty well , creating mud and ruining grazing grass. So i personally wouldn’t want more than 2 large horses on 5 acres for grazing 24/7.
It’s the winter weather we have to consider more, and the ground being mostly a lot wetter than summer and not allowing the land to become a mud-pit.
As there are no stables or dry turn-out area for the horses to be put in to relieve the land during the worst weather, you dont want to overstock the field.


Now is a good time to assess the land - walk the field and assess how sodden the soil is, does it slope to allow quick drainage?

Once the above is considered and answered to be suitable for grazing 24/7 - (i have some fields that couldnt take 24/7 grazing by horses the soil/drainage/high rainfall makes them so unsuitable) - then you can think about contracts.

Which hopefully someone else will answer more fully as ive never sub-let land.

If you’re thinking of hoping to save space for you to in the next couple of years get a pony for your kids?....then perhaps you’d be best to sublet initially to one person with a horse and pony, rather than have a couple of horse owners sublet, and you may have to kick one off if you then want to use the field for your pony to be added. I wouldnt be happy about managing land, erecting a field shelter, sorting boundaries, fencing etc only to do the work and then be kicked off 12 months later due to owner wanting to now use the field for themselves (now its all properly set up for horses by me).

Just like with a property, the high cost/maintenance jobs should be covered by the owner of the land. If the fencing is rotten and the horses escape, the owner , if they are letting the land for grazing are responsible for it to be fit for purpose. They should pay for the fencing to be fixed etc.

Is the farmer aware you’re thinking of sub-letting? Are they ok with that?

The idea seems simple on the face of it, field for grazing, but when you get into the nitty gritty there’s a lot to consider, mostly who’s responsible for the cost of replacement fencing, gates, re-seeding if needed, cost of shelter, water access/drinkers to be installed. You as the main rental of the field, can’t expect your subletters to fork out to make it suitable for grazing. It HAS to be set up for that....for you to charge a fee that makes it worth your while.

Otherwise the national nominal cost of grazing per acre can be searched on google - and if theres nothing but grass and everything else needs sorting, you cant in reality expect people to pay over the nominal fee if the facilities are needing to be put in by your sub-letters.

The cost per acre for rough mixed grass grazing in my area on medium quality land is no more than €100 per annum. That’s with a water supply, boundary fencing, and gated access. For land without any fencing, decent grass/mostly weeds, no water supply, it’s not worth more than 50 per annum due to work/costs of making it suitable.

 

[APonyforPod]

Thanks everybody for your responses so far, they have been really helpful and given me plenty to think about. IN answer to come of the queries, yes, the farmer is happy for us to sublet and the field will have water (troughs on meters) and electricity for fencing, which he will install. It is south facing and relatively flat, though having said that it must be a very slight slope as it does not get too boggy in winter, although how it will fare with a couple of horses on it is another matter.... Any structures would need to be put in place by the person letting from me.

 

[PurBee]

Absolutely. Round here a 5 acre field of mixed but usable grazing is likely to be 100pcm per equine, or (as a friend is doing) paying 300pcm for her 4 from December to late April/early May on a 4.5 acre field which doesn't have water on tap.

yes, it really does depend on area, which op hasnt said nor country.
where i am theres lots of land unused, and the owners would give it for free just for it to be maintained!

Area very much dictates supply/demand/price.

 

[APonyforPod]

yes, it really does depend on area, which op hasnt said nor country.
where i am theres lots of land unused, and the owners would give it for free just for it to be maintained!

Area very much dictates supply/demand/price.

Area is Hants/Sussex

 

[Littlewills]

yes, it really does depend on area, which op hasnt said nor country.
where i am theres lots of land unused, and the owners would give it for free just for it to be maintained!

Area very much dictates supply/demand/price.

Not in any area I have ever lived in and I've lived up and down the UK. I currently pay £350 a month for grass livery for two ponies. But that includes use of a school etc. £100 pcm seems to be the going rate for just a field based grass livery. It would be pretty much unheard of for liveries to buy and install a shelter when on a monthly livery contract. I also wouldnt entertain any sort of livery if it didnt have post and rail perimeter fencing. Splitting it with electric is fine, but you do need proper fencing around the outside.