Help! Kissing Spine?!

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AbboGirl97

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In need of some advice!! (I have called a vet that is due soon)

My 10year old gelding has always put he's ears back when being ridden for aslong as I can remember. We initially thought it was a relucance to work in school as he is a very lazy horse!!

However, recently these ears back have been joined by tail swishing, bucking in trot, refusing to go forward in trot and pulling down harshly on reins. He is also quite twitchy over withers before a saddle cloth is placed but never girthy or grumpy about it going on or being done up. Fine being brushed, hands run down the spine, walked under sadde, ears up and alert and happy. Trotting is the problem- only under saddle. Perfect in hand.

He has never bolted or reared and is generally quite bombproof however not completely. Doesn't mind me getting on or off him. Has had chiropractor who can't find anything wrong, teeth checked and saddle fitted. He has got bone spavin but has been treated. I know back pain goes hand in hand with spavin but as previously said he has back checked. I had a friend mention about the ks as he shows of signs under saddle so I wonder if anyone had experiences like mine?

Tia x
 
AbboGirl97 said:
In need of some advice!! (I have called a vet that is due soon)

My 10year old gelding has always put he's ears back when being ridden for aslong as I can remember. We initially thought it was a relucance to work in school as he is a very lazy horse!!

However, recently these ears back have been joined by tail swishing, bucking in trot, refusing to go forward in trot and pulling down harshly on reins. He is also quite twitchy over withers before a saddle cloth is placed but never girthy or grumpy about it going on or being done up. Fine being brushed, hands run down the spine, walked under sadde, ears up and alert and happy. Trotting is the problem- only under saddle. Perfect in hand.

He has never bolted or reared and is generally quite bombproof however not completely. Doesn't mind me getting on or off him. Has had chiropractor who can't find anything wrong, teeth checked and saddle fitted. He has got bone spavin but has been treated. I know back pain goes hand in hand with spavin but as previously said he has back checked. I had a friend mention about the ks as he shows of signs under saddle so I wonder if anyone had experiences like mine?

Tia x
Click to expand...

Because horses use different muscles in trot to the muscles they use in walk or canter you might find it is easier for him to avoid trot. When my horse had a problem he used to avoid trot, finding it much easier to canter or walk.

I know you say the spavin has been treated but how long ago and to what extent? My horse had intra articular injections of steroid/HA and then when they proved to be no longer effective went on to have tildren which kept it at abeyance for a few years before going on to have fusion with ethanol, and some horses can go 18 months in between injections, sadly others can't even go 8 months.

Also to add to the mix, I had a McTimoney Chiropractor out to my previous horse that had CVM/Wobblers Syndrome and even in the latter stages of the disease when he was whipping his outside leg out sharply and unable to cross the other leg behind on a tight circle in hand the chiro lady still did not think he had wobblers, in fact I remember her quite haughtily telling me that I was completely wrong with my assumption. This was two months before he was PTS. I had her out twice in total in a desperate attempt to find out what was wrong. Sadly although we listen to these people we cannot rely on them 100% of the time, as my case and doubtless others would testify to. I know its wrong but still. Sacro illiac problems can cause reluctance to go forwards in the school but then so can a multitude of other reasons. You are right that KS can cause back problems, and horses over compensate all over the place, so a horse with multiple issues is usually suffering from one main issue, with a lot of contributory associated problems.

See what your vet can find out.


I'd ask your vet for a lameness workup so he can see for himself what is wrong. You sound like you have done everything in your power to ensure your horse is as comfortable as you can but I would tend to go with my vet tbh.
 
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He was treated just under two months ago. Never saw a difference in it what so ever. Vet used cortisone HA mix. Yard manager thinks he may have an underlying issue as to why they haven't worked and he is still in pain from a different area. I'm hoping its a case of the injections not proven effective but I'm so unsure. He is due to have L/e put on backs so be interesting to see if shoes make a difference. He is perfect in hand to the point he won a show last weekend!! Just as soon as he is ridden in school on bends In particular, the problems come out.
 
AbboGirl97 said:
He was treated just under two months ago. Never saw a difference in it what so ever. Vet used cortisone HA mix. Yard manager thinks he may have an underlying issue as to why they haven't worked and he is still in pain from a different area. I'm hoping its a case of the injections not proven effective but I'm so unsure. He is due to have L/e put on backs so be interesting to see if shoes make a difference. He is perfect in hand to the point he won a show last weekend!! Just as soon as he is ridden in school on bends In particular, the problems come out.
Click to expand...

My horse had lateral extensions on too, they did make a difference.

My horse used to clip his toes if he was trotted in hand/ridden on a hard surface, and still does to a point. If it was only two months ago that he had the injections then I can easily see it being another unrelated problem. I am sure it will be easy to sort out, you just need to get to the bottom of it- and that's the hard part.
 
My horse had kissing spine surgery last week so I just thought I would give you my experience incase it helps.

I had owned my mare for 1 1/2 years, we had always assumed she was cold backed (whatever that means!) she was fine to groom, and palpate down the spine, excellent in hand, never grumpy, sad or sorry. Very occassionally she would rush off when mounted, she was very sensitive to the leg, was known to have her 'moments' when she would be a complete grot to ride, tail swishing and head tossing, would shoot forward and then refuse to move. She would also block her back when tacked up, which I was advised was probably due to her being badly backed in Ireland. She was 5 when I bought her and there was no pattern that we could see to this behaviour and her 'moments' would be months apart. She had me off a few times in quite a spectacular fashion but again we put these issues down to age and fitness. There seemed to be explanations for all these issues individually, but we werent looking at the overall picture.
I actually put her up for sale at one point as i felt I had completely over horsed myself, that it wasnt her it was me.
Luckily she didnt sell and I took her back to start from the beginning. She had been back in work for about 2 months until she had a complete meltdown, infront of my saddler with my instructor on board. I instantly knew it was pain.
After a long (and very stressful) couple of weeks where she was xrayed, bone scanned and operated on I can finally begin to relax. She came home on Wednesday.

Obviously I feel awful that this wasnt discovered sooner, however, she regularly had the saddler, physio, farrier bla bla bla and no one spotted a thing. And in fairness to them and myself, the vet that performed the work up pre bone scan said that unless she had seen the xrays, she wouldnt have beleived there was anything wrong with the horse.
I went to the ends of the earth to try and make things work with her before I realised what was wrong. In desperation I even had a communicator out to see her!

I am not by any means suggesting that your horse has kissing spines, but if there is any small doubt something may be up get it checked! I know you have said that the vet is due to come and see your horse but I really would push for full investigations. I did, and thanks to a wonderful attending vet and the amazing team at RVC we are (hopefully) on the road to recovery!
 
Sounds like there is something wrong, the best thing you can do is get the horse booked in for a work up at your vets. Make sure it's a proper hospital, not just the local vet that doesn't have much in the way of diagnostics. My preference in a case such as this is going straight to the largest/best equine vet near you, then if more tests are needed (ie bone scan) it's there ready and waiting, and the vet has already seen the horse, rather than paying out for more examination fees. I have also found that the larger practises tend to have more powerful/better x ray machines etc, or if an ultrasound is needed, you won't be told to go away and come back because the machine is being used elsewhere that day.

He could have KS, but it could be a whole host of other stuff as well, could even be ulcers.
 
Tattygaremare hope it's all a positive outcome for you both. It sounds like it will be :) im not insured for any back problems due to my insurance excluding them when bone spavin came into the equation! (Currently under a dispute) so unfortunately I can't go giving bone scans without saving first as our nearest vet that is a big equine hospital is very expensive! I am thinking about moving to a different one in Surrey. I really hope it isn't ks. He is fine out hacking doesn't buck in trot or have ears back but it is long straight lines! He does still pulled down on reins very hard though. I just don't know. He has had various other problems so has exclusions left right and centre on insurance!
 
Some horses explode with on X1 impingement other have multiple and are u reactive whilst some only have a problem under saddle,depends on the horse. I would check for KS,SI issues,PSD, hocks and ulcers as symptoms are very similar, voice of experience mine had all of the above systematically diagnoised and treated ( not uncommon of KS horses to have compensatory problems) my mare was not what I would call reactive just reluctant bless her .
 
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