Help me sis Munners with her confidence worry over hacking out!

Sorry if I didnt wrap up what I said nicely enough for you all but the simple fact is that the only way to overcome somthing like this is to get out there and do it and if your riding skills arent up to it you need lessons. I have seen so many people who make every excuse under the sun not to hack out and they dont get better ,they get worse ,because they dont face the problem. And just because one can ride ,even to a good standard in a school ,doesnt mean that they know how to handle a horse out hacking.Being sympathetic is not the point.Sure I understand ,but that doesnt change the solution one bit.
 
Mike007 said:
Sorry if I didnt wrap up what I said nicely enough for you all but the simple fact is that the only way to overcome somthing like this is to get out there and do it and if your riding skills arent up to it you need lessons. I have seen so many people who make every excuse under the sun not to hack out and they dont get better ,they get worse ,because they dont face the problem. And just because one can ride ,even to a good standard in a school ,doesnt mean that they know how to handle a horse out hacking.Being sympathetic is not the point.Sure I understand ,but that doesnt change the solution one bit.
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IMO riding skills just don't come into the equation - you can be (or may have been) the most competent, riding anything, daredevil rider on God's earth - if you loose your nerve for whatever reason - skill, and past bravado just don't come into play.;)

I do agree that the more you do persevere the better it gets - but just bunging some quivering wreck on a horse and saying - go on go out there and you'll feel better is a complete joke!

Every word of your response does rather suggest you haven't yet been unlucky enough to suffer a crisis of confidence....if you live long enough, and ride a huge variety of horse, sooner or later you will.....oh yes indeedy you surely will....and I think you answer to this thread might be very different to be honest.

But then maybe you always ensure you ride within your own comfort zone and never risk yourself on anything less than a schoolmaster? That is another topic altogether I think.:p
 
Mike007 said:
Sorry if I didnt wrap up what I said nicely enough for you all but the simple fact is that the only way to overcome somthing like this is to get out there and do it and if your riding skills arent up to it you need lessons. I have seen so many people who make every excuse under the sun not to hack out and they dont get better ,they get worse ,because they dont face the problem. And just because one can ride ,even to a good standard in a school ,doesnt mean that they know how to handle a horse out hacking.Being sympathetic is not the point.Sure I understand ,but that doesnt change the solution one bit.
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I guess you are an expert then are you? Seeing as you don't seem to be afraid of anything, and everyone who has an issue needs lessons?

Sorry, I don't buy that at all.

The thing that is wrong with humans, Mike...is that we were given feelings, not that we really want them, it would be great to be stoic like a Vulcan off Star Trek, but it is not to be.

The problem is being faced. The situation is being dealt with, the SPEED of which it is being dealt with, is entirely down to how Munners feels about it.

Your comments I am afraid, hold no value whichever way you put them, there is NOT a quick-fix solution, whatever way you look at it.

As for 'not wrapping it up' how we wanted it, there is a difference between being able to advise in a diplomatic way, and being blunt and basically showing little compassion.

The question was asked, for stories of people who have faced similar things.

If you have not faced it, why are you posting in such a thread, and if you DID face such problems, why not share WHAT you did to get over it, rather than appearing this as this 'hard-nosed-nowt-bothers-me' attitude?
 
Kind of agree with mike here - for various reasons, mainly by confidence skydiving over a rubbish winter - i havent hacked my boy out for a long time. Gone ion school yes, done lessons yes but actually goign out no
Tonight i got ona nd went out wiht a freind walking beside me, of course my boy was scared and spooky - but my friend put leads rope on and talked us through it
Next time (tomorrow) will be better
You have to get on and do it, but with peopel helping - we didnt go far tonight - tomorrow will be further
I hated it, horse hated it - but i know we need ot and can do it with help - you sound a brill sister
Walk with her first few times on a lead rope, when she feels ready - walk beside her without then drop behind while they go up a lane a bit
Get your sister to walk her horse out with a bridle on - good luck - i so know how your sister feels but tbh the only way to deal wiht it is to get on and do it x
 
Mikes idea of 'flooding' a person with the object of their fears is somewhat outdated and rarely used for dealing with confidence issues. The method of gradual exposure is far more favoured and supported by research (which I will post if needed). The amount of adrenalin and noradrenaline produced by over exposure to the source of the fear can often increase the length of time it takes to recover.
 
YorksG said:
Mikes idea of 'flooding' a person with the object of their fears is somewhat outdated and rarely used for dealing with confidence issues. The method of gradual exposure is far more favoured and supported by research (which I will post if needed). The amount of adrenalin and noradrenaline produced by over exposure to the source of the fear can often increase the length of time it takes to recover.
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Please do post it! I would be grateful.

:)
 
Mike007 said:
Sorry if I didnt wrap up what I said nicely enough for you all but the simple fact is that the only way to overcome somthing like this is to get out there and do it and if your riding skills arent up to it you need lessons. I have seen so many people who make every excuse under the sun not to hack out and they dont get better ,they get worse ,because they dont face the problem. And just because one can ride ,even to a good standard in a school ,doesnt mean that they know how to handle a horse out hacking.Being sympathetic is not the point.Sure I understand ,but that doesnt change the solution one bit.
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In most case's (definatly in mine) it is not a case of bad riding skills, confidence starts or ends in your own head.
If you have had a bad fall, or your horse has bolted, you think the next time you ride it wil happen again,.
It's there in the back of your mind the whole time, so you start to tense up, then the horse tenses up, you feel the horse doing this and you tense even more, horse starts playing up, and you automaticaly think "oh god, i'm going to fall off again!!
Learning to relaxe starts with the mind, having a good experience, (a nice quiet uneventfull walk up the road) makes you want to do it again, building up convidence takes time.
Everyone is different and some will take longer than others to regain their confidence, there is no one solution for all.
And just for the record, i don't have a school, if i want to ride, i have to hack or ride in the field, i could use my friends school, but have to hack to get to it.
 
One of the key reasons people get afraid is because they lack the belief that they can handle any situation that arises .The solution is both knowlege and actualy doing the thing. Hacking out isnt as simple as it sounds . How to ride in traffic, how to avoid getting carted how to handle napping etc etc. None of this is learned in a school but it certainly can be taught. Some of us were fortunate enough to learn to ride when there were very few outdoor schools and so riding lessons started with a leadrein ride and progressed. It didnt encourage elegant riding but was good at making one an effective rider.And for what its worth ,I have spent a great deal of time with a number of people with this problem and the only way forward is for them to get out there and do it.
 
Mike007 said:
One of the key reasons people get afraid is because they lack the belief that they can handle any situation that arises .The solution is both knowlege and actualy doing the thing. Hacking out isnt as simple as it sounds . How to ride in traffic, how to avoid getting carted how to handle napping etc etc. None of this is learned in a school but it certainly can be taught. Some of us were fortunate enough to learn to ride when there were very few outdoor schools and so riding lessons started with a leadrein ride and progressed. It didnt encourage elegant riding but was good at making one an effective rider.And for what its worth ,I have spent a great deal of time with a number of people with this problem and the only way forward is for them to get out there and do it.
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Glad it worked for you. I used to teach years ago, and building up is what I found to be the most successful.

Forcing the issue did NOT work, clients would be in tears if you tried to make them do anything they couldn't cope with, a little at a time is what works well.
 
DragonSlayer said:
Glad it worked for you. I used to teach years ago, and building up is what I found to be the most successful.

Forcing the issue did NOT work, clients would be in tears if you tried to make them do anything they couldn't cope with, a little at a time is what works well.
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Where in all of this thread did I say that one shouldnt build up,of course one does ,but you have to start somewhere and that means getting on the horse and going out the gate even if only for five minutes.
 
I havnt read all the replies (sorry!) but really badly lost my confidence hacking out my horse after he panic bolted (and yes a "real" bolt didnt stop until he ran into a wall - through fields down roads etc no control at all its like i wasnt there) two weeks after I bought him. He only ever did it once but it was enough to slowly eat down my confidence to the point where I couldnt even leave the school/get on him without panicing. I overcame it by really gradually leaving the yard with incredibly safe horses - I would walk just down the lane and back (someone on the floor someone hacking a horse) and then just slowly pushed myself as I felt comfortable to do more. As it goes horse is a superstar now and is probably the safest horse on the yard to hack - I let 13ye old girls hack him out and I hack everywhere! Prefer it over the school. So I do think little and often with company is best until you and he/she know the area well enough and fancy short ventures out on their own :)
 
Mike007 said:
Where in all of this thread did I say that one shouldnt build up,of course one does ,but you have to start somewhere and that means getting on the horse and going out the gate even if only for five minutes.
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but you have to start somewhere and that means getting on the horse and going out the gate even if only for five minutes.[/QUOTE]

Sorry but that sounds exactly like a complete back track to me!:confused: Isn't that what we have for the most part been suggesting - and wasn't it you who stated, in so many words, that this isnt the way to do it?

'Even if it is only 5 minutes' hardly ties in with your first comment I have to say - and cant recall OP saying her sister flatly refuses to even get on her horse?:rolleyes:
 
Mike007 said:
One of the key reasons people get afraid is because they lack the belief that they can handle any situation that arises .The solution is both knowlege and actualy doing the thing. Hacking out isnt as simple as it sounds . How to ride in traffic, how to avoid getting carted how to handle napping etc etc. None of this is learned in a school but it certainly can be taught. Some of us were fortunate enough to learn to ride when there were very few outdoor schools and so riding lessons started with a leadrein ride and progressed. It didnt encourage elegant riding but was good at making one an effective rider.And for what its worth ,I have spent a great deal of time with a number of people with this problem and the only way forward is for them to get out there and do it.
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This is how i started out, with a few lessons in the school as well.
If someone now came to me, and dictated how, when where and how fast, i would'nt have progressed as i have.
I am lucky in the fact that the girl who rides out with me once a week, is more than happy for me to dictate what we do and where we go and at what speed.
She could'nt come out with me today, so i rode up the road and back on my own. That is progress!!!!!!
 
grumpyoldmare said:
Sorry but that sounds exactly like a complete back track to me!:confused: Isn't that what we have for the most part been suggesting - and wasn't it you who stated, in so many words, that this isnt the way to do it?

'Even if it is only 5 minutes' hardly ties in with your first comment I have to say - and cant recall OP saying her sister flatly refuses to even get on her horse?:rolleyes:
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I decided to wait to see if someone else posted on this before I did....! :D

Munners is doing GREAT with lessons, I have posted pics elsewhere, she is jumping and doing all sorts of fancy stuff and enjoying it....it is the hacking she is having issues with...

I have not said she has NOT hacked her out....she has done with me....BUT she starts to feel awful before she goes, so I tell her to take mine, then another time, she will take her own again...but wants to get to the point she can go out alone.

I asked for similar stories so she wouldn't feel she was alone in this....as I know MANY have confidence issues like this.

It's been great to share stories, I know me and munners are very grateful to hear them, and also some good tips to try in the future.
 
Fii said:
This is how i started out, with a few lessons in the school as well.
If someone now came to me, and dictated how, when where and how fast, i would'nt have progressed as i have.
I am lucky in the fact that the girl who rides out with me once a week, is more than happy for me to dictate what we do and where we go and at what speed.
She could'nt come out with me today, so i rode up the road and back on my own. That is progress!!!!!!
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Brilliant. :D
 
grumpyoldmare said:
but you have to start somewhere and that means getting on the horse and going out the gate even if only for five minutes.
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Sorry but that sounds exactly like a complete back track to me!:confused: Isn't that what we have for the most part been suggesting - and wasn't it you who stated, in so many words, that this isnt the way to do it?

'Even if it is only 5 minutes' hardly ties in with your first comment I have to say - and cant recall OP saying her sister flatly refuses to even get on her horse?:rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

I am not quite sure how you think it is a backtrack from"The only way she will overcome a confidence issue is by going out there and doing it and finding it is ok. "And as for stating inso many words that this isnt the way to do it . I think you are just choosing to read your own interpretation.
 
Will post the research and referances tomorrow, as they are at work.
I too think that the second post is a backtrack, posted perhaps by someone who has less immagination than Munners and therefore has less reason to think of the what ifs.
 
Mike007 said:
Exactly how old is this person ? If 12 I can understand it but otherwise either they need a hell of a lot more lessons or should get out there and hack. The only way she will overcome a confidence issue is by going out there and doing it and finding it is ok.
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This ^^^^ comes across as, if you are not a child, then the reason for confidence issue's is you can't ride well anough, so either take lessons to ride better, or just get on with it.
Wi'll i am not into "sugar coating" stuff, if you don't understand the fear behind loosing confidence, you aren't the best person to help conquer that fear!
 
I know how she feels. I lost a lot of confidence with a previous young horse who used to rear when spooked.

My new gentle giant I have had since September, he was only 4 when I purchased him last year and had hacked out lightly but never on his own. I needed to teach him to ride out alone. I spent the winter hacking with someone else and riding him in the school. I have now started taking him down the road on his own and his first couple of times out whinnied all the way but now he is a star and plods along quite nicely.

Take your time - there is no rush - do it when you are ready not when others think you are! If she is really nervous for the first couple of times have someone walking with you just so you know someone is there for you.
 
Agree with so many of the previous posts that confidence can be lost so easily. I used to think nothing of taking either a strange horse or my own TB out across the downs for hours, no phone, no-one knew where I was, bred & broke in my ISH, taught my 3 kids to ride etc. etc. Returning to serious riding had a horse do a complete bronc with me when I was trying it and went flying, managed to buy myself a real ****bag who spun, bucked & sent me flying again. Now confidence comes and goes, but when I have a good ride I feel on a real high and that's what I try to concentrate on - that sheer love of being on a horse that I've had since childhood (and try very hard not to think of the "what ifs" that now plague me as a grown up!
 
DragonSlayer said:
Me sis is worried about hacking out her new horse, because she is still in the process of getting to know her.

I have posted updates etc and piccies, and you have seen how well they are getting along in the school and general groundwork.

Like many new owners, the 'experts' out there (friends etc) are getting a bit heavy in 'you MUST get out hacking blah blah blah.....'....

Firstly, Munners has only ever hacked out alone twice before, so it's a big thing, and it's been on my mare, who she now knows and trusts to bring her home.

And secondly, being a new horse owner, I think it takes time to develop the 'cloth ears' to ignore the bull**** others spout when they think they 'know it all'....shes ready to tell them to take a running jump any day now...

So we have decided to 'share' the neddies, I certainly don't mind riding her new neddie out, she is lovely, and sis will ride my mare out. We are going to share them at camp this summer too, if sis is feeling rocky, she will hop on my donkey (who I think is fizzier than munners' ned!) and I'll take hers.

So to cheer her up, can we have some stories about loosing confidence with your horses? Anyone who has taken time to hack out etc etc etc?

Ta very muchly!

:D
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i to hate hacking alone!

but, my way of thinking is (a little backward I know) my friend has broken her back twice both in arenas and I dont know anyone who has had an extreme injury hacking so I try and kid myself thay hacking must be safer!

I am a strange one!!!
 
I have very little confidence after being put in hospital by my first horse, he was a git. But I now have the confidence to ride out on my own with my boy I've had for 6 years. It took a long time to get here but I jump now too which I never thought I'd do. Just go at your own pace ignore other people if they try to pressurise you. If you go to fast sometimes it can put you back. You'll get there with the support of such a lovely sister xxx
 
This is a great thread and has helped me too! I'm not suffering from a confidence crisis yet but I do feel I'm on a knife edge and the stuff about other people thinking they know better rings true.

I bought my boy, just turned 6, in March. I knew he was a nervous horse and needed time and confident riding and that was all fine. We hacked out in company, including cantering up front, schooled and I took him to a local showground practise night to get him used to other horses flying about. I did fall off that day but it was my own fault so it didn't worry me.

But then my friend rode him out for me one day, with me on my mare and another friend, and he bolted with her. She pulled him up but he was so wound up about something that the only safe thing to do was get off. We don't know what set him off and that's the killer. He'd never done that with me (other than when I fell off but I knew what triggered that).

So then I had people telling me he was dangerous and unpredictable and expressing concern about riding out with me (I'd never ask anyone to come out with us if I thought his behaviour might knock THEIR confidence but it still got to me that everyone else distrusted him so much after ONE incident having previously hacked out with us loads of times without incident). And this made me question my ability to work with him. I've not been riding him as much since (in part because he's booked for a back check this weekend so keeping it light for now). But I have been doing a lot of groundwork with him - lunging, trying to help him get over his mortal fear of all things plastic and I do think it's paying off in terms of bulding his trust in me and mine in him. But my OH, YO and the friend he bolted with have supported me and that's all I need - I knew he would be a challenge and that was what I wanted. I have my mare who is "easy" (it's all relative, lol) so I can have fun with her to keep my confidence up for working with my new boy.

So long as you have one person who knows you and the situation and who supports and encourages you without making you feel pressured then you'll be fine. I think it's lovely that as sisters you are so understanding :D

Bit of a long one that, sorry.
 
Thanks Fii!!

Mike, I have a private lesson every week, and have gone from not wanting to get on my horse to jumping and lots of 'stressage'!! My instructor is fabulous as is my sister!! My sis simply wanted me to hear other peoples stories of why they lack confidence so that I would maybe feel a little better and not think that it was just me!! I am very capable of hacking out if I wasnt I wouldnt ride my sisters horse out on my own.....I have only had my horse 3 months and after my awful experience I am nervous as to how far she will go when she does/dosent want to do something. My sis is very kindly putting her through her paces out in the open to show me what she is like. My confidence will come in time and in a years time I hope I will be wondering what the fuss was all about. Why you feel the need to be rude and argumentative I have no idea....poor you :)
 
Munners said:
Thanks Fii!!

Mike, I have a private lesson every week, and have gone from not wanting to get on my horse to jumping and lots of 'stressage'!! My instructor is fabulous as is my sister!! My sis simply wanted me to hear other peoples stories of why they lack confidence so that I would maybe feel a little better and not think that it was just me!! I am very capable of hacking out if I wasnt I wouldnt ride my sisters horse out on my own.....I have only had my horse 3 months and after my awful experience I am nervous as to how far she will go when she does/dosent want to do something. My sis is very kindly putting her through her paces out in the open to show me what she is like. My confidence will come in time and in a years time I hope I will be wondering what the fuss was all about. Why you feel the need to be rude and argumentative I have no idea....poor you :)
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~snorts!~
 
I think Mike have just read "Feel the Fear and Do It :Anyway":D

I think if anyone has lost their confidence ridiculing their lack of progress is going to undermine it further. We are all different and as such move at different speeds, this isnt wrong just our individuality.

Your sister had a horrible experience and the fact she is riding again is testament to her courage, she should keep it up and do what ever makes her comfortable at her own pace.
 
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