Help needed horse issues

horse_lover

horse_lover

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I am after some advice. I bought a 4yr old TB back in January, he was under weight, riddled with lice and legs that were full scabs from knee and hock down. He has piled the weight on, we started lunging and long reining and then starting on the schooling and hacking. Schooling was going well, hacking not so great. Alone he would nap by rearing, spinning and running backwards, we have now mastered this and he hacks out happily. My main issue now is schooling we have taken about a hundred paces backwards. He walks around happily, but as soon as you ask for trot he just takes off, head and neck out stretched and is very difficult to pull up, he has more recently started rearing :( Since I bought him he has always been difficult to tack up and often puts his ears flat back and pulls faces, but he has got worse. Now even running a brush over him he tries to bite and lashes out with his back legs. He has had a brand new saddle, professionally fitted, I have had 2 different back people out and he seems no better. One didnt find anything the other one said he was a little sore though his back, probably because he has no topline and was struggling, she suggested working him in a training aid on the lunge, which I started tonight, but does anyone have any suggestions of what I can do next?
 
He does sound uncomfortable,when you say he has been seen by a back person what type of back person have you used?
Did they treat him and give you exercises to do?
 
be positive said:
He does sound uncomfortable,when you say he has been seen by a back person what type of back person have you used?
Did they treat him and give you exercises to do?
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He isnt a happy horse at the mo and its horrible to see him like it. I want to sort out whatever is wrong I just dont know what to do next. When I first got him his pelvis was out so I called out someone on recommendation that does McTimoney animal manipulation, he was seen a couple of times. When he started being naughty, I called her out again, but she can't see anything wrong. I then had someone out that deals in sports massage, she had treated my older horse with very good results. It was my sports massage lady that said he was sore along his back and the muscle just behind his shoulder. I have just been given normal neck stretches to do with him and front legs
 
Ginger Bear said:
was he an ex-racer?? if so due to being backed & worked young they can suffer from a kissing spine..
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He was broken as a 2yr old for racing, but never actually ran a race. I dont think he could have been at the racing yard for too long. A friend mentioned that an ex racer she knew was diagnosed with kissing spine, I did wonder, but didnt want to panic myself :(
 
If he is sore in his back muscles,massage will not do much except make him feel a little more comfortable for a short while.
I would get a qualified physio to treat him,they will need vets permission,but the vet will usually ok this without any problem.
A physio will give a much deeper and more effective treatment and will usually do 2 or 3 within a month to really make a difference.They will also give you things to work on and send proper reports to your vet.
 
as above, get an osteo or a physio out. also agree that it could possibly be ulcers and that's why he's so touchy. have his teeth been checked as well?
 
Hi

I just read the post and thought it was great that you seem to have done good groundwork with him. From my experience long reining was the most fantastic thing to help my horse (who has had KS op and is doing brilliantly so don't panic on that one too much yet!).

I just wondered if he runs away in trot on the long reins so that you could put it down to the weight of a rider or not? I have found with some of the horses that I have done groundwork with, that a little soreness can result in pushing their luck with their behaviour both ridden and on the ground and then it becomes a bit of a learned habit if they manage to get away with it. Perhaps doing a couple of weeks of long reining could help and will give you some control back. If he is a bit sore then to get a good long low stretch pop the long reins through the bit and onto the d ring on the girth area on the roller. That way you get a good stretch but the horse has the flexibility to take a bit more rein if you feel he needs it, as you are in control of the contact, it also help stop him if he tries to tank off or rear. I find that is better than a gadget that fixes them into position as they don't feel trapped and fight it so much. With the ridden work you can then also use your voice to settle him as he is used to your commands from the ground.

I hope this helps, my boy can be very awkward and it is a constant battle trying to decide if he is just being stroppy or whether he is in pain and the above always helps me decide as I can watch how he is going. If I think he is sore, I get him checked by a good chiropractor who can do deep massage aswell, mine uses an equissage to help with this.
 
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If you think your horse is in pain, get your vet out and get a properly qualified, trained physiotherapist, some of these "alternative" therapists are not worth having out.
 
Sorry dont have any advice for you, but wondering how you cured his hacking? I am very interested as my horse is the about the same age and rears and runs backwards when trying to make him hack. Thanks
 
Get the vet out, saddler, dentist, physio.
Once they are ruled out have you tried just dropping the reins when he does it. With an ex racer if you try to pull him up he will get worse.
 
Is it just ridden that he takes off, or on the lunge too? If the former, might the saddle still be a problem?

Maybe look at his diet, too. It could be that he is hypersensitive due to an intolerance of something in his feed. Some horses are intolerant to oats for example, or alfalfa.
 
Sorry if this has already been suggested but is it worth having his saddle checked again? You said he has put weight on and he is likely to have changed shape too, could be the new saddle is now pinching somewhere and this is showing up more in a school with corners than out on a hack. Just a thought!
 
If you are confident that all the pain issues are sorted I would just give him a rest.

Turn him out for a while and see if he will forget some of the issues. Then start again slowly with basic handling, grooming etc. The move onto working him with a training aid before riding. Dont move on until you have each issue sorted.

Its what people used to do in the old days, a month chilling in the field can be worth more than fighting a loosing battle day after day.
 
The fact that he has 'piled weight on' since you got him is ringing alarm bells for me as this is very similar to my mare (who was also bought as a 4 yr old) and had been fed up quickly by the person I bought her from after a period of neglect.
As well as all the other checks, I'd look at his diet.
My WelshDxTB mare was super sensitive to cereals/sugar. At first she was just sensitive to grooming/tacking up then her behaviour became more and more erratic and dangerous.
In order to work out whether there is a problem and which food it is, you would need to cut out all feed except grass/hay for about a month, then gradually add the different ingredients and monitor the behaviour carefully.
 
I too have an ex-racehorse & would agree with other people's points about ulcers & getting the physio out. I would also really recommend calling the ROR helpline or calling a TB rehab centre such as the TRC. I found their help and advice invaluable when I was getting my mare right. As regards the rearing, in my experience, this is a very common reaction to discomfort in TBs. My mare is a terror for it, she also rears to nap.
 
I agree with all the above about looking into his feed, health, back, teeth ect but if everything comes back ok then it is likely to be a behavioural issue. With the tacking up mine got difficult for a while, even with rugs the more I tried to be slow quite ect the more he acted up, when I gave him a little smack and just got the job done he packed it in.
As for the schooling I would go back to ground work for a while and see how he reacts, maybe progress to having someone on him while you lunge and judge how he reacts. It is possible this is his new trick seeing that he has already tried the rear nap technique and failed. Try the rehabilitation centres I am sure they will have had experience with that type of issue. And best of luck
 
Can I ask a simple question, why did you buy such a horse?
Not being sarcastic, but it looked like a lot of trouble to begin with, and after all you do this for pleasure.
If I were in your position I would turn it away for a six months.
 
You bought him underweight and poor, now he is healthy and well fed - his true character may be comming out, which essentialy may not be very nice.

However, as BigRed has said - if your horse is displaying symptoms of pain then you start with the vet, and go from there.
 
Wow so many responses, this is going to be a long reply. With regards to physio, I will have a look at getting Jenny Hadland out who has looked at my other horse. Both back people I have had so far have sent full reports to my vets at their findings so my vet should have a very good idea what he has had done. His teeth were done before I bought him in Dec of last year, I had my vet check him over when I got him in Jan so I know everything is fine there. BethH I done loads of ground work for about the first 2/3 months when I had him as didnt want to ride because he was underweight, but I must admit apart from lunging once a week/fortnight I haven't long reined so something I will definately start doing again thank you. Fransurrey I lunged him Monday evening and he did have moments where he tried taking off, but did settle after a few minutes. With regards to feed all he gets is a handful of mollichaff in the evenings so I can give him his supplements (fly free and biotin), he has nothing else as seems to manage off fresh air :) When I got him he was on Alfa-A-Oil and conditioning cubes, but due to a skin reaction to the Alfa-A-Oil he went to mollichaff and conditioning cubes. For the last 3/4mths he has just been on mollichaff. I am happy for any further advice on feeding though as so much on the market its all a bit confusing.

I have been calling the saddle fitter on a weekly basis to chase up a second visit, which I was owed about 6wks ago so fingers crossed he will pull his finger out very soon. I am not entirely happy to be told you get a particular service, when paying £1,300 on a new saddle and it doesnt happen. I have been monitoring him on a flexi curve (I know its not entirely accurate), but although he put some weight on and filled out a little in June, he seems to be back to a similar shape that he was in May when the saddle was fitted. It is something that I am pushing.

Thanks Rockysmum, I have decided until saddle is checked I dont really want to ride him as dont want to make things worse so will definately give him some time off, with the odd lunging session just to see how he is going.

Pearlasinger, I was probably wrong with the expression piled the weight on. He wasnt fed too quickly, it was all done through recommendation of my vet, who was out a few days after I bought him. From when I first got him to now he has filled out, to in my opinion how he should be. It took quite a few weeks to get the weight on him properly.

Thanks Jellycat I hadnt even thought about phoning them for advice, but that sounds like a way forward, always helps to get others advice :)

MrsD123 not sure what you mean by 'such a horse'? Do you mean a TB that was underweight, scabby legs and riddled with lice? If its the TB thing, I already own one TB so was not by any means going in blind folded. He was the way he was because the people before had no knowledge. It was not his fault he was wintered out with very little grass,no hay and a bag of bluechip, which lasted the owners 4mths! His legs are scarred because they put bandages on too tight causing compression bandage wounds, just before I arrived they had picked a scab off so I got to see 3 inches of proud flesh. Would you have left him there that day?

Thanks again for all your advice, I am going to give him time off of any ridden work until I can get the saddler back out. If the saddle is fine, I will call my vet and talk through everything with her, she what she suggests and also get the physio out.
 
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