Help needed - vet and me perplexed

orionstar

orionstar

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17h rising 5 yr old wbx. 2 weeks ago going disunited in canter, got backman out who said it was trapped sciatic nerve, did some manupulation, told me to leave a couple of days then lunge and bring back into work. Lunged fine during the week, took on a long walking hack on saturday, then schooled on Sunday. After 10 minutes of sound walk and trot work she started to try and break into canter, then turned into rodeo horse. Got vet out to do full lameness work out. She's dipping her hinquarters on the left (slightly on hard, more on soft ground), but will happily negoatiate raised poles at different angles. Flexion test on left leg inconclusive, tried to kill the vet when he attempted to pick up right one (even when under sedation), no reaction when spine and neck checked. Put on anti inflamatory/painkillers but she's still lashing out when attempting to pick up right leg. She's now spreading her legs, standing almost on tip toe and hunching her back when defecating. Spoke to vet and he said it sounds like a back problem, and he's coming back when the medication has kicked in fully. Any one had any experience of these symptoms. She's my pride and joy and I'm very worried.
 
I would be getting her referred or a second opinion. sounds like a back injury, would be particularly concerned about the deterioration in symptoms
 
Years ago I knew a pony that used to periodically 'pop' her hip joint. Not literally out of the socket but certainly slightly out of alignment. she used to present with very similar symptoms. She was quite old though and I think it was due to arthritic changes around the hip joint.
I hope you get to the bottom of it. I'm currently in a perplexing situation with my boy too. Wish I spoke horse!
 
Right side sacroiliac strain caused a left side hip dip and right leg pain on manipulation in my horse. I know from experience it can be very difficult to diagnose. In my horse's case it was not obvious what was wrong with him until the right side tuber sacrale became higher than the left side, which took four months from the original lameness (which was in a FRONT leg!), by which time he was also sound and remained sound eventing until he got spavins three years later.
 
SusieT said:
I would be getting her referred or a second opinion. sounds like a back injury, would be particularly concerned about the deterioration in symptoms
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Not sure you need a second opinion :confused: just a referrel to horspital for full work up and MRI scan.
 
Have you just had one treatment from 'the backman'? If so, would look at getting a follow up - one treatment does not cure all, or create a strong back/pelvis. As long as the vet is happy go with this. Is there any asymmetrical sweating and are there changes in bowel/bladder movments?
 
emmachiro said:
Have you just had one treatment from 'the backman'? If so, would look at getting a follow up - one treatment does not cure all, or create a strong back/pelvis. As long as the vet is happy go with this. Is there any asymmetrical sweating and are there changes in bowel/bladder movments?
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This is a physically immature, 17hh 5 year old warm blood, with plenty of maturing yet to do. I wouldn't let anyone other than a medical professional anywhere near it until a proper diagnosis had been found.

Good luck OP - let us know how you get on.
 
I had a lame horse who would not let me touch his r hind last week. took him in for full investigation and managed to lift RH (with difficulty). Diagnosis was hock spavin. Your guy would obviously be young for this but OCD in any hindlimb joint or back injury as suggested above is definitely a possibility. Needs to go into the hospital for full work up and nerve blocks. MRI could not be justified to insurance company at this stage.
 
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Thanks for all the replies, and yes, this is more than just a "back man" problem, which is why i've called the vet. She's still kicking violently when trying to pick her right hind up, and still spreading legs to poo, and I've updated vet today (wont be asking for a second oppinion as he's a bloody good vet). He's coming back out at the beginning of next week to see what needs to be done now. It dosent help that she's decided she's rather be back in the field with all her friends and is now box walking and rearing when tied up, but took her for a nearly sedate much of grass this afternoon (vet advised to do this), and she settled nicely into the naughty box (I cant afford to replace anymore hoof imprinted panels in the new stable). The choice next week will be -leave for a few weeks in a small paddock to see if it sorts itself out, or bone scan in Edinburgh. I'm now at panick stage. If she has just nipped a nerve/tweaked something in her back I'll be releived, but my gut reaction is telling me there is something serious going on. Think she's too young for the osteo degeneration of hock or sacroilliac, but I've no idea what a bone scan involves, and i dont have my own transport.
 
The field of her choice is 10 acres, up a steep hill and the water is only accessable by traversing a boggy slope, so the vet does'nt want her to exacerbate anything. Its six and two threes. Although I've never come across a horse that has reacted quite as badly being stabled. She's calm most of the time, but when horses start moving around outside she goes into stress mode. I'll have to mention that normally she's the most laid back, generous, unfazed youngster that I've come across, that will happily hack out on her own and walk past man made monsters that other horses would have a good snort at, so all of this behaviour is wierd but some of it understandable given her herd seperation.
 
I'm absolutely of no use to you advisewise sorry, but just wanted to say that I hope you find the cause soon and that it's not as bad as you might fear.

You have a lovely mare there, so it's all fingers and toes crossed that you'll soon have her back fighting fit and happy again.
 
If you can electric fence her in a smaller paddock with level ground and get water to it. If she is stressing so much in the stable she is likely to do herself more injury.

Hope you get to the bottom of it soon!
 
Hello,

Having learned the hard (and expensive!) way, I would start any perplexing
investigation with good xrays of all four feet. Performance horses can compensate
elsewhere for a long time with sub-optimal foot conformation and at
17hh and not yet mature, it is even more important that those feet are right
for a long-term career.

Good luck -- dene
 
Orionstar said:
she's too young for the osteo degeneration of hock or sacroilliac, but I've no idea what a bone scan involves, and i dont have my own transport.
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She is not too young for sacroiliac strain, which mine got at 5 from sitting down on the road. "sitting down" is a common cause of this injury. Has she done it when ridden or messing in the field that you have seen???
 
amymay said:
This is a physically immature, 17hh 5 year old warm blood, with plenty of maturing yet to do. I wouldn't let anyone other than a medical professional anywhere near it until a proper diagnosis had been found.

Good luck OP - let us know how you get on.
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Hence why I said 'as long as the vet is happy' because no therapist should go anywhere near an animal which is displaying these symptoms without the vet's consent.

Just because the horse is immature, doesn't mean to say that it isn't capable of injuring it's joints. An immature horse which doesn't have stong muscles to protect the joints can be even more susceptible to injuring itself than a mature horse. The sacro iliac joint is so fundamental to movement patterns and function of the rest of the body, that if it is strained, it will be HUGELY painful. If KS is present then one treatment option is to help the biomechanics around the affected area, hence why the backman will help "as long as the vet is happy!"
 
Orionstar said:
but I've no idea what a bone scan involves, and i dont have my own transport.
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If it were me i would go for the bone scan, they are fabulous things! Mine has had one and id have it done again as part of an investigation. Its not cheap at around £1000 for a full body scan. insurance will cover this if you are insured. It involves injecting a radioactive isotope into the horse, the horse will then be given the scan. The isotope injected will show wherever there is inflamation, calased bone ect! The horse is radioactive after the injection so must be isolated for 48 hours afterwards. They usually are admitted for 3 days providing they dont do any further investigation after the scans.

good luck!
 
Update - bone scan done and it's a problem on both hocks. Xrays due on Wednesday, but I'm now thinking OCD. Shouldnt really google stuff like this as I'm now thinking all sorts of awfull things. On the upside, apart from being footsore due to not having any shoes on every so often, she seems to be ambling and trotting around the field normally, and has even forgiven me for the bone scan thing.
 
well atleast your a step closer. mine showed up on hocks on the bone scan to and he has DJD. (dejeneratived joint disease)(bone spavins) in both. not the end of the world, they can be injected and managed. i have decided to let nature take its course and let him come sound in his own time :-)
 
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