Help please - before i give up!

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PaddingtonPony

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Hi all,

sorry for long post in advance. I'm new on here and thanks to everyone reading this, i am on here because i'm hoping for encouragement/experiances/help and tips/someone to tell me i'm crap and to just give up!!

2 and a half years ago i bought a gorgeous 4yr old. and Now..

1. rushing jumps (v. badly and getting a bit dangerous tbh)
2. tenses up through neck esp and back
3. fights contact
4. pulls and drags
5. speeds up/irregular paces
6. evades bit by either overbending, putting head up/down
7.runs away form leg aid (tenses too)
8. INCONSISTANCY - he shows that he can be a potential event horse, or will be a bit of a nut
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teeth back and saddle checked.
snaffle bit. has been tried in dutch gag (too much poll pressure) and waterford and copper roller (doesnt like)

instructors (have lessons regularly):ideas range from over excitement to fear to hot headed nut! all insisted it wasnt my riding and to stick with it. I am a confident rider once in saddle. but now im off horse, all i can come up with is that it must be me right?

Anyway, thanks for reading. Just looknig for exercises, encouragement etc for problems so i can get a plan of action sorted for when bloody snow disappears! in the mean time - any want a horse!?!! :P
 
Will your instructor have a sit on him to see if it is your riding or not, maybe if they can get him going nicer they can give you some more relevant ideas on how to ride differently? If not, then at least you have some reassurance that it's not you.

What's his exercise regime? e.g. how many times a week is he schooled/hacked/jumped etc
 
OK, personally keep up the lessons..BUT I think an instuctor should be helping more in terms of the basics. I wouldn't jump unless you can go over a pole on the ground at your desired speed and control and this is what needs to be worked on if he say he is tense with the leg, as it sounds like he isn't forward going but always rushing big difference, so you need to work on being able to put your leg on him. THAT'S the lesson...Relaxation first. Still work with poles, but poles and no jumps.

Also loose schooling over poles is fun, plus you don't have the burden of the rider. Well anyway, that's an idea from me as an opinion and I am no way any type of expert at all.
 
my friends horse was like this as a 5yr old and she got given the advice to school him round cones and jumps etc mainly in walk until she had the amount of control that she wanted and without him napping and rearing and now we've been hunting and common riding and done some dressage and jumping and he's been to much better
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its all about a routine really when riding do the same thing most days untill it goes right then slowly introducing something else for a short time and going back to what you were doin before as for evading the contact im not to sure maybe just go back to basics for a wee while
 
Is this new behaviour? If yes I would re-check for physical problems, starting with a vet visit and taking it from there.

If this is an on-going schooling issue (to be honest, I would get the vet out anyway just to make sure), then you need to go back to basics. From what you say, in terms of flatwork (sorry I know nothing about jumping!) you need to establish a good rhythm. If his rhythm is inconsistent go back to basics, forget about the outline and just work on establishing a good rhythm.

I would also suggest your instructor have a ride to get a feel of what is going on. I don't know your experience with brining on youngsters, but it's always helpful to have a young horse regularly ridden by a very experienced rider.

Regarding bits, have you tried a different kind of snaffle? I would be reluctant to go for a stronger bit but a different kind of snaffle may suit him more. Many bit shops allow you to buy-to-try so it doesn't cost much to try as many bits as you need to.
 
wow thanks everyone, as i said im new on here and didnt expect so amny people to reply so quickly!

Will definately ask my instructor to sit on him.

I've been back to basics for several months now, it started very well but then he went back to same behaviour. then got him going nicely and then a few days later went back again.

will also try schooling around jumps. i did try that before and it went great, till i went over a tiny raised pole and it was right back to begining.. but will try again - your experiances give me some hope!

Behaviour been going on, on and off, for last year and a half. its only in last 6 months that he has been behaving badly most of the time.

have just found a try before you buy but website which i'll try!

thanks again all, everything very appreciated!
 
My horse was just like you are describing and still would be given half the chance, he is a very reactive horse.
Firstly, I changed the tack, I have him in a drop noseband and alternate between a loose ring rubber snaffle and a KK ultra.
This combination stops the leaning and the evading of the contact.
I then lunged him in this for a couple of weeks really concentrating on keeping the rythm and balance,I only lunge in walk and trot as the canter sets off the tension again. I use low side reins and just tight enough to keep an even contact.
I also used a lunge caveson rather than off the bridle so I didn't interfere with the contact.
Once he was going well on the lunge and stretching across his top line and back I started riding him, I work him a lot in walk to start with, lots of circles, esp 10 m ones to get him to accept the leg and work around the inside leg. He would make you ride with your leg off, hanging on to him in a defensive postion given half the chance so I make sure I get my leg on him, sit up and really ride him into the contact and not grab at him if he runs from the leg, just stay in balance.

I ask him to bend around the inside leg and keep my outside rein then as he allows and lets go I allow both hands forward but still keeping my position to stop him yanking me forward.

I then do the same in trot riding lots of loops and turns but keeping the trot slow so he doesn't worry and become unbalanced, he then lets me put my leg on and start to ride him from leg to hand. Sometimes he still runs from the leg but I just allow him forward then rebalance him and don't react to it.

This is how he would go- tense tense tense:
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From the work I have been doing he has now started to work like this:

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It has taken over a year of consistancy, and if I react to his over reaction by getting uptight with him or getting cross, i pay ofr it for about 2 weeks!
 
I would get second opinions on Teeth, Back and tack. Were teeth done by a vet or EDT? Who checked back and who checked tack?

The type of but to recoment depends very much on the conformation of the horse's mouth but I generally find french links get better results than single jointed bits. have you tried just a french link loose ring? - a nice mild bit and not even worrying about an outline, just get horse going nice and relaxed.

Has horse been involved in an incident - knocked a fence, fallen over, lost rider etc which might have worried him?

Is horse sound? I know it sounds funny but he might be everso slightly lame or bilaterally lame (making it harder to see).

I would seriously think about getting a vet out for a Full MOT - lameness work-up etc just to make sure...
 
You say you had his back checked?
What is it you actually had done to check the back?

Has he had a full mot to rule out other underlying pain/problem/disscomfort.

The behaviours you describe dont sound like naughtiness to me. If he has been honest and willing all this time and has suddenly gone down hill, and nothinghas drastically changed (i.e diet, management) then i would look deeper.

Whats he like loose schooled and on the lunge?

Whats his work load like?
 
sounds like my mare too! and i done the exact same thing as charlie76! it all helped improve her, have to say the lunging was the main thing that really helped with ryhthm and her working in a relaxed manner, everyone saw the improvement. i also worked on lunging over trotting poles and small jumps, she doesnt tend to rush whilst on the lunge now. however its abit of a different story with a rider on top!
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Hi,

I would get 2nd opinion on teeth, back etc and then go straight back to basics. Start with lunging... especially transistion and then work on board doing transisitions, loops, circles, lateral work (to help put your leg on without him rushing) As soon as he does something right, move on to something else. If he is struggling to get something, move on to something else and then go back.
Jumping - grids, grids and more grids!! Start with trot poles between the jump wings and then move to rised trot poles. Do one lesson with only trot poles, then another one with rised poles... don't rush him!! It will be a long and sometimes difficult journey, but it will be worth it!! Good luck!!
 
I have exactly the same problem with my 10 year old ISH!!

I brought him last year thinking he would be fine with a bit of schooling - but he is getting worse!

Interesting comments and advice though, I am thinking I will give him the summer to come right or I will be putting him back on the boat to Ireland - where he came from!!

All of these things are what he does - it explains my horse exactly...except when hunting he also yanks down on his bit - bloody dangerous without a standing martingale on.
Quote:
1. rushing jumps (v. badly and getting a bit dangerous tbh)
2. tenses up through neck esp and back
3. fights contact
4. pulls and drags
5. speeds up/irregular paces
6. evades bit by either overbending, putting head up/down
7.runs away form leg aid (tenses too)
8. INCONSISTANCY - he shows that he can be a potential event horse, or will be a bit of a nut
Quote:

I keep being told to let his head go - release his mouth but what people don't realise is that he is so tense, if I release the contact he ducks his head down, flattens and just gets faster and even more anxious - but out hacking he is lovely and relaxed - just lovely
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Sounds very similar to how my gelding was up until we started having lessons.
Firstly, I swapped him into a full cheek lozenge snaffle with a loose flash - something he could confidently hold in his mouth, without worrying as he would often alternate between grabbing the bit and pulling, and backing right off it. The flash was there as a 'safety net' as he had a habit of trying to rush with his head in the air and mouth open.

Instructor then had me do lots of work with him trying to get him more consistent in the contact & better mannered! Our first few lessons consisted mostly of him going ridiculously fast around the arena, running into walls, and me desperately trying to tell him what to do - he doesn't like being told... We mostly used lots of outside flexion, getting him to listen to the outside rein, and move off my outside leg as he tended to use the inside aids to balance. It turns out half of the things he did were due to his downright awful balance!
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Now we've got some better steering/control we're working more on making his outline more consistent with more transitions & bending, and also lots of stretching to get him to relax through his neck and back which was another major issue. Using each leg + rein alternatively to flex him one way, then the other, until he reaches for the bit & giving him a few more inches of rein until he's on a decent length of rein going forward, then ask him to move to trot & keep flexing him side to side now and then until he stretches more. Can then go up and down the paces keeping him on a long rein.

My instructor also rides him once a week so that she can feel how he progresses and has a better idea of his temperament & way of thinking - I now know it's NOT just me because she has many of the same problems!

It's only taken 3 months to change Danny from a horse I had no desire to ride as it was a losing battle every day, to a horse I find much pleasure in teaching & riding
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So it can change! He's still got a long way to go, but he's now gone from being argumentative and slightly scary, to far more willing & happy. Hope you can find a solution too!
 
I'd consider some lessons with a different instructor.

No critisism of your current one, but different instructors have different techniques and different styles and see different things. A different one may well offer a better insight as they come to the problem with fresh eyes. It is always good to have a lesson with a different instructor once in a while.

I'd leave off the jumping until you have got the flat work a bit better and find an instructor that is into classical dressage as they generally have a good gentle approach.

FWIW I think that whoever said leave his head alone and let go of his mouth is dead right. Horses I know like this are best ridden with very little contact and you slow down by slowing the rhythm.
 
Lots of good advice here. But try also to enjoy your difficult horse . I know how frustrating it can be.But remember,any success you get,you will have earnt!
 
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FWIW I think that whoever said leave his head alone and let go of his mouth is dead right. Horses I know like this are best ridden with very little contact and you slow down by slowing the rhythm.

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I wish I could slow him down without holding on - if you let go - he goes faster and faster and faster
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but out hacking - no problem, I can ride buckle end, he is relaxed,
 
It sound like he is finding the work in the arena difficult so becomes tense and I imagine (as I have been there!) that you get frustrated with him and that indirectly creates more tension.
My method of dealing with this , when he p**s you off, get off, walk him in hand, defuse and get back on again- it really does help!
 
QR - my horse had very similar issues, ended up he had a spavin (osteochondritis) so was unhappy being worked but not lame to the eye.

Might not be relevant, but I'd check with a vet.
 
as well as all the above posts what are you feeding him? is he stabled for a large propotion of time? hay or haylage? (i got one who goes tense rushy etc etc if had 2 days haylage) could you rug him well and put out 24/7 for a couple of weeks to see if he chills out, keep working him tho. good luck, keep persevering!
 
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